It sickens me so many say birth rape is not real! *UPDATE*
So many say that birth rape isn't real. (I don't care what you want to label it! This isn't about the name. It is about the act performed against a woman, against her consent.) Maybe, you haven't read stories about it, I have posted a few links below of examples. A provider does not have automatic right to do whatever they want to a woman's body against her informed consent "so long as the baby makes it okay". That is like saying, "Well, there is no such thing as rape within a marriage. He has had sex with his wife in the past. He should be able to expect her to perform her wifely duty anytime."
http://birthraped.wordpress.com/
http://birthwithoutfearblog.com/2010/12/09/a-license-to-rape/
http://guggiedaly.blogspot.com/2011/08/confession-of-birth-rape-survivor.html
http://www.thefword.org.uk/features/2010/09/its_not_rape_ra
Please understand. I am not saying, "Providers should not examine patients." I am saying, "Providers should seek informed consent (per many hospitals' Patient's Bill of Rights) before they perform a prodecure on a patient."
*UPDATE BELOW*
Here are your rights a pregnant woman. They exist. They are real. What happened to these women violate these rights. Signing a form does not release a provider from adhering to these standards.
http://www.aimsusa.org/ppbr.htm
This is a quote from the ACOG.
"It is important to note the distinction between 'consent' and 'informed consent'. Many physicians, because they do not realize there is a difference, believe they are free from liability if the patient consents to treatment. This is not true. The physician may still be liable if the patient's consent was not informed. In addition, the usual consent obtained by a hospital does not in any way release the physician from his legal duty of obtaining an informed consent from his patient.
"Most courts consider that the patient is 'informed' if the following information is given:
The processes contemplated by the physician as treatment, including whether the treatment is new or unusual.
The risks and hazards of the treatment,
The chances for recovery after treatment.
The necessity of the treatment.
The feasibility of alternative methods of treatment.
"One point on which courts do agree is that explanations must be given in such a way that the patient understands them. A physician cannot claim as a defense that he explained the procedure to the patient when he knew the patient did not understand. The physician has a duty to act with due care under the circumstances; this means he must be sure the patient understands what she is told.
"It should be emphasized that the following reasons are not sufficient to justify failure to inform:
That the patient may prefer not to be told the unpleasant possibilities regarding the treatment.
That full disclosure might suggest infinite dangers to a patient with an active imagination, thereby causing her to refuse treatment.
That the patient, on learning the risks involved, might rationally decline treatment. The right to decline is the specific fundamental right protected by the informed consent doctrine."
The Pregnant Patient has the right to participate in decisions involving her well-being and that of her unborn child, unless there is a clearcut medical emergency that prevents her participation. In addition to the rights set forth in the American Hospital Association's "Patient's Bill of Rights," the Pregnant Patient, because she represents TWO patients rather than one, should be recognized as having the additional rights listed below.
The Pregnant Patient has the right, prior to the administration of any drug or procedure, to be informed by the health professional caring for her of any potential direct or indirect effects, risks or hazards to herself or her unborn or newborn infant which may result from the use of a drug or procedure prescribed for or administered to her during pregnancy, labor, birth or lactation.
The Pregnant Patient has the right, prior to the proposed therapy, to be informed, not only of the benefits, risks and hazards of the proposed therapy but also of known alternative therapy, such as available childbirth education classes which could help to prepare the Pregnant Patient physically and mentally to cope with the discomfort or stress of pregnancy and birth. Such classes have been shown to reduce or eliminate the Pregnant Patient's need for drugs and obstetric intervention and should be offered to her early in her pregnancy in order that she may make a reasoned decisions.
The Pregnant Patient has the right, prior to the administration of any drug, to be informed by the health professional who is prescribing or administering the drug to her that any drug which she receives during pregnancy, labor and birth, no matter how or when the drug is taken or administered, may adversely affect her unborn baby, directly or indirectly, and that there is no drug or chemical which has been proven safe for the unborn child.
The Pregnant Patient has the right if Cesarean birth is anticipated, to be informed prior to the administration of any drug, and preferably prior to her hospitalization, that minimizing her intake of nonessential pre-operative medicine will benefit her baby.
