Is your faith personal, or is it for everyone else?

That interesting conversation below about how it's important to "defend your faith" to maintain power over others feels so foreign to me. The idea of your faith's purpose to be obtaining or maintaining power over others doesn't sound like faith. It sounds like what several kings and emperors tried to do in the last millennium, and we know how it all ended up for them.

Over the years, we've had many debates about what constitutes faith, and the consensus on all sides has always been that nobody else can define or dispute someone else's faith, because it is specifically something very personal and without proof (if there was proof, it would not be faith). How can something that is both personal and without proof be simultaneously something used to control others and hold power over them? That makes it not personal, and insists there is some sort of tangible proof, otherwise, what makes it worthy of holding power?

I can understand someone's personal faith. I can understand faith so fervent, the person who has it feels devastated that others don't have the same exact variety and category of it. Where that stops is when someone feels their personal religion is so important, it must have power that applies to anyone but the person with the faith and any higher power/world/deities that faith is in.

I believe there are people with ulterior motives who want power over others - some may even be sincere, if misguided. I believe there are are people who want so desperately to be right, they'll say or do anything to convince others to agree with them - up to and including going against the very tenets of the faith they're trying to protect. I do not for a second believe there is any legitimate instance of faith that cannot thrive unless it is on display and held in awe by others. Is that just me?

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Asked by NotPanicking at 3:37 PM on Sep. 5, 2012 in Religious Debate

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No, it is just not you, I agree with you! mine is very personal, but am sure it is shared by others too....I have no need to defend my faith in anything, it is mine and mine alone...

Answer by older at 3:40 PM on Sep. 5, 2012
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I don't have a faith to defend. I respect their faith if they can respect my lack thereof.

You are 100% right.

Answer by Izsarejman at 3:41 PM on Sep. 5, 2012
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That concept is completely foreign to me as well NP. THe idea of power, related to my beliefs are so NOT connected that I cannot put the two together no matter how someone tries to rationalize it.
When I try to put the two together, I envision what we have seen from history. Tyrants who did unspeakable things to maintain that control-even using others faith/beliefs to manipulate them into submission.

So, you are not alone in your thinking.

Answer by sahmamax2 at 4:01 PM on Sep. 5, 2012
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On another note....I'm not even sure how my beliefs could be used to have control over others. And WHY would I want them too? Doesn't this cheapen ones' beliefs?
THere is no room within my spiritual journey to be concerned with others in the sense of intervening with their own freewill and faith.

Answer by sahmamax2 at 4:05 PM on Sep. 5, 2012
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No one can take your faith away from you. Maybe your freedom to exspress or share it can be tooken away, but inwardly no one can ever take it from you. I think throughout history this kind of opressive faith is shown over and over. Even today we see religion trying to influnce laws. While many do not feel the need to defend it there are the extremist who can not let go of control. Why maybe fear, maybe it will invalidate their beliefs? You hear so many times look our religion has to be true look how long it's survived. Why do you have to fight to prove to others that it's real if you know this in your heart?

Answer by skinnyslokita at 5:40 PM on Sep. 5, 2012
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hy do you have to fight to prove to others that it's real if you know this in your heart?
*****************************************************************************
insecurity. And truly NOT knowing.

Answer by sahmamax2 at 5:45 PM on Sep. 5, 2012
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My faith is for me.
The only time I have said anything to someone about faith, it is usually not my own. It is when I hear someone saying mormons or catholics aren't Christians. Those kind of things bother me because they are 100% false. (I am not either of those.)

Answer by AF4life at 6:04 PM on Sep. 5, 2012
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I'll speak up when idiots mis-describe christian sects, too, but I don't see that as having anything to do with faith, but rather said idiot having a shitty vocabulary (or simply being a misguided bigot)

Comment by NotPanicking (original poster) at 7:19 PM on Sep. 5, 2012
Credits: 337537 Level 49 Religious Debate Degree
Having once been religious, I understand wanting others to believe what I did. My perspective has changed, clearly. I believe that most organized religion has potential to be dangerous - something that history has proven to us time and time again. Because of that, I do wish we could get past our superstitious natures and start to look at the world in more rational ways. I know, though, that most people cannot do that for a myriad of reasons, and considering that, I wish they would be mindful that religion should be a personal matter - and to try to force religious beliefs on others or make laws that are based purely on religious beliefs - is a bad idea in every sense. I don't understand how those of faith really feel that forcing others to follow the dictates of their religion would benefit anyone.

Answer by jsbenkert at 7:41 PM on Sep. 5, 2012
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"How can something that is both personal and without proof be simultaneously something used to control others and hold power over them?"

fear...thats where religions' power comes from. by turning something personal into something you either believe or die trying to prove you believe. and history does not shine favorably on those who use beliefs & fear in order to gain power.

and no...its not just you.

Answer by okmanders at 10:11 PM on Sep. 5, 2012
Credits: 136248 Level 41 Religious Debate Degree

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