How long do you think until the US gets involved? Any other thoughts on this?
Quoting ethans_momma06:I hardly think that Israel existing inherently means that the Palestinians "suffer".
The people who had control of the land divied it up. Sucks, but there it is.
You ask why can't Jews live here since they aren't "oppressed"- but why don't you ask yourself why these refugees who are suffering cannot be excepted into the massive quantities of surrounding land. Land that shares culture/similar language. Land that shares ancestory. Land that shares Religion. After all, they and their children are already living there.
Quoting Anonymous:
So would you give me YOUR home if the government told you to?
Half of you people don't believe in welfare yet you find it completely acceptable to divvy up someone elses land like a large scale robin hood... so the Palestinians should suffer because the Jews can't find a home? Or because some book that I don't even believe in says I don't belong in my home, someone else does? I can't grasp these concepts, that its ok for Israel to steal and kill but its not ok for Palestine to fight back. I would fight you to the death for my house, my mothers house, my grandmothers house. Should I roll over and say "oh, you feel entitled to it, so its yours!"... no. I pray every single day for the Palestinian people who have lost their land, their homes, their family members and their freedom. Jewish people are not oppressed in America, so why cant they live here and leave the Palestinians to what is rightfully theirs?
Quoting JanuaryBaby06:i could be wrong but arent we already kind of involved? dont we give them money and medical supplies and weapons? we helped put them there so we should be helping them i guess.
what it comes down to is that land wouldnt be holy if not for them writing the book that religions like christianity and islam decided was so good that it would be included into their books. It's not even the holyest place in the Islam religion (like it is to the Jews). It's like the 3rd.... Mecca is tehir holiest place. Everyone is guilty in that situation but i cant help but feel bad for the Jews who have been chased pretty much throughout History from everywhere. The universal scope of anti-Semitism can be seen in the fact that Jews have been expelled from virtually every country in which they have resided. Jews were expelled from England in 1290, France in 1306 and 1394, Hungary in 1349 and 1360, Austria in 1421, from various places in Germany throughout the 14th, 15th and 16th centuries, from Lithuania in 1445 and 1495, Spain in 1492, Portugal in 1497, and from Bohemia and Moravia in 1744-45. Between the 15th and 18th centuries, Jews were not permitted to enter Russia, and when they were finally admitted, they were restricted to one area, the Pale of Settlement. All they have wanted was to go home... which is Isreal and this si what happeneds when they are there. i really just dont get why they just cant have it. Why Religion is such a huge reason for all of the killing over there.
I think you've proven your own point about why the Jews deserved their own homeland. One that they had some reason to go to, some relationship to.
After all, what was supposed to happen to them when they were ejected from various countries? And it's not like staying in a country where you had just been mass slaughtered was really an option. What neighbor did they have to take them in? NONE.
I've never stated anywhere that I faulted the logic behind the Palestinians going to war. I understand the sentiment, although I don't think it's the most LOGICAL. And, while they expressed themselves, they lost. They keep losing.
Is it logical to continue on in the fashion that they have? I don't see the logic in that. I see the hate in it. I see the emotion. I don't see the logic.
Quoting Anonymous:
So you would move in with your neighbor so that someone could take your home? Give up everything youve worked your entire life for to start over because someone else said so? There is no logic behind that and I'm sure you would never agree to that so WHY should any Palestinian? Because Israel and England said so? Then they SHOULD go to war. I would go to war too! And I hope the deserving party can finally live in peace in their own homes that were theirs before 1948.
Quoting ethans_momma06:I hardly think that Israel existing inherently means that the Palestinians "suffer".
The people who had control of the land divied it up. Sucks, but there it is.
You ask why can't Jews live here since they aren't "oppressed"- but why don't you ask yourself why these refugees who are suffering cannot be excepted into the massive quantities of surrounding land. Land that shares culture/similar language. Land that shares ancestory. Land that shares Religion. After all, they and their children are already living there.
Quoting Anonymous:
So would you give me YOUR home if the government told you to?