The Pregnant Patient has the right, prior to the administration of a drug or procedure, to be informed of the areas of uncertainty if there is NO properly controlled follow-up research which has established the safety of the drug or procedure with regard to its on the fetus and the later physiological, mental and neurological development of the child. This caution applies to virtually all drugs and the vast majority of obstetric procedures.
The Pregnant Patient has the right, prior to the administration of any drug, to be informed of the brand name and generic name of the drug in order that she may advise the health professional of any past adverse reaction to the drug.
The Pregnant Patient has the right to determine for herself, without pressure from her attendant, whether she will or will not accept the risks inherent in the proposed treatment.
The Pregnant Patient has the right to know the name and qualifications of the individual administering a drug or procedure to her during labor or birth.
The Pregnant Patient has the right to be informed, prior to the administration of any procedure, whether that procedure is being administered to her because a) it is medically indicated, b) it is an elective procedure (for convenience, c) or for teaching purposes or research).
The Pregnant Patient has the right to be accompanied during the stress of labor and birth by someone she cares for, and to whom she looks for emotional comfort and encouragement.
The Pregnant Patient has the right after appropriate medical consultation to choose a position for labor and birth which is least stressful for her and her baby.
The Obstetric Patient has the right to have her baby cared for at her bedside if her baby is normal, and to feed her baby according to her baby's needs rather than according to the hospital regimen.
The Obstetric Patient has the right to be informed in writing of the name of the person who actually delivered her baby and the professional qualifications of that person. This information should also be on the birth certificate.
The Obstetric Patient has the right to be informed if there is any known or indicated aspect of her or her baby's care or condition which may cause her or her baby later difficulty or problems.
The Obstetric Patient has the right to have her and her baby's hospital- medical records complete, accurate and legible and to have their records, including nursing notes, retained by the hospital until the child reaches at least the age of majority, or, alternatively, to have the records offered to her before they are destroyed.
The Obstetric Patient, both during and after her hospital stay, has the right to have access to her complete hospital-medical records, including nursing notes, and to receive a copy upon payment of a reasonable fee and without incurring the expense of retaining an attorney.
It is the obstetric patient and her baby, not the health professional, who must sustain any trauma or injury resulting from the use of a drug or obstetric procedure. The observation of the rights listed above will not only permit the obstetric patient to participate in the decisions involving her and her baby's health care, but will help to protect the health professional and the hospital against litigation arising from resentment or misunderstanding on the part of the mother.
I am very offended. I can help but to laugh at the ridiculous claim that anyone who thinks that birth rape is is OK would condone date rape or spousal rape. As a victim of spousal rape I really want to bitch slap that poster.
Quoting Anonymous:I would think that actual rape victoms would be really offended by these over reacting moms.
I agree with you OP. People get hung up on the terminology and don't look at why this is a problem.
That "bill of rights" isn't law. It is a set of suggested guidelines for hospitals that are members of the AHA. They even tell their members that the "bill of rights" may be altered and or simplified.
Quoting louzannalady:
No where in this does it say, a doctor has a right to do what these doctors have done. To the contrary, it states they should seek not only consent ("May I do x, y, or z?), but INFORMED consent (I want to do x, y, or z. Here are the benefits. Here are the risks. May I do this?"
http://www.aimsusa.org/ppbr.htm
"It is important to note the distinction between 'consent' and 'informed consent'. Many physicians, because they do not realize there is a difference, believe they are free from liability if the patient consents to treatment. This is not true. The physician may still be liable if the patient's consent was not informed. In addition, the usual consent obtained by a hospital does not in any way release the physician from his legal duty of obtaining an informed consent from his patient.
"Most courts consider that the patient is 'informed' if the following information is given:
The processes contemplated by the physician as treatment, including whether the treatment is new or unusual.
The risks and hazards of the treatment,
The chances for recovery after treatment.
The necessity of the treatment.
The feasibility of alternative methods of treatment.
"One point on which courts do agree is that explanations must be given in such a way that the patient understands them. A physician cannot claim as a defense that he explained the procedure to the patient when he knew the patient did not understand. The physician has a duty to act with due care under the circumstances; this means he must be sure the patient understands what she is told.
