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Moms of girls, have you read the book " Girls and sex " or heard about it? I highly recommend it to anyone with teenage girls before they start dating. It is a shocking read, but it really tells it like it is in today's rape culture in schools and colleges. Also, moms of boys, it is an eye opener as to how young males who are seen as good kids are often someone entirely different on social media and when drinking. Thanks.
by on Dec. 14, 2017 at 8:11 AM
Replies (11-12):
by Member on Jan. 2, 2018 at 5:44 PM
Quoting Kimmybabe:

Well, it is bad.


In the case of our daughters, I think it was a joint decision with their guy, or maybe the possibility that the daughters were the instigators of it happening when it did.  


Years ago a mother, who managed an elder care home, made the observation that most of the older ladies living there were sexually active as teens, albeit with husbands.


Thinking about it, I think she is probably correct as First Ladies Mamie Eisenhower, Rosalyn Carter, and Barbara Bush were all old maids of nineteen on their wedding day, so they probably were sexually active teens soon after their wedding. Mamie Eisenhower was born when her mother was 18 and Mamie was the second child of her mother and father.


Prior to WWII, teen brides were more the norm than the exception. If you go back to 1900 the average length of life was like 47 vs 76 in 2000, so couples married as teens, had families, and hoped the kids were teens before one or both of them were gone. I have a great great something grandmother who was fourteen on her wedding day to a seventeen year old groom.


My point being, it was easier to remain a virgin until you’re wedding as a teen than wait until today’s average marriage age that I believe is around 27. That added ten years makes it less probable that the teen will abstain.


I recognize that we live in a more complicated world with jobs that require education well beyond 8th or 12th grade. However, I also believe that we share the same DNA of those earlier generations that married younger. That urge to merge hearts and lives with another, earlier than later, is as much a part of our DNA as the location of our eyes, ears, and nose on our face is. I think we are programed to merge our hearts and lives in our teens, not our late twenties.


Because our daughters and SILs married at 17 and 18, and youngest couple came up in a family way as we were planning the wedding, about twice a year I get a call from a mother wanting to know how to make it work. The answer is you (the parents) can’t, the teens have to make it work, but you parents of the couple can provide the two teens a place in your home and continue the financial support as they get an education. And, as it was in our case, it may actually cost less than sending them off to college. (Ours went the community college to local state university route.) And it’s a hell of a lot of fun watching them figure out how to be parents and seeing the grands as they grow up.


We did not, nor do we, raise the grandkids, we are grandparents only. Our job is to enjoy the grands and spoil them. LOL Grandchildren are wonderful!!!!


The reason that six parents of our two couples, all six with college degrees and three with post grad degrees, decided to let them marry was that we recognized that the wheels were not going to come off the romances any time in the next decade and by then they would be married. We also recognized that the train wreck of a breakup would be no different married or unmarried. And yes we do worry about those out years. As all parents know, worry is a big part of being a parent, and my mother says she still worries about my siblings and me.  


Another book, on a different teen subject, that you might find interesting and available for FREE at your local public library is THE OVERACHIEVERS: THE SECRET LIVES OF DRIVEN KIDS by Alexandra Robbins. It is the story of kids and the stress of getting into top rated schools like the Ivy League. I doubt it is worth the stress on the kid. Like the book that you recommended, this book is based on interviews with lots of teens.


Youngest SIL is a very bright guy with mild Asperger’s Syndrome and tests above the 99th percentile. In “gifted and talented” 7th grade he and our youngest daughter were sitting in class when the district explained all the wonderful opportunities that they would have in high school, like four years of foreign language, lots of mind numbing AP classes, etcetera. He knew it was something that he really really did NOT want to do and started plotting his escape. He did not care to take lots of classes that he would never use and quickly forget. He was already traveling through life with his 8th grade pal and decided to take both of our daughters with them on a very accelerated path through high school and college and then into law school. At the time, I thought, “Well, you may not realize this, but these teen romances are as fragile as soap bubbles, and you and your pal will be history in a few weeks or months.” The guys were history indeed, past and future history, and they and our daughters executed his plan to perfection.  

Quoting jewjewbee:
Quoting Kimmybabe:

Welcome to our corner of the Cafe!!!!


I went and took a look at the article and sneaked a peak at the book on the Amazon and read the first ten or so pages and have ordered it up at our local public library for pickup when we get back from our vacation.