Half of you people don't believe in welfare yet you find it completely acceptable to divvy up someone elses land like a large scale robin hood... so the Palestinians should suffer because the Jews can't find a home? Or because some book that I don't even believe in says I don't belong in my home, someone else does? I can't grasp these concepts, that its ok for Israel to steal and kill but its not ok for Palestine to fight back. I would fight you to the death for my house, my mothers house, my grandmothers house. Should I roll over and say "oh, you feel entitled to it, so its yours!"... no. I pray every single day for the Palestinian people who have lost their land, their homes, their family members and their freedom. Jewish people are not oppressed in America, so why cant they live here and leave the Palestinians to what is rightfully theirs?
Quoting JanuaryBaby06:i could be wrong but arent we already kind of involved? dont we give them money and medical supplies and weapons? we helped put them there so we should be helping them i guess.
what it comes down to is that land wouldnt be holy if not for them writing the book that religions like christianity and islam decided was so good that it would be included into their books. It's not even the holyest place in the Islam religion (like it is to the Jews). It's like the 3rd.... Mecca is tehir holiest place. Everyone is guilty in that situation but i cant help but feel bad for the Jews who have been chased pretty much throughout History from everywhere. The universal scope of anti-Semitism can be seen in the fact that Jews have been expelled from virtually every country in which they have resided. Jews were expelled from England in 1290, France in 1306 and 1394, Hungary in 1349 and 1360, Austria in 1421, from various places in Germany throughout the 14th, 15th and 16th centuries, from Lithuania in 1445 and 1495, Spain in 1492, Portugal in 1497, and from Bohemia and Moravia in 1744-45. Between the 15th and 18th centuries, Jews were not permitted to enter Russia, and when they were finally admitted, they were restricted to one area, the Pale of Settlement. All they have wanted was to go home... which is Isreal and this si what happeneds when they are there. i really just dont get why they just cant have it. Why Religion is such a huge reason for all of the killing over there.
Quoting ethans_momma06:I think you've proven your own point about why the Jews deserved their own homeland. One that they had some reason to go to, some relationship to.
After all, what was supposed to happen to them when they were ejected from various countries? And it's not like staying in a country where you had just been mass slaughtered was really an option. What neighbor did they have to take them in? NONE.
I've never stated anywhere that I faulted the logic behind the Palestinians going to war. I understand the sentiment, although I don't think it's the most LOGICAL. And, while they expressed themselves, they lost. They keep losing.
Is it logical to continue on in the fashion that they have? I don't see the logic in that. I see the hate in it. I see the emotion. I don't see the logic.
Quoting Anonymous:
So you would move in with your neighbor so that someone could take your home? Give up everything youve worked your entire life for to start over because someone else said so? There is no logic behind that and I'm sure you would never agree to that so WHY should any Palestinian? Because Israel and England said so? Then they SHOULD go to war. I would go to war too! And I hope the deserving party can finally live in peace in their own homes that were theirs before 1948.
Quoting ethans_momma06:I hardly think that Israel existing inherently means that the Palestinians "suffer".
The people who had control of the land divied it up. Sucks, but there it is.
You ask why can't Jews live here since they aren't "oppressed"- but why don't you ask yourself why these refugees who are suffering cannot be excepted into the massive quantities of surrounding land. Land that shares culture/similar language. Land that shares ancestory. Land that shares Religion. After all, they and their children are already living there.
Quoting Anonymous:
So would you give me YOUR home if the government told you to?
Half of you people don't believe in welfare yet you find it completely acceptable to divvy up someone elses land like a large scale robin hood... so the Palestinians should suffer because the Jews can't find a home? Or because some book that I don't even believe in says I don't belong in my home, someone else does? I can't grasp these concepts, that its ok for Israel to steal and kill but its not ok for Palestine to fight back. I would fight you to the death for my house, my mothers house, my grandmothers house. Should I roll over and say "oh, you feel entitled to it, so its yours!"... no. I pray every single day for the Palestinian people who have lost their land, their homes, their family members and their freedom. Jewish people are not oppressed in America, so why cant they live here and leave the Palestinians to what is rightfully theirs?
