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Right to first Refusal?

Posted by on Apr. 8, 2016 at 11:42 PM
  • 37 Replies
I heard someone mention in another group about right to first refusal in a parenting plan. I guess I can refuse to have my ex husbands fiance to be able to watch my baby. Is there such a thing?
by on Apr. 8, 2016 at 11:42 PM
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Replies (1-10):
goldpandora
by Bronze Member on Apr. 9, 2016 at 5:03 AM

Yes, there is but it's very hard to enforce. Be aware that he can use this option and refuse to allow your parents (or anyone else...) to watch the baby.

bjane01
by Bronze Member on Apr. 9, 2016 at 8:40 AM
We have this in our plan. In ours it just means that if one parent can't watch the children on their time, the other parent has to be contacted to watch the children before anyone else can watch them. It's got good and bad points.

I think we have a time limit though. Like if the time needed to watch the kids is over an hour or two hours. It's helped when my ex works on Saturdays and then I watch the kids. We don't have any new people in our lives though. We both are single so it's simpler.

HHx5
by Member on Apr. 9, 2016 at 12:29 PM
1 mom liked this
I think some states have this somewhat defined, others don't. What I've read about it in my state (TN), there is no definition in the state laws or statutes but it is generally understood to mean what bjane01 stated except it's reserved for either regularly occurring events that last more than 3 hours per day like work or when a parent needs to be gone overnight. It would not come into play if a parent needed to go run an errand and leave the child with a third party. Stepparents, grandparents, and SOs are considered third parties. I used this in an every other week 50/50 plan because we were having trouble staying on the same page about the kids' school work. Their father wasn't off work until 2 hours after the kids' school dismissal and we didn't want to put them in afterschool care so I picked them up from school and did homework with them until he got off work. If you want to do this make sure it is clearly defined in your parenting plan.
sonnyswoman75
by on Apr. 9, 2016 at 3:46 PM
I'm going to research this for IL. I just don't want the baby with his girlfriend for 10 hours on the days he has to work.

Quoting HHx5: I think some states have this somewhat defined, others don't. What I've read about it in my state (TN), there is no definition in the state laws or statutes but it is generally understood to mean what bjane01 stated except it's reserved for either regularly occurring events that last more than 3 hours per day like work or when a parent needs to be gone overnight. It would not come into play if a parent needed to go run an errand and leave the child with a third party. Stepparents, grandparents, and SOs are considered third parties. I used this in an every other week 50/50 plan because we were having trouble staying on the same page about the kids' school work. Their father wasn't off work until 2 hours after the kids' school dismissal and we didn't want to put them in afterschool care so I picked them up from school and did homework with them until he got off work. If you want to do this make sure it is clearly defined in your parenting plan.
tottaxi
by Battle Weary on Apr. 9, 2016 at 5:21 PM

Just a little info for you since I live in Illinois, too...

I am remarried.  My husband has sole custody of his dd5.  He and the birth mother were not married.  

For the first two years of his dd's life the bm had custody of the child.  He paid child support, but had never taken the bm to court to establish a parenting agreement.  So he basically had paternity to pay cs with no rights.

He met me.  I was in the second year of my divorce and had been through the ringer.  I was getting a fast education on child custody and passed on what I had learned to him.  He filed a suit for custody of his dd.

One of the things that was disturbing to the judge was that the bm had never attempted to find employment and was content to live off of welfare and child support.  This was the second child she had...the oldest becoming an adult at the time her second child was born.  She had managed to survive the past eighteen years of her life on welfare and intermittent cs from the father of her first child and then has the second child at a point where her welfare opportunity was running out.

It wasn't lost on the judge that this woman had managed almost eighteen years without a pregnancy and yet becomes pregnant at a most convenient time to continue her career as a sahm/welfare recipient recieving cs.

My point in telling you this is that many judges will not want you to set yourself up as a sahm or complain about another person (the GF) caring for your child if you do not have full time employment.  Be careful in asking for ROFR citing your availablity when you are not working.

