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Biden, Ryan talk Abortion, Catholic social teaching in VP Debate

Posted by on Oct. 12, 2012 at 10:08 AM
  • 139 Replies
1 mom liked this

 
Vice President Joe Biden and Republican vice presidential nominee Rep. Paul Ryan after their debate on Oct. 11, 2012. (AP)

During their only debate this campaign season Thursday night, Vice President Joe Biden and Congressman Paul Ryan (R-Wis.) discussed how their Catholic beliefs have shaped their views on abortion.

“Please talk about how you came to that decision,” asked debate moderator Martha Raddatz, ABC’s senior foreign correspondent. “Talk about how your religion played a part in that. And, please, this is such an emotional issue for so many people in this country.

In the only debate between the candidates, Biden and Ryan discussed their views on domestic issues such as the economy, foreign policy and the role of the vice president. Biden and Ryan faced off in the sole vice-presidential debate from Centre College in Danville, Ky.

Near the end of the debate, Raddatz asked about the role their religion has played in their own personal views on abortion.

“I don’t see how a person can separate their public life from their private life or from their faith,” Ryan said. “Our faith informs us in everything we do. My faith informs me about how to take care of the vulnerable, of how to make sure that people have a chance in life.”

“Now, you want to ask basically why I’m pro-life? It’s not simply because of my Catholic faith. That’s a factor, of course. But it’s also because of reason and science.

The Republican vice-presidential candidate shared how his eldest daughter’s nickname is “Bean” due to how she appeared in her first ultrasound. He also said that he’s troubled by what he feels is the Obama administration’s infringement on “our first freedom, the freedom of religion, by infringing on Catholic charities, Catholic churches, Catholic hospitals. Our church should not have to sue our federal government to maintain their religious liberties.

Biden challenged what Ryan’s characterization of the health-care reform as an assault on the Catholic Church, noting that “no religious institution, Catholic or otherwise, including Catholic Social Services, Georgetown Hospital, Mercy Hospital, any hospital, none has to either refer contraception, none has to pay for contraception, none has to be a vehicle to get contraception in any insurance policy they provide. That is a fact.”

He said that while he’s been a practicing Catholic all his life and his faith informs his social doctrine.

“The Catholic social doctrine talks about taking care of those who -- who can’t take care of themselves, people who need help. With regard to -- with regard to abortion, I accept my church’s position on abortion as a -- what we call a (inaudible) doctrine. Life begins at conception in the church’s judgment. I accept it in my personal life.

While he accepts the church’s doctrine when it comes to abortion, he refuses to “impose that on others.”

“I do not believe that we have a right to tell other people that -- women they can’t control their body. It’s a decision between them and their doctor. In my view and the Supreme Court, I’m not going to interfere with that.”

Ryan emphasized made clear Republican presidential candidate Mitt Romney and would oppose abortions with “exceptions for rape, incest and life of the mother.”

(Washington Post)


 



"How can there be too many children? That is like saying there are too many flowers." - Mother Teresa




 

by on Oct. 12, 2012 at 10:08 AM
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imamomzilla
by on Oct. 12, 2012 at 10:08 AM
5 moms liked this

 I think Ryan nailed it!

"The greatest destroyer of love and peace is abortion, which is war against the child. The mother doesn't learn to love, but kills to solve her own problems. Any country that accepts abortion is not teaching its people to love, but to use any violence to get what they want."









"It is a poverty to decide that a child must die so that you may live as you wish."


-Mother Teresa



 





 

ladybugist
by Member on Oct. 12, 2012 at 10:19 AM
9 moms liked this

Biden compromised his morals to go along with the dems agenda.

blondekosmic15
by Blonde on Oct. 12, 2012 at 10:44 AM
4 moms liked this

 

Quoting ladybugist:

Biden comprimised his morals to go along with the dems agenda.