"It should be emphasized that the following reasons are not sufficient to justify failure to inform:
That the patient may prefer not to be told the unpleasant possibilities regarding the treatment.
That full disclosure might suggest infinite dangers to a patient with an active imagination, thereby causing her to refuse treatment.
That the patient, on learning the risks involved, might rationally decline treatment. The right to decline is the specific fundamental right protected by the informed consent doctrine."
The Pregnant Patient has the right to participate in decisions involving her well-being and that of her unborn child, unless there is a clearcut medical emergency that prevents her participation. In addition to the rights set forth in the American Hospital Association's "Patient's Bill of Rights," the Pregnant Patient, because she represents TWO patients rather than one, should be recognized as having the additional rights listed below.
The Pregnant Patient has the right, prior to the administration of any drug or procedure, to be informed by the health professional caring for her of any potential direct or indirect effects, risks or hazards to herself or her unborn or newborn infant which may result from the use of a drug or procedure prescribed for or administered to her during pregnancy, labor, birth or lactation.
The Pregnant Patient has the right, prior to the proposed therapy, to be informed, not only of the benefits, risks and hazards of the proposed therapy but also of known alternative therapy, such as available childbirth education classes which could help to prepare the Pregnant Patient physically and mentally to cope with the discomfort or stress of pregnancy and birth. Such classes have been shown to reduce or eliminate the Pregnant Patient's need for drugs and obstetric intervention and should be offered to her early in her pregnancy in order that she may make a reasoned decisions.
The Pregnant Patient has the right, prior to the administration of any drug, to be informed by the health professional who is prescribing or administering the drug to her that any drug which she receives during pregnancy, labor and birth, no matter how or when the drug is taken or administered, may adversely affect her unborn baby, directly or indirectly, and that there is no drug or chemical which has been proven safe for the unborn child.
The Pregnant Patient has the right if Cesarean birth is anticipated, to be informed prior to the administration of any drug, and preferably prior to her hospitalization, that minimizing her intake of nonessential pre-operative medicine will benefit her baby.
The Pregnant Patient has the right, prior to the administration of a drug or procedure, to be informed of the areas of uncertainty if there is NO properly controlled follow-up research which has established the safety of the drug or procedure with regard to its on the fetus and the later physiological, mental and neurological development of the child. This caution applies to virtually all drugs and the vast majority of obstetric procedures.
The Pregnant Patient has the right, prior to the administration of any drug, to be informed of the brand name and generic name of the drug in order that she may advise the health professional of any past adverse reaction to the drug.
The Pregnant Patient has the right to determine for herself, without pressure from her attendant, whether she will or will not accept the risks inherent in the proposed treatment.
The Pregnant Patient has the right to know the name and qualifications of the individual administering a drug or procedure to her during labor or birth.
The Pregnant Patient has the right to be informed, prior to the administration of any procedure, whether that procedure is being administered to her because a) it is medically indicated, b) it is an elective procedure (for convenience, c) or for teaching purposes or research).
The Pregnant Patient has the right to be accompanied during the stress of labor and birth by someone she cares for, and to whom she looks for emotional comfort and encouragement.
The Pregnant Patient has the right after appropriate medical consultation to choose a position for labor and birth which is least stressful for her and her baby.
The Obstetric Patient has the right to have her baby cared for at her bedside if her baby is normal, and to feed her baby according to her baby's needs rather than according to the hospital regimen.
The Obstetric Patient has the right to be informed in writing of the name of the person who actually delivered her baby and the professional qualifications of that person. This information should also be on the birth certificate.
The Obstetric Patient has the right to be informed if there is any known or indicated aspect of her or her baby's care or condition which may cause her or her baby later difficulty or problems.
The Obstetric Patient has the right to have her and her baby's hospital- medical records complete, accurate and legible and to have their records, including nursing notes, retained by the hospital until the child reaches at least the age of majority, or, alternatively, to have the records offered to her before they are destroyed.
The Obstetric Patient, both during and after her hospital stay, has the right to have access to her complete hospital-medical records, including nursing notes, and to receive a copy upon payment of a reasonable fee and without incurring the expense of retaining an attorney.