Quoting JanuaryBaby06:i could be wrong but arent we already kind of involved? dont we give them money and medical supplies and weapons? we helped put them there so we should be helping them i guess.
what it comes down to is that land wouldnt be holy if not for them writing the book that religions like christianity and islam decided was so good that it would be included into their books. It's not even the holyest place in the Islam religion (like it is to the Jews). It's like the 3rd.... Mecca is tehir holiest place. Everyone is guilty in that situation but i cant help but feel bad for the Jews who have been chased pretty much throughout History from everywhere. The universal scope of anti-Semitism can be seen in the fact that Jews have been expelled from virtually every country in which they have resided. Jews were expelled from England in 1290, France in 1306 and 1394, Hungary in 1349 and 1360, Austria in 1421, from various places in Germany throughout the 14th, 15th and 16th centuries, from Lithuania in 1445 and 1495, Spain in 1492, Portugal in 1497, and from Bohemia and Moravia in 1744-45. Between the 15th and 18th centuries, Jews were not permitted to enter Russia, and when they were finally admitted, they were restricted to one area, the Pale of Settlement. All they have wanted was to go home... which is Isreal and this si what happeneds when they are there. i really just dont get why they just cant have it. Why Religion is such a huge reason for all of the killing over there.
That's tricky, isn't it? Was Israel or zionists the oppressors at the beginning? Is oppression inherent always to that situation? I don't think so.
Lemme put it this way- If the good 'ol US of A was currently ruled by Canada, and Mexico was overrun on the inside persecuting all those with native (pre Spaniard) blood- I wouldn't fault or protest Canada giving California or Texas to those Mexicans who were persecuted and in search of a homeland.
My family, *I*- am from California. We have homes, property, graves here. My grandmother spent her entire life here, it would be damn hard and possibly kill her- to move.
I would understand the people who were against it.
If the US wanted to return parts of the East back to Native American tribes, I wouldn't fault it.
Why? I understand the situation. What would protesting it do? I'm not interested in hating. What does hate bring? What has it brought those in the Mid-East. I'd rather carry my culture, my families history with me, instead of losing it in a piece of land. I'd rather live my life, and teach my children filled with love.
At this point and time, there is a lot of hate on both sides. Both peoples have been through terror. Both have lost people in trauma. I don't think it has to be that way, and it certainly isn't one sided.
Quoting Anonymous:
Wouldnt you hate your oppressor?
Quoting ethans_momma06:I think you've proven your own point about why the Jews deserved their own homeland. One that they had some reason to go to, some relationship to.
After all, what was supposed to happen to them when they were ejected from various countries? And it's not like staying in a country where you had just been mass slaughtered was really an option. What neighbor did they have to take them in? NONE.
I've never stated anywhere that I faulted the logic behind the Palestinians going to war. I understand the sentiment, although I don't think it's the most LOGICAL. And, while they expressed themselves, they lost. They keep losing.
Is it logical to continue on in the fashion that they have? I don't see the logic in that. I see the hate in it. I see the emotion. I don't see the logic.
Quoting Anonymous:
So you would move in with your neighbor so that someone could take your home? Give up everything youve worked your entire life for to start over because someone else said so? There is no logic behind that and I'm sure you would never agree to that so WHY should any Palestinian? Because Israel and England said so? Then they SHOULD go to war. I would go to war too! And I hope the deserving party can finally live in peace in their own homes that were theirs before 1948.
Quoting ethans_momma06:I hardly think that Israel existing inherently means that the Palestinians "suffer".
The people who had control of the land divied it up. Sucks, but there it is.
You ask why can't Jews live here since they aren't "oppressed"- but why don't you ask yourself why these refugees who are suffering cannot be excepted into the massive quantities of surrounding land. Land that shares culture/similar language. Land that shares ancestory. Land that shares Religion. After all, they and their children are already living there.
Quoting Anonymous:
So would you give me YOUR home if the government told you to?
Half of you people don't believe in welfare yet you find it completely acceptable to divvy up someone elses land like a large scale robin hood... so the Palestinians should suffer because the Jews can't find a home? Or because some book that I don't even believe in says I don't belong in my home, someone else does? I can't grasp these concepts, that its ok for Israel to steal and kill but its not ok for Palestine to fight back. I would fight you to the death for my house, my mothers house, my grandmothers house. Should I roll over and say "oh, you feel entitled to it, so its yours!"... no. I pray every single day for the Palestinian people who have lost their land, their homes, their family members and their freedom. Jewish people are not oppressed in America, so why cant they live here and leave the Palestinians to what is rightfully theirs?