Not having experience in motherhood puts you at a disadvantage when trying to wrap your brain around the future with your child, let alone your child, an ex husband and this GF/potential step mother figure.  Your perception of what motherhood will be is one of your imagination at this point.  To now have to figure in someone else in your baby's life as a sort of second mother has to be super hard.

At this time you need to start imagining a future sharing your child.  That thought is horrible and that is why my knee jerk response is to tell you to move far away while you are not under a court order.  If you stay then be prepared.  Your life will be under a microscope.  It appears that your ex is going to be a total dick and has no intention of cooperating or coparenting.  I do not know if he has a reason for this attitude and for all I know it is justified.  But generally speaking we on this forum take you at your word and assume that you are going to be a fit parent.

You need to present an image to the court.  You don't have a history of caregiving for this child, so you can't even fall back on that.  You have to prop yourself up and sell yourself as a super human being with good morals and fine character.  You have to show yourself to be a better choice than your ex and this GF.  

You told us that your ex's GF is fraudulently receiving alimony and you were reluctant to get involved in their business.  What would be better for you is to get proof of their cohabitation.  Find out how to contact her ex and let him know the law that would end his paying alimony to this woman.  Let him take court action and let her be found guilty of fraud.  That damages her character in the eyes of the court.  It damages your ex because he is helping her take advantage of her ex for his own gain.

You want any type of information possible that will discredit him.  You want to look good.  You want him to look bad.  If you follow them on facebook you can print out anything disparaging he says against you.  It could show a propensity to badmouth you which could lead to parental alienation in the future.

This is going to be tough.  Do what you need to do.  If disappearing is not your thing, then learn to stand and fight.

Quoting sonnyswoman75: I'm going to research this for IL. I just don't want the baby with his girlfriend for 10 hours on the days he has to work.
Quoting HHx5: I think some states have this somewhat defined, others don't. What I've read about it in my state (TN), there is no definition in the state laws or statutes but it is generally understood to mean what bjane01 stated except it's reserved for either regularly occurring events that last more than 3 hours per day like work or when a parent needs to be gone overnight. It would not come into play if a parent needed to go run an errand and leave the child with a third party. Stepparents, grandparents, and SOs are considered third parties. I used this in an every other week 50/50 plan because we were having trouble staying on the same page about the kids' school work. Their father wasn't off work until 2 hours after the kids' school dismissal and we didn't want to put them in afterschool care so I picked them up from school and did homework with them until he got off work. If you want to do this make sure it is clearly defined in your parenting plan.


HHx5
by Member on Apr. 9, 2016 at 7:10 PM
That's what I was thinking, too - what tottaxi said. In reference to your feelings about the fiancé watching your child - Many states frown on cohabitation when there is a child involved after a divorce, even though it has become a societal norm. In some states, you can actually add a provision to prohibit your child's other parent from having a live-in, at least when the child is visiting. That would limit a new SO's access to your child at least short term.

In the long run, though, if your ex is going to marry again, there won't be much you can do to prevent a stepparent from being around your child. As far as babysitting, if there is a reason you feel she is unfit to watch your child, share that with the judge. You'd have to have evidence. Otherwise, ask your ex to understand your feelings and maybe in time you'll be more open to the idea of her sitting. Dealing with changes involving your child like a potential stepparent can be stressful. For me, the fact that my ex remarried to a woman who cares for the kids makes it easier for me to send my kids to their father. Truth be told, she is a much better parent than he is! She also respects boundaries in that technically, I share custody with their father and not with her. If we have to go back to court, I won't hesitate to tell the judge that she is a better parent than he is, lol. Initially, my ex practically shoved his new GF in my face and offered he up as a sitter. It made me mad that he seemed to prefer her caring for them instead of me. Maybe he wanted to make me jealous or make me feel inferior. Many times her opinion he gladly expressed and acted like I didn't know what I was talking about. But it is he that I can't stand, she is actually a nice person.
Fayanne
by Bronze Member on Apr. 9, 2016 at 8:16 PM
2 moms liked this

have to hand it to tottaxi. her advice is always spot on

sonnyswoman75
by on Apr. 10, 2016 at 4:15 PM
That is awesome she is a great parent. I can't say his fiance is a bad parent.I know she loves her 18 year old son and 8 year old daughter. I only question how she leaves her husband and moves in with a guy she meant on craigslist and accepts a proposal a week later. That is definitely putting her children at risk. Plus I feel she wrecked my marriage and controlled the whole thing and now she made it clear she will be mom to this baby. How do I handle this?