It is the obstetric patient and her baby, not the health professional, who must sustain any trauma or injury resulting from the use of a drug or obstetric procedure. The observation of the rights listed above will not only permit the obstetric patient to participate in the decisions involving her and her baby's health care, but will help to protect the health professional and the hospital against litigation arising from resentment or misunderstanding on the part of the mother.
Quoting sha_lyn68:I'm appalled that these idiots didn't read the consent forms they signed and by the fact that they no not understand what a medically assisted birth entails. How hard is it to graps that part of the medical exam is checking for dialation? How how hard is it to understand that moving a cervical lip out of the way is necessasary?
Quoting militarywife09:
When a person, any person, puts something in you, ie: speculum, fingers, scissors etc. without her (or whomever is making her medical decisions) it's rape. How is that hard to grasp? Women have the right to say "no I don't want to be checked" or "no I'd rather tear on my own" or "no I don't want sex". Whatever the case is. I'm appalled people think they don't have those rights just becuase they're pregnant.
Even at that, a woman can easily obtain the Bill of Rights from her specific hospital and make sure they are conforming to it. To say, that once a form is signed, she has no right to say "no" to any procedure is not accurate.
Quoting sha_lyn68:That "bill of rights" isn't law. It is a set of suggested guidelines for hospitals that are members of the AHA. They even tell their members that the "bill of rights" may be altered and or simplified.
Quoting louzannalady:
No where in this does it say, a doctor has a right to do what these doctors have done. To the contrary, it states they should seek not only consent ("May I do x, y, or z?), but INFORMED consent (I want to do x, y, or z. Here are the benefits. Here are the risks. May I do this?"
http://www.aimsusa.org/ppbr.htm
"It is important to note the distinction between 'consent' and 'informed consent'. Many physicians, because they do not realize there is a difference, believe they are free from liability if the patient consents to treatment. This is not true. The physician may still be liable if the patient's consent was not informed. In addition, the usual consent obtained by a hospital does not in any way release the physician from his legal duty of obtaining an informed consent from his patient.
"Most courts consider that the patient is 'informed' if the following information is given:
The processes contemplated by the physician as treatment, including whether the treatment is new or unusual.
The risks and hazards of the treatment,
The chances for recovery after treatment.
The necessity of the treatment.
The feasibility of alternative methods of treatment.
"One point on which courts do agree is that explanations must be given in such a way that the patient understands them. A physician cannot claim as a defense that he explained the procedure to the patient when he knew the patient did not understand. The physician has a duty to act with due care under the circumstances; this means he must be sure the patient understands what she is told.
"It should be emphasized that the following reasons are not sufficient to justify failure to inform:
That the patient may prefer not to be told the unpleasant possibilities regarding the treatment.
That full disclosure might suggest infinite dangers to a patient with an active imagination, thereby causing her to refuse treatment.
That the patient, on learning the risks involved, might rationally decline treatment. The right to decline is the specific fundamental right protected by the informed consent doctrine."
The Pregnant Patient has the right to participate in decisions involving her well-being and that of her unborn child, unless there is a clearcut medical emergency that prevents her participation. In addition to the rights set forth in the American Hospital Association's "Patient's Bill of Rights," the Pregnant Patient, because she represents TWO patients rather than one, should be recognized as having the additional rights listed below.
The Pregnant Patient has the right, prior to the administration of any drug or procedure, to be informed by the health professional caring for her of any potential direct or indirect effects, risks or hazards to herself or her unborn or newborn infant which may result from the use of a drug or procedure prescribed for or administered to her during pregnancy, labor, birth or lactation.
The Pregnant Patient has the right, prior to the proposed therapy, to be informed, not only of the benefits, risks and hazards of the proposed therapy but also of known alternative therapy, such as available childbirth education classes which could help to prepare the Pregnant Patient physically and mentally to cope with the discomfort or stress of pregnancy and birth. Such classes have been shown to reduce or eliminate the Pregnant Patient's need for drugs and obstetric intervention and should be offered to her early in her pregnancy in order that she may make a reasoned decisions.