Quoting JanuaryBaby06:i could be wrong but arent we already kind of involved? dont we give them money and medical supplies and weapons? we helped put them there so we should be helping them i guess.
what it comes down to is that land wouldnt be holy if not for them writing the book that religions like christianity and islam decided was so good that it would be included into their books. It's not even the holyest place in the Islam religion (like it is to the Jews). It's like the 3rd.... Mecca is tehir holiest place. Everyone is guilty in that situation but i cant help but feel bad for the Jews who have been chased pretty much throughout History from everywhere. The universal scope of anti-Semitism can be seen in the fact that Jews have been expelled from virtually every country in which they have resided. Jews were expelled from England in 1290, France in 1306 and 1394, Hungary in 1349 and 1360, Austria in 1421, from various places in Germany throughout the 14th, 15th and 16th centuries, from Lithuania in 1445 and 1495, Spain in 1492, Portugal in 1497, and from Bohemia and Moravia in 1744-45. Between the 15th and 18th centuries, Jews were not permitted to enter Russia, and when they were finally admitted, they were restricted to one area, the Pale of Settlement. All they have wanted was to go home... which is Isreal and this si what happeneds when they are there. i really just dont get why they just cant have it. Why Religion is such a huge reason for all of the killing over there.
nothing is rightfully any ones. it becomes ours because we fought for it. We practically wiped out the Indians for this land, we werent the 1st to do it either and we wont be the last. That doesnt make it right but it is kinda how things work. And if Government came in and wanted to make a highway of my street theyd try to buy me out if i didnt budge they would attempt to cease it (which here means in court but its not always that way in other countries).
it was against the law for outsiders to try to go into Palentine in the 1st half of the 19th century (per turkeys orders) but later on in the 1800s Jews started buying up all the land they could and were paying alot lot lot more then it was worth.... they were in there long before WW2..... that just happened to be the 1st time anyone "tried to help them" and they helped them the only way they know how the UN usually deal with things and that is by walking in being entitled and saying "well this is how it is now".
To answer your questions... is my house more important then my life or the lives of my family? absolutely not. i probablly would have sold out and ran long ago honestly. And why dont the Jews come here? I think when WWII happened..... It was easier to give them some place then to deal with them i'm guessing. i dont agree but from what im reading it sorta sounds that way.
Your saying you dont believe in bible, the koran, the torah.... thats fine, so many people have had their hands in the pot (esp. in the bible) that i dont blame you. I don't even know what I believe in. But all of these people do... you go into these places and its more or less the law of the land. Religion is law over there, and i cant even pretend to understand that. You would fight for your house? your mothers? well the Jews still feel like they are fighting for their homes. It is there ancestors home and like the Palenstines they are willing to kill and die for it.
Quoting Anonymous:
So would you give me YOUR home if the government told you to?
Half of you people don't believe in welfare yet you find it completely acceptable to divvy up someone elses land like a large scale robin hood... so the Palestinians should suffer because the Jews can't find a home? Or because some book that I don't even believe in says I don't belong in my home, someone else does? I can't grasp these concepts, that its ok for Israel to steal and kill but its not ok for Palestine to fight back. I would fight you to the death for my house, my mothers house, my grandmothers house. Should I roll over and say "oh, you feel entitled to it, so its yours!"... no. I pray every single day for the Palestinian people who have lost their land, their homes, their family members and their freedom. Jewish people are not oppressed in America, so why cant they live here and leave the Palestinians to what is rightfully theirs?
Quoting JanuaryBaby06:
i could be wrong but arent we already kind of involved? dont we give them money and medical supplies and weapons? we helped put them there so we should be helping them i guess.
