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"Miracles happen all the time"

This was part of a response to my "faith can move mountains" question.

The member went on to say that some are obvious, while some are not, but they do happen "all the time".

This is an extraordinary claim, and as the quote goes, "Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence".

What sort of miracles "happen all the time"?

An accepted definition of 'miracle' is:  A surprising and welcome event that is not explicable by natural or scientific laws and is considered to be divine.

Therefore, these "miracles" that "happen all the time" cannot, by definition, be explained by natural or scientific laws.  Not knowing to what "miracles" the member was alluding, I can only guess that the definition of 'miracle' probably disqualifies most of them.

However, for the sake of argument, let's say that miracles do happen all the time.  How do we know which divine entity deserves the credit?

Here's a personal story:  One of my brothers and I got into a discussion about my atheism.  He told me a story about my grandmother that turned him back to religion.  He never said that he was atheist, and I sincerely doubt that he was, but he did imply that religion did not play any significant role in his life.  He implied (as many "converts" love to do) that he was atheist, like me.  Anyway, he said that he was visiting my parents over the Christmas holiday.  My grandmother, who suffered dementia, was living with my parents.  My brother said that as he was walking past her room one night, he heard her having a conversation, but no one else was in the room with her.  He stepped into her room to see if she was alright, and she said that she was, that she was just talking with her husband (deceased) and her sister Hazel, who lived in another state.  She said that they were telling her that they were okay and happy.

The next day, we received word that Hazel, my grandmother's sister, had just passed away.  This was all it took to convince my brother that the Holy Trinity is real, and that heaven exists.  He considered it "evidence" to prove the myths we had been raised to believe in were true.

The story might give one goosebumps without further examination.  First of all, my brother couldn't say whether my grandmother had had similar "conversations" with her dead husband, and other members of her family and friends.  These might have been nightly occurrences, and he just happened to hear one that seemed to coincide with the death of her sister.

Also, my grandmother and my brother were raised in the Lutheran traditions and mythologies.  These are the background for which all their ideas of life, death, and the "afterlife" were formed.  Had they been raised Hindu, or Native American, or in any other tradition, their understanding and fantasies would be colored and shaped by those beliefs.  Their superstitions would have been different, and the "conversations" with people who were either living far away, or deceased, would have had different meanings.

In addition, my grandmother did not mention that they were in heaven.  My brother just inferred that, again based on his upbringing.  Perhaps she really was communing with the dead.  How does that prove or disprove any of the world's religions - or exclude other explanations?

So, I am suggesting that most "miracles" can be explained scientifically.  In fact, I'd say that all "miracles" have some natural explanation.  However, for those who insist that miracles are real, how do you attribute them to the god(s) of your specific beliefs, keeping in mind that other belief systems would be able to attribute them to their god(s) just as easily?  In simpler terms, how do the "miracles" you might believe to happen prove the existence of your particular god?

Answer Question
 
jsbenkert

Asked by jsbenkert at 11:13 AM on Feb. 10, 2013 in Religious Debate

Level 37 (89,140 Credits)
Answers (70)
  • You can't get something from nothing. There was a something that started the process and the very fact that we do not know exactly what happened. Accretion is a building up of something. Something had to be there to build up from. Abiogenesis is also dependent on matter existing. The genesis of that matter is unknown and miraculous as per your definitions.
    snookyfritz

    Answer by snookyfritz at 3:03 PM on Feb. 14, 2013

  • NP yes I did seek answers from the fire chief and the evn put an arsonist on it since again I should have died. The Emt''s, the dostors, everyone I could think of , I asked and they looked and could not explain it at all. They did decide it was not in any way arson (they had to since the chief put a specialist on the case for me) I guess he wanted answers too.

    Dardenella

    Answer by Dardenella at 3:23 PM on Feb. 14, 2013

  • You can't get something from nothing.


    So where did God come from?
    KristiS11384

    Answer by KristiS11384 at 3:58 PM on Feb. 14, 2013

  • Now that is the biggest miracle of all. God always existed.
    snookyfritz

    Answer by snookyfritz at 5:53 PM on Feb. 14, 2013

  • Now that is the biggest miracle of all. God always existed.


    But you yourself said something can't come from nothing (which is not what accretion, abiogenesis, or any other principle states).....So how can "God" have always existed, he can't have come from nothing.....you see the error in your logic don't you, or will you willfully ignore it just as you have everything else that doesn't support your own POV.
    KristiS11384

    Answer by KristiS11384 at 5:56 PM on Feb. 14, 2013

  • He's not "something" he is God. Beyond comprehension
    snookyfritz

    Answer by snookyfritz at 10:44 AM on Feb. 15, 2013

  • He's not "something" he is God. Beyond comprehension



    I just love the way that so many "believers" can ardently explain God or his will, etc but as soon as they get put on the spot with using the same failed arguments they try to pin on Atheists God suddenly becomes "Beyond comprehension. So in other words he's completely illogical and made-up....thanks for admitting it.
    KristiS11384

    Answer by KristiS11384 at 12:11 PM on Feb. 15, 2013

  • He's not "something" he is God. Beyond comprehension
    ********************************
    then why are you being so arrogant as to speak for him??
    sahmamax2

    Answer by sahmamax2 at 2:37 PM on Feb. 15, 2013

  • "Because god".


    That's the best non-answer ever.  There is no way to argue such logic.  I'm sold.

    jsbenkert

    Comment by jsbenkert (original poster) at 2:39 PM on Feb. 15, 2013

  • I'm not speaking for anyone.
    snookyfritz

    Answer by snookyfritz at 7:18 PM on Feb. 17, 2013

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