Quoting HHx5: That's what I was thinking, too - what tottaxi said. In reference to your feelings about the fiancé watching your child - Many states frown on cohabitation when there is a child involved after a divorce, even though it has become a societal norm. In some states, you can actually add a provision to prohibit your child's other parent from having a live-in, at least when the child is visiting. That would limit a new SO's access to your child at least short term.

In the long run, though, if your ex is going to marry again, there won't be much you can do to prevent a stepparent from being around your child. As far as babysitting, if there is a reason you feel she is unfit to watch your child, share that with the judge. You'd have to have evidence. Otherwise, ask your ex to understand your feelings and maybe in time you'll be more open to the idea of her sitting. Dealing with changes involving your child like a potential stepparent can be stressful. For me, the fact that my ex remarried to a woman who cares for the kids makes it easier for me to send my kids to their father. Truth be told, she is a much better parent than he is! She also respects boundaries in that technically, I share custody with their father and not with her. If we have to go back to court, I won't hesitate to tell the judge that she is a better parent than he is, lol. Initially, my ex practically shoved his new GF in my face and offered he up as a sitter. It made me mad that he seemed to prefer her caring for them instead of me. Maybe he wanted to make me jealous or make me feel inferior. Many times her opinion he gladly expressed and acted like I didn't know what I was talking about. But it is he that I can't stand, she is actually a nice person.
sonnyswoman75
by on Apr. 10, 2016 at 4:21 PM
Thank you for that advice! I am looking for job currently to show I am not trying to live off welfare and child support. My question is the fiance does stay at home and lives off her child support and alimony from her previous marriage and I have it stated from a Facebook message that she will continue to stay at home and they will get child support from me to make sure she does get to stay at home. Can I use that in court?

Quoting tottaxi:

Just a little info for you since I live in Illinois, too...

I am remarried.  My husband has sole custody of his dd5.  He and the birth mother were not married.  

For the first two years of his dd's life the bm had custody of the child.  He paid child support, but had never taken the bm to court to establish a parenting agreement.  So he basically had paternity to pay cs with no rights.

He met me.  I was in the second year of my divorce and had been through the ringer.  I was getting a fast education on child custody and passed on what I had learned to him.  He filed a suit for custody of his dd.

One of the things that was disturbing to the judge was that the bm had never attempted to find employment and was content to live off of welfare and child support.  This was the second child she had...the oldest becoming an adult at the time her second child was born.  She had managed to survive the past eighteen years of her life on welfare and intermittent cs from the father of her first child and then has the second child at a point where her welfare opportunity was running out.

It wasn't lost on the judge that this woman had managed almost eighteen years without a pregnancy and yet becomes pregnant at a most convenient time to continue her career as a sahm/welfare recipient recieving cs.

My point in telling you this is that many judges will not want you to set yourself up as a sahm or complain about another person (the GF) caring for your child if you do not have full time employment.  Be careful in asking for ROFR citing your availablity when you are not working.

Not having experience in motherhood puts you at a disadvantage when trying to wrap your brain around the future with your child, let alone your child, an ex husband and this GF/potential step mother figure.  Your perception of what motherhood will be is one of your imagination at this point.  To now have to figure in someone else in your baby's life as a sort of second mother has to be super hard.

At this time you need to start imagining a future sharing your child.  That thought is horrible and that is why my knee jerk response is to tell you to move far away while you are not under a court order.  If you stay then be prepared.  Your life will be under a microscope.  It appears that your ex is going to be a total dick and has no intention of cooperating or coparenting.  I do not know if he has a reason for this attitude and for all I know it is justified.  But generally speaking we on this forum take you at your word and assume that you are going to be a fit parent.