what it comes down to is that land wouldnt be holy if not for them writing the book that religions like christianity and islam decided was so good that it would be included into their books. It's not even the holyest place in the Islam religion (like it is to the Jews). It's like the 3rd.... Mecca is tehir holiest place. Everyone is guilty in that situation but i cant help but feel bad for the Jews who have been chased pretty much throughout History from everywhere. The universal scope of anti-Semitism can be seen in the fact that Jews have been expelled from virtually every country in which they have resided. Jews were expelled from England in 1290, France in 1306 and 1394, Hungary in 1349 and 1360, Austria in 1421, from various places in Germany throughout the 14th, 15th and 16th centuries, from Lithuania in 1445 and 1495, Spain in 1492, Portugal in 1497, and from Bohemia and Moravia in 1744-45. Between the 15th and 18th centuries, Jews were not permitted to enter Russia, and when they were finally admitted, they were restricted to one area, the Pale of Settlement. All they have wanted was to go home... which is Isreal and this si what happeneds when they are there. i really just dont get why they just cant have it. Why Religion is such a huge reason for all of the killing over there.
ok this would never work. the reason #1 is because that area is where the most oil is. The area is soo rich in natural resources (hense most of the wars that both us and england and im guessing have had with the middle east) and #2 if they start using nuclear power they wont be the only ones to feel it. We have to be somewhat involved or atleast knowledgeable of whats going on because we could be affected and if they go Nuclear there is no way Europe and Asia wont feel the effects.
Quoting Anonymous:
Very true, It's sad.
Quoting Vhx:
Let them get wiped off the map.
Israel has been poking and prodding and occasionally outright attacking its way into conflict for the last 70 years. Whatever they deserve at this point, I say let them have it. Media never tells you about it here, liberal or conservative, because NO ONE dares question Israel. In fact, historically, Israel is almost always the aggressor.
Fact is, the US is Israel's bitch. They stir up conflict all around them then come crying to us with the ol' "HELP! WE'RE BEING OPPRESSED!" mantra, and we play into it every time and give them a blank check for weapons, money, medical care, military support. Israel says "jump," the US says, "how high?"
I say we, Europe and Asia wall off the entirety of the middle east, including Israel, and let them fight it out. Come back in 20 years and whomever is left, wins.
Israel is number 94, we're number 3.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_oil_production
Quoting JanuaryBaby06:ok this would never work. the reason #1 is because that area is where the most oil is. The area is soo rich in natural resources (hense most of the wars that both us and england and im guessing have had with the middle east) and #2 if they start using nuclear power they wont be the only ones to feel it. We have to be somewhat involved or atleast knowledgeable of whats going on because we could be affected and if they go Nuclear there is no way Europe and Asia wont feel the effects.
Quoting Anonymous:
Very true, It's sad.
Quoting Vhx:
Let them get wiped off the map.
Israel has been poking and prodding and occasionally outright attacking its way into conflict for the last 70 years. Whatever they deserve at this point, I say let them have it. Media never tells you about it here, liberal or conservative, because NO ONE dares question Israel. In fact, historically, Israel is almost always the aggressor.
Fact is, the US is Israel's bitch. They stir up conflict all around them then come crying to us with the ol' "HELP! WE'RE BEING OPPRESSED!" mantra, and we play into it every time and give them a blank check for weapons, money, medical care, military support. Israel says "jump," the US says, "how high?"
I say we, Europe and Asia wall off the entirety of the middle east, including Israel, and let them fight it out. Come back in 20 years and whomever is left, wins.
Quoting Anonymous:See my point?
People ignore the fact that they are committing atrocious acts against humanity and let them do whatever they want because a fucking book from 2000 years ago makes them think this is fine.
Quoting Anonymous:Sadly it''s true, whether we step in or not they will survive, they have for thousands of years and now with Iran and being completely surrounded by those who want to wipe them off the face of the map is very scary, but God Will protect them because they are his chosen people.
Quoting sweetboys4me:wish that wasn't the case.
Quoting Anonymous:Obama couldn't care less about Israel
Quoting Anonymous:
"Its not just from Torah. There are other historical documents that show the Jews were there first. Judaism was around before Islam. It makes sense that they were there first."
Most notoriously, the Western Wall is the only remaining wall from the Second Temple, which was destroyed in 70 CE. Muhammad was born 500 years after that.
Here's a little history lesson:
http://www.cafemom.com/journals/read/1370553/What_really_happened_in_the_Middle_East
And my favorite one!
http://www.cafemom.com/journals/read/1393869/Oh_yes_how_unjust_is_this
http://www.terrorismawareness.org/
Sharon
I found out via text DH has TWO other babies *update
- sweetboys4me
on Nov. 14, 2012 at 1:11 PM