The Pregnant Patient has the right, prior to the administration of any drug, to be informed by the health professional who is prescribing or administering the drug to her that any drug which she receives during pregnancy, labor and birth, no matter how or when the drug is taken or administered, may adversely affect her unborn baby, directly or indirectly, and that there is no drug or chemical which has been proven safe for the unborn child.
The Pregnant Patient has the right if Cesarean birth is anticipated, to be informed prior to the administration of any drug, and preferably prior to her hospitalization, that minimizing her intake of nonessential pre-operative medicine will benefit her baby.
The Pregnant Patient has the right, prior to the administration of a drug or procedure, to be informed of the areas of uncertainty if there is NO properly controlled follow-up research which has established the safety of the drug or procedure with regard to its on the fetus and the later physiological, mental and neurological development of the child. This caution applies to virtually all drugs and the vast majority of obstetric procedures.
The Pregnant Patient has the right, prior to the administration of any drug, to be informed of the brand name and generic name of the drug in order that she may advise the health professional of any past adverse reaction to the drug.
The Pregnant Patient has the right to determine for herself, without pressure from her attendant, whether she will or will not accept the risks inherent in the proposed treatment.
The Pregnant Patient has the right to know the name and qualifications of the individual administering a drug or procedure to her during labor or birth.
The Pregnant Patient has the right to be informed, prior to the administration of any procedure, whether that procedure is being administered to her because a) it is medically indicated, b) it is an elective procedure (for convenience, c) or for teaching purposes or research).
The Pregnant Patient has the right to be accompanied during the stress of labor and birth by someone she cares for, and to whom she looks for emotional comfort and encouragement.
The Pregnant Patient has the right after appropriate medical consultation to choose a position for labor and birth which is least stressful for her and her baby.
The Obstetric Patient has the right to have her baby cared for at her bedside if her baby is normal, and to feed her baby according to her baby's needs rather than according to the hospital regimen.
The Obstetric Patient has the right to be informed in writing of the name of the person who actually delivered her baby and the professional qualifications of that person. This information should also be on the birth certificate.
The Obstetric Patient has the right to be informed if there is any known or indicated aspect of her or her baby's care or condition which may cause her or her baby later difficulty or problems.
The Obstetric Patient has the right to have her and her baby's hospital- medical records complete, accurate and legible and to have their records, including nursing notes, retained by the hospital until the child reaches at least the age of majority, or, alternatively, to have the records offered to her before they are destroyed.
The Obstetric Patient, both during and after her hospital stay, has the right to have access to her complete hospital-medical records, including nursing notes, and to receive a copy upon payment of a reasonable fee and without incurring the expense of retaining an attorney.
It is the obstetric patient and her baby, not the health professional, who must sustain any trauma or injury resulting from the use of a drug or obstetric procedure. The observation of the rights listed above will not only permit the obstetric patient to participate in the decisions involving her and her baby's health care, but will help to protect the health professional and the hospital against litigation arising from resentment or misunderstanding on the part of the mother.
Quoting sha_lyn68:I'm appalled that these idiots didn't read the consent forms they signed and by the fact that they no not understand what a medically assisted birth entails. How hard is it to graps that part of the medical exam is checking for dialation? How how hard is it to understand that moving a cervical lip out of the way is necessasary?
Quoting militarywife09:
When a person, any person, puts something in you, ie: speculum, fingers, scissors etc. without her (or whomever is making her medical decisions) it's rape. How is that hard to grasp? Women have the right to say "no I don't want to be checked" or "no I'd rather tear on my own" or "no I don't want sex". Whatever the case is. I'm appalled people think they don't have those rights just becuase they're pregnant.
The patient rights listed below were all violated in my case. I do not consider my dd's birth to have been a "birth rape" or even traumatic compared to what others have gone thru. It did, however, influence my decision that I will not have another hospital birth unless it is absolutely necessary. The things that happened during dd's birth were mostly for the nurses convenience & not for my/dd's benefit. A friend of mine now works L&D at the hospital I delivered at & we discussed my birth. How they handled it is pretty standard for that hospital & she sees nothing wrong with it
Quote:
Quoting louzannalady:
The Pregnant Patient has the right, prior to the administration of any drug or procedure, to be informed by the health professional caring for her of any potential direct or indirect effects, risks or hazards to herself or her unborn or newborn infant which may result from the use of a drug or procedure prescribed for or administered to her during pregnancy, labor, birth or lactation.