You need to present an image to the court.  You don't have a history of caregiving for this child, so you can't even fall back on that.  You have to prop yourself up and sell yourself as a super human being with good morals and fine character.  You have to show yourself to be a better choice than your ex and this GF.  

You told us that your ex's GF is fraudulently receiving alimony and you were reluctant to get involved in their business.  What would be better for you is to get proof of their cohabitation.  Find out how to contact her ex and let him know the law that would end his paying alimony to this woman.  Let him take court action and let her be found guilty of fraud.  That damages her character in the eyes of the court.  It damages your ex because he is helping her take advantage of her ex for his own gain.

You want any type of information possible that will discredit him.  You want to look good.  You want him to look bad.  If you follow them on facebook you can print out anything disparaging he says against you.  It could show a propensity to badmouth you which could lead to parental alienation in the future.

This is going to be tough.  Do what you need to do.  If disappearing is not your thing, then learn to stand and fight.

Quoting sonnyswoman75: I'm going to research this for IL. I just don't want the baby with his girlfriend for 10 hours on the days he has to work.

Quoting HHx5: I think some states have this somewhat defined, others don't. What I've read about it in my state (TN), there is no definition in the state laws or statutes but it is generally understood to mean what bjane01 stated except it's reserved for either regularly occurring events that last more than 3 hours per day like work or when a parent needs to be gone overnight. It would not come into play if a parent needed to go run an errand and leave the child with a third party. Stepparents, grandparents, and SOs are considered third parties. I used this in an every other week 50/50 plan because we were having trouble staying on the same page about the kids' school work. Their father wasn't off work until 2 hours after the kids' school dismissal and we didn't want to put them in afterschool care so I picked them up from school and did homework with them until he got off work. If you want to do this make sure it is clearly defined in your parenting plan.

HHx5
by Member on Apr. 10, 2016 at 5:43 PM
Tell your attorney all this. She would have no rights even as a stepparent. We can't really control what our ex spouses do in their home even with our children present. But, the company the other parents keeps including significant others is considered in some states when determining fit/unfit parents and/or how much time each parent gets in a parenting plan.

Quoting sonnyswoman75: That is awesome she is a great parent. I can't say his fiance is a bad parent.I know she loves her 18 year old son and 8 year old daughter. I only question how she leaves her husband and moves in with a guy she meant on craigslist and accepts a proposal a week later. That is definitely putting her children at risk. Plus I feel she wrecked my marriage and controlled the whole thing and now she made it clear she will be mom to this baby. How do I handle this?

Quoting HHx5: That's what I was thinking, too - what tottaxi said. In reference to your feelings about the fiancé watching your child - Many states frown on cohabitation when there is a child involved after a divorce, even though it has become a societal norm. In some states, you can actually add a provision to prohibit your child's other parent from having a live-in, at least when the child is visiting. That would limit a new SO's access to your child at least short term.

In the long run, though, if your ex is going to marry again, there won't be much you can do to prevent a stepparent from being around your child. As far as babysitting, if there is a reason you feel she is unfit to watch your child, share that with the judge. You'd have to have evidence. Otherwise, ask your ex to understand your feelings and maybe in time you'll be more open to the idea of her sitting. Dealing with changes involving your child like a potential stepparent can be stressful. For me, the fact that my ex remarried to a woman who cares for the kids makes it easier for me to send my kids to their father. Truth be told, she is a much better parent than he is! She also respects boundaries in that technically, I share custody with their father and not with her. If we have to go back to court, I won't hesitate to tell the judge that she is a better parent than he is, lol. Initially, my ex practically shoved his new GF in my face and offered he up as a sitter. It made me mad that he seemed to prefer her caring for them instead of me. Maybe he wanted to make me jealous or make me feel inferior. Many times her opinion he gladly expressed and acted like I didn't know what I was talking about. But it is he that I can't stand, she is actually a nice person.
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