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News & Politics News & Politics

What the Economic Crisis Really Means - and what we can do about it

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Are you aware of this? Do you agree or disagree? Why?

How have you made changes to your life to prepare for this?




I have been growing some of my own food for the past two years. I am still learning and right now it is a lot of hard work and is not very efficient. But we have to reclaim the land from the weeds before we can become completely organic like I want.

Still, self sustaining is not easy and when I hear people say they want to be self sustaining, I don't think they really know what that means. It affects EVERYONE, not just the lower classes. In the end, I feel like it will be those who have prepared for the major change and are ready for it that will help save those who are hiding from it or refuse to acknowledge it.

I also feel that this major collapse will mean a steep decline in the human population. Like a modern Dark Ages as our population drops to a more sustainable level. Then we can finally start rebuilding our societies. We will become a more evolved global civilization.

This is not a bad thing. It's a necessary step for our evolution. We will rather change or we will all die. I don't think we have much of a choice but to evolve.

by on Sep. 3, 2012 at 5:37 PM
Replies (21-27):
Peanutx3
by Silver Member on Sep. 4, 2012 at 2:33 PM

Interesting.

29again
by Gold Member on Sep. 4, 2012 at 2:44 PM

That is great!!  Wind is not catching on so well in my state.  There is a local community that is very opposed to it, there is going to be a huge ruckus in some way or other about it, since one group wants it, and another group is adamantly opposed to it.  I don't live in that community, so I am a bit on the fence.  Personally I have no huge issues against it, other than I feel it is not reliable enough, or affordable.  And the bird thing.  Hydro is good, I'm all for that where it can be used, but again, that can't be used everywhere. (And nuclear is horrible!!  I want NO part of that!)   I think that these alternatives will catch on, with more R&D, they will become more efficient and affordable, but I don't think we are there yet.  I do think we will be using coal, gas, and petroleum for a long time yet. 

One question about wind & solar ---  what do you do when the wind doesn't blow, and/or the sun doesn't shine?  (I'm serious, not being snarky..  I really don't get that aspect.)

Quoting Celtic_Dragon:

I think some of the problem with energy is that it is monopolized and is not local enough. In the southwestern half of my state, the wind industry is booming. There has been wind turbines there since I have lived in this state but there has been a lot more set up in the last two years. When I went through there last month, there were some being constructed. I see that as employment in an area that is an agricultural community where jobs like these are rare but very valuable.

There was once a time when fossil fuels were not efficient or cost effective. We used steam till the 1940s. It then became convenient and cheap. You do not agree that fossil fuels are no longer convenient and cheap?

 In my state, we have the Mississippi and therefore a lot of hydro energy here. And also nuclear, which is scary because the plants are old and I have a serious distrust in Excel Energy and their ability to keep the plant up to modern safety standards.

My husband and I have already talked about building our own wind turbine and having solar power when we build our home. A lot of people in our community have these energy resources. It is a very popular and profitable here.

I did know about the bird thing. I see it as this is a somewhat new technology that is only now catching on. We have to made adjustments to everything we do to make things are earth friendly as possible. I feel that a flock of birds is less important than an entire ocean. The birds are still important but the wind is still more green than the risks that are associated with fossil fuel mining and consumption.

I would not be opposed to trying a different form of economics. There are better options out there. Things that will work in our global market.

Quoting 29again:

I have yet to see an affordable alternative source of energy.  Nearly all of the solar and wind energy companies have gone bankrupt, and the ones that haven't are overseas.  People do not want wind turbines in their backyards, wind is very dangerous for the birds, but no one talks about THAT, do they?  It is always about how bad coal and petroleum are.  Well, that is what we have, that is how our machines are programmed to work, and that is what is affordable.  Now, I do agree that we would be wise to look at alternatives, but right now, at this point in time, we just cannot go wholly to solar and wind power.  As for the cars that run on electricity, how do you think those batteries get charged???  It is not through the power of one's mind!  You might save on gas at the pump, but you use more electricity for them, so I don't see a net savings. 

I guess I misunderstood what you were saying about your loan.  I thought you were not paying it NOW.  That is a hard decision, not one to take lightly.  Good luck!! 

Capitalism works.  CRONY capitalism does not.  There is a difference there.  We have had CC for way too long now. 