The Pregnant Patient has the right, prior to the administration of any drug, to be informed by the health professional who is prescribing or administering the drug to her that any drug which she receives during pregnancy, labor and birth, no matter how or when the drug is taken or administered, may adversely affect her unborn baby, directly or indirectly, and that there is no drug or chemical which has been proven safe for the unborn child.
The Pregnant Patient has the right to determine for herself, without pressure from her attendant, whether she will or will not accept the risks inherent in the proposed treatment.
The Pregnant Patient has the right to be informed, prior to the administration of any procedure, whether that procedure is being administered to her because a) it is medically indicated, b) it is an elective procedure (for convenience, c) or for teaching purposes or research).
The Pregnant Patient has the right after appropriate medical consultation to choose a position for labor and birth which is least stressful for her and her baby.
How so? This is only the second time I have posted recently in Mom Confessions. The last one, I did not word well, I freely admit. I freely admit I have conservative veiws on some things. But, this one is a very big issue. One, that we should all be up in arms about. Women should not be treated like this. How will things change if we don't talk about what is happening and agree that it's wrong? Until we can do that, we will still have a 33% c-section rate. Women will suffered from PTSD from giving birth under cruel providers. Our country will still have the second highest maternal death rate of all the industrialized nations. This is one of many symptoms that something is very, very wrong with how we perceive and handle births in this country.
Quoting Anonymous:you know sometimes I think you just try to find things that you know people will fight with you about to post on this sight.
I really can respect that. Again, it's not the term I am so concerned about. I am concerned for how women are treated during labor. I am so sorry for your experience. I feel terrible that it considered normal in this country to be treated this way. I feel bad that more women don't demand or expect better. : (
Quoting momma-flynn:The patient rights listed below were all violated in my case. I do not consider my dd's birth to have been a "birth rape" or even traumatic compared to what others have gone thru. It did, however, influence my decision that I will not have another hospital birth unless it is absolutely necessary. The things that happened during dd's birth were mostly for the nurses convenience & not for my/dd's benefit. A friend of mine now works L&D at the hospital I delivered at & we discussed my birth. How they handled it is pretty standard for that hospital & she sees nothing wrong with it
Quote:
Quoting louzannalady:
The Pregnant Patient has the right, prior to the administration of any drug or procedure, to be informed by the health professional caring for her of any potential direct or indirect effects, risks or hazards to herself or her unborn or newborn infant which may result from the use of a drug or procedure prescribed for or administered to her during pregnancy, labor, birth or lactation.
The Pregnant Patient has the right, prior to the administration of any drug, to be informed by the health professional who is prescribing or administering the drug to her that any drug which she receives during pregnancy, labor and birth, no matter how or when the drug is taken or administered, may adversely affect her unborn baby, directly or indirectly, and that there is no drug or chemical which has been proven safe for the unborn child.
The Pregnant Patient has the right to determine for herself, without pressure from her attendant, whether she will or will not accept the risks inherent in the proposed treatment.
The Pregnant Patient has the right to be informed, prior to the administration of any procedure, whether that procedure is being administered to her because a) it is medically indicated, b) it is an elective procedure (for convenience, c) or for teaching purposes or research).
The Pregnant Patient has the right after appropriate medical consultation to choose a position for labor and birth which is least stressful for her and her baby.
If you don't want a doctor to do his job and help you and your baby live, stay the fuck at home.
Doctors are people too. They have families and bills and their own lives. They shouldn't have to worry about some twit coming in and suing them for SAVING THEIR LIVES. That's such utter bullshit. Just stay home. You don't really want a doctor to save your life or your child's life so why even go to the hopsital in the first place?
Oh, right, so you can sue them for doing their job. Goddamned bottom feeders.
They are trying to ban buying soda from FS
Do you REGRET having kids
- louzannalady
on Apr. 18, 2012 at 10:15 AM