I will also pass the book over to our daughters and SILs as our oldest daughter and SIL are now foster parents to daughters 14, 15, and 16, with pending adoption in the future. The sisters are not boy crazy yet.


Hubby and I, now 51, met in collage at around 21ish and pretty much followed the “poor choices path” discussed in the book. From 16 up my poison of choice was the screwdriver and hubby was a member of tap-a-keg-a-brew fraternity. We were poster children for the way to really screw up your lives. As the old saying puts it, “Candy is dandy, but liquor is quicker” at getting into bed. Both of us were promiscuous and have no clue as to which prior partners blessed us with Herpes.   


Ten years ago last summer, when our daughters and the guys we now call SILs were all 14 1/2 and 15 1/2, we took the guys with us on a family vacation to the beach in Florida, with hubby in a motel room with the guys and me in a motel room with the girls. While at the beach that week, both couples made “private vows” to each other; so private that hubby and I were not invited to witness those vows.


The following summer, hubby and I and the four parents of the guys found out about those “private vows” during a six parent conversation with the four teens after I had come home from work early one afternoon and discovered them having sex. (Did not see anything directly, but a few quick yes/no questions when they found me in the family room confirmed it.) At the time I thought “horse something” but I no longer feel that way, and about twenty months later all six parents watched the two couples formally marry on a beach in Hawaii during spring break of their senior year in high school.  The coupes count time from those vows made on that beach in Florida. The dates engraved on the inside of their gold wedding bands are the August 2007 dates in Florida, not the March 2010 date in Hawaii.


We’ve never had any discussions with the couples about the specifics of their sexual activities as teens or now, but I know both couples skipped over the random hooking up because both couples are and remain each others first and only dates. And I am pretty sure that they also skipped over oral sex. (I certainly would not want to discuss my past with them or my parents--LOL.)


They skipped over lots of other things also. At the end of “gifted and talented” 7th grade, the younger couple tested out and over “regular” 8th grade to join the older two in “regular”9th grade. And then, after taking lots of high school classes during the summer before 9th grade and during 9th grade, all four spent the last three years of high school taking lots of “dual enrollment classes” over at community college and local state university, so that they could graduate from local state university the May following the June high school graduation before going to local state university law school.         


Hubby and I stopped drinking while I was pregnant with our daughters and reduced it to social drinking after youngest was born. The guys were a good influence on hubby and me. The guys never said anything, but hubby and stopped drinking even socially nine years ago because both the guys have substance abuse issues in their extended families that they do not care to duplicate in their lives. Something that hubby and I found out is that after you’re off the sauce for a while, you don’t miss it, and you have lots of extra change in your pockets for other things, like trips to the beaches in Florida with the grandchildren.


Another book that was recommended to me many years ago and I found interesting is YES, YOUR TEEN IS CRAZY: LOVING YOUR KID WITHOUT LOSING YOUR MIND by Michael J. Bradley, which is probably available for FREE at your local public library.

My son's ex girlfriend was raped in college her first week there. Drinking caused it of course.
Thanks for looking into the book, she recommended it to me and I ordered a case at our local small bookstore. The owner put it in the window and sold the whole case in a week. I am lending the book out on a regular basis to every friend that shows up in our house. Whether their parents agree with it or not! Most just come over to read it here and they all say the same thing:
" this is exactly what boys do to us "
It's so sad, I hate it.

I'm so sorry I haven't returned to this post. I got super busy with the holidays and " stuff ".
I got engaged at 16 and married at 17 and still married 35 years later so I do agree with you on the intent for hearts to merge at a young age. Tim Tebow missed out! And, my just turned 18 year old daughter got engaged over the holidays. So...yeah, you are right!
I haven't read the book you referenced but I did spend much time on this very website debating/discussing the same issue. Overscheduled and overpressured kids to succeed. I think the push in the 90's to attend college created the problem. JMHO
by Member on Jan. 2, 2018 at 5:47 PM
Quoting characterbuildr:

Talking about this topic is challenging no matter what age we start.  I haven't read this book yet.  I started with this book and found it helpful, too.  Thanks for posting!

I vaguely remember hearing about this book quite some time ago, and read some of it back then. I think if I remember correctly, it wasn't quite as frank as what reality was at the time. Thank you for the response!
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