Clairwil
by Gold Member on Sep. 5, 2012 at 6:20 PM
Quoting 29again:
Quoting Clairwil:
Quoting 29again:

we need to go back to the gold standard

You can't.   There isn't enough gold.

I'm talking about the US, not the world.  I live here in the States, I am affected a bit more than you are by how the dollar is losing value. 

How much gold do you think you'd have to buy from China, just to back the dollars already in circulation?

29again
by Gold Member on Sep. 5, 2012 at 9:35 PM


Quoting Clairwil:

Quoting 29again:
Quoting Clairwil:
Quoting 29again:

we need to go back to the gold standard

You can't.   There isn't enough gold.

I'm talking about the US, not the world.  I live here in the States, I am affected a bit more than you are by how the dollar is losing value. 

How much gold do you think you'd have to buy from China, just to back the dollars already in circulation?

Not as much as you would think, considering how little cash is actually used here.  It's all virtual money these days...

Clairwil
by Gold Member on Sep. 6, 2012 at 1:43 AM
Quoting 29again:
Quoting Clairwil:
Quoting 29again:
Quoting Clairwil:
Quoting 29again:

we need to go back to the gold standard

You can't.   There isn't enough gold.

I'm talking about the US, not the world.  I live here in the States, I am affected a bit more than you are by how the dollar is losing value. 

How much gold do you think you'd have to buy from China, just to back the dollars already in circulation?

Not as much as you would think, considering how little cash is actually used here.  It's all virtual money these days...

The US currently has $1,000,000,000,000 in circulation.   Don't forget, a lot of countries use the US dollar as a reserve currency.

The US gold reserve is about 8,000 tonnes.   At today's price of $1700 per troy ounce, that's worth about $400,000,000,000

So to move over to the gold standard the US would have to more than double its holding of gold.   Which, as soon as the US started to buy gold in those sorts of quantities, would drive the price throught the roof.   If you wanted to avoid doing that, you'd have to spread the purchases over a period of decades.

29again
by Gold Member on Sep. 6, 2012 at 2:27 AM


Quoting Clairwil:

Quoting 29again:
Quoting Clairwil:
Quoting 29again:
Quoting Clairwil:
Quoting 29again:

we need to go back to the gold standard

You can't.   There isn't enough gold.

I'm talking about the US, not the world.  I live here in the States, I am affected a bit more than you are by how the dollar is losing value. 

How much gold do you think you'd have to buy from China, just to back the dollars already in circulation?

Not as much as you would think, considering how little cash is actually used here.  It's all virtual money these days...

The US currently has $1,000,000,000,000 in circulation.   Don't forget, a lot of countries use the US dollar as a reserve currency.

The US gold reserve is about 8,000 tonnes.   At today's price of $1700 per troy ounce, that's worth about $400,000,000,000

So to move over to the gold standard the US would have to more than double its holding of gold.   Which, as soon as the US started to buy gold in those sorts of quantities, would drive the price throught the roof.   If you wanted to avoid doing that, you'd have to spread the purchases over a period of decades.

And those countries that use the dollar as a reserve, do they have actual dollars, or do they have virtual dollars?  If they have Virtual dollars, I don't see why the change can't be done now or over a short period of time.  If they have actual dollars, then I don't know. 

I guess I don't know either way.  But what I do know is that it reinforces my opinion that a global market is not wise or prudent.  I still say we need to go back to the gold standard. 

Lacey14
by Bronze Member on Sep. 6, 2012 at 3:09 AM

It sounds like propoganda or a scare tactic to prepare us for globalization.

Quoting 29again:

The video reminded me quite a bit of "The Story of Stuff" which was nothing more than propaganda.  I am not saying this is, but I can't say that I agree with it all that much.  I do in parts, to degrees, but there is an undertone that I can't ignore which tells me there is an ulterior motive to this one.  I don't think it is quite what it seems. 

Overall, yes our money system is completely flawed, we need to go back to the gold standard.  Yes, it would help tremendously if more people grew their own food, or at least part of it.  We should make what we need, and use it as long as we can, rather than buy a new disposable one every so often.  We do need to relearn old forgotten skills and trades,   My opinion is that if/when this collapse happens, globalisation will take a back seat.  And I will not be upset by that. 

I have had a garden most of the 16 years that I have had my house.  (There were a couple of years in there when I could not have a garden.)  I had an issue with GMO's and Monsanto long before I was concerned about being as self-reliant as I could be. 


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