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6 Bumps

Is it okay to blame the humanists?

I thought this was an interesting perspective on the "godless schools" argument put forth by such shining examples of Christian love as Huckabee and Fischer, blaming secularism for the violence we've experienced in this nation.

While many are offended by such claims that the cases of violence can be blamed on the presence/non-presence of a benevolent/malevolent god, few consider the implication of the words by the likes of Gingrich, Fischer et al.  To suggest that the problems of this nation are due to the (supposedly) increased secularism of our society is to blame humanists/atheists for the rise in deadly violence.

If we were to look at other developed nations that don't impose religion or prayer on the public through schools or other government agencies, we would not see the same crime rate as we have here, in the U.S.  So, while atheists are blamed for the increased violence here, in the U.S. (indirectly, of course, through euphemisms and flawed logic), other developed nations enjoy more peace and better mental health.  

It is not religion that prevents senseless violence.

It is not atheists who cause it, either. 

Answer Question
 
jsbenkert

Asked by jsbenkert at 10:47 PM on Dec. 19, 2012 in Religious Debate

Level 37 (89,329 Credits)
Answers (33)
  • Funny I was agreeing until Beeky's post. Christianity is always accused of being the most guilty ridden group because of their religion.
    You don't have guilt withou taking responsibility.
    Some christians don't take rsponsibility, soma atheists don't, some jews don't, pick a religion non-religion. The majorit of people are good people and saying things with the purpose of trying to divide people and keep them turned against each other is sad.
    Dardenella

    Answer by Dardenella at 1:21 AM on Dec. 22, 2012

  • Yes we Need to examine all contributing factors to tragedies. But ultimately the sole responsibility lies in the person who chooses to act on that violent urge.
    Does that mean our society isn't becoming more and more self centered and apathetic in an individual basis? No. We are and it's becoming and more evident. But how do we change it? I think it all starts on an individual basis. And having less people like that Ann bitch as a talking head.
    sahmamax2

    Answer by sahmamax2 at 8:18 AM on Dec. 21, 2012

  • I do understand that "some" on the spectrum rage more as they age and thats a challenge but I do believe there is a difference between that type of rage and the violence of a killer, the uninformed do not know the difference and thats a shame -I do believe that the Columbine Survivor is on to something- we have become a more self-centered society and we have less empathy and do not take responsibility for our behavior (Ann Coulter is a good example-why is what she says OK and even worse broadcast) some will argue that the secularism as they see it as practiced in schools is to blame-I disagree with that- what some say is a "Godless Society" is actually just our society and people with and without God in their life are just as prone to the self-centered type of behavior that devoids us of empathy and humanity-I think screaming about gun rights in the wake of the tragedy is a good example as is blaming God or the lack thereof-
    soyousay

    Answer by soyousay at 10:43 PM on Dec. 20, 2012

  • Yes, yes.  That he might have been on the autism spectrum has been thrown out there as a bit of trivia that some feel is important.  There are some loud-mouthed commentators (Ann Coulter is one) who are turning away from their gay-bashing for now and focusing on those who have cognitive or mental disabilities.  It's their "new gay", and damned be any science that tells them otherwise, they seem determined to plant the idea that people on the autism spectrum are dangerous, or at least more prone to violent outbursts than neurotypicals.


    I do believe that there are a lot of pieces to this puzzle, a lot to be examined in an effort to prevent other tragedies.


    Still, it is not secularism that's to blame.

    jsbenkert

    Comment by jsbenkert (original poster) at 10:27 PM on Dec. 20, 2012

  • I read a great article by a Columbine survivor that believes that how we are raised to deal with our own shortcomings have a lot to do with it- ie-if people are never taught to take responsibility for their own actions-that could easily be the religious and the not religious- I do not believe that his being on the Autism Spectrum played a part but that seems to be a theory out there that I think is dangerous-
    soyousay

    Answer by soyousay at 10:19 PM on Dec. 20, 2012

  • As said in the article, had Dobson or the others insinuated that Hindus, Jews, or any other group was responsible, they'd be called out for hate-speech.

    Except they do insinuate exactly that, for the Hindus at least. We know when they (Huckabee, et al) discuss "God" being absent from schools, they only care about the Abrahamic one, specifically they one they feel is only applicable to Jews and Christians, not Muslims, and Jews only grudgingly so they won't get sued. If prayer was allowed to be publicly led in school again, but it was Sikh or Wiccan, they'd lose their shit even more than they do over only being allowed to pray quietly to oneself.
    NotPanicking

    Answer by NotPanicking at 8:47 PM on Dec. 20, 2012

  • I would disagree that the only one to blame is the perpetrator of the violence.  I think there are many factors to consider in each situation, and a lot to be learned.  It does no good to stop at the shooter, especially if he had mental health issues that were not addressed.


    It doesn't, however, have anything to do with a group of people who are interested in creating and maintaining a separation between church and state.  Secularism was not a factor in this, nor in any of the violent acts in this country.  We cannot demonize a group of people by trying to link them to atrocities that they had no hand in.  As said in the article, had Dobson or the others insinuated that Hindus, Jews, or any other group was responsible, they'd be called out for hate-speech.  Why does no one blink an eye when secularists are blamed for the deaths of those innocent people? 

    jsbenkert

    Comment by jsbenkert (original poster) at 8:43 PM on Dec. 20, 2012

  • Sahamamax2-you do and 4 stars and a level 34 and an 68709- I have no idea what any of it means-but its impressive-

    soyousay

    Answer by soyousay at 8:42 PM on Dec. 20, 2012

  • I know why they ask-

    You have a degree in psychic friends?
    NotPanicking

    Answer by NotPanicking at 8:38 PM on Dec. 20, 2012

  • I didn't even know I had a degree.
    sahmamax2

    Answer by sahmamax2 at 8:22 PM on Dec. 20, 2012

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