I am a practicing Catholic, 34 yrs. Biden has seriously compromised his morals and the laws of the Church. Biden has no business receiving holy Communion. You cannot rec' the Eucharist when you believe in or support abortion. All the yrs of support for abortion he is responsible for in Congress.  I have watched many Candidates do what Biden has done. Many yrs ago Ted Kennedy was prolife. To align with the pro-abortion platform of the Dem party, he was willing to compromise his faith. Jesse Jackson formerly was prolife. Same situation. He's not Catholic but he's a Christian, a Reverend~

blondekosmic15
by Blonde on Oct. 12, 2012 at 10:46 AM
5 moms liked this

 

Abortion

2270 Human life must be respected and protected absolutely from the moment of conception. From the first moment of his existence, a human being must be recognized as having the rights of a person - among which is the inviolable right of every innocent being to life.72

Before I formed you in the womb I knew you, and before you were born I consecrated you.73

My frame was not hidden from you, when I was being made in secret, intricately wrought in the depths of the earth.74

2271 Since the first century the Church has affirmed the moral evil of every procured abortion. This teaching has not changed and remains unchangeable. Direct abortion, that is to say, abortion willed either as an end or a means, is gravely contrary to the moral law:

You shall not kill the embryo by abortion and shall not cause the newborn to perish.75

God, the Lord of life, has entrusted to men the noble mission of safeguarding life, and men must carry it out in a manner worthy of themselves. Life must be protected with the utmost care from the moment of conception: abortion and infanticide are abominable crimes.76

2272 Formal cooperation in an abortion constitutes a grave offense. The Church attaches the canonical penalty of excommunication to this crime against human life. "A person who procures a completed abortion incurs excommunication latae sententiae,"77 "by the very commission of the offense,"78 and subject to the conditions provided by Canon Law.79 The Church does not thereby intend to restrict the scope of mercy. Rather, she makes clear the gravity of the crime committed, the irreparable harm done to the innocent who is put to death, as well as to the parents and the whole of society.

2273 The inalienable right to life of every innocent human individual is a constitutive element of a civil society and its legislation:

"The inalienable rights of the person must be recognized and respected by civil society and the political authority. These human rights depend neither on single individuals nor on parents; nor do they represent a concession made by society and the state; they belong to human nature and are inherent in the person by virtue of the creative act from which the person took his origin. Among such fundamental rights one should mention in this regard every human being's right to life and physical integrity from the moment of conception until death."80

"The moment a positive law deprives a category of human beings of the protection which civil legislation ought to accord them, the state is denying the equality of all before the law. When the state does not place its power at the service of the rights of each citizen, and in particular of the more vulnerable, the very foundations of a state based on law are undermined. . . . As a consequence of the respect and protection which must be ensured for the unborn child from the moment of conception, the law must provide appropriate penal sanctions for every deliberate violation of the child's rights."81

http://www.vatican.va/archive/ccc_css/archive/catechism/p3s2c2a5.htm

deepthinker
by Member on Oct. 12, 2012 at 11:02 AM
7 moms liked this

I'm an Atheist but I'm going to chime in on this little religious discussion. How did Biden compromise his morals, and Ryan did not.  If you believe that Abortion is murder or is wrong and have that mentality.  Then even if a woman is raped, there is incest, or she could possibly lose her life, then abortion still would wrong. Correct? Biden didn't compromise his own morality in the eyes of his religion, because he stated what he believed, but said it is not his place to impose his beliefs on anyone else. 

Which it is not.

Biden did not speak on exceptions to the rule, he spoke on the doctrine of his faith.  Yet he acknowledges his faith is not to be forced on anyone else, because it is our rights as American citizens to have freedom of religion. Of anything Ryan is the one who compromised his faith by making exceptions to the teaching of his faith which is not accepted in his doctrine.

blondekosmic15
by Blonde on Oct. 12, 2012 at 11:10 AM
3 moms liked this

Abortion is murder. To say you accept the Church's teaching concerning this moral law but have no right to defend the unborn child if a woman chooses to end that life is hypocrisy! Rev. 3:16. To claim you care about the poor, the hungry, the homeless, the unemployed, the sick but defend a woman's decision to kill her child is a grave act of hyprocrisy!

quote>

“The Catholic social doctrine talks about taking care of those who -- who can’t take care of themselves, people who need help. With regard to -- with regard to abortion, I accept my church’s position on abortion as a -- what we call a (inaudible) doctrine. Life begins at conception in the church’s judgment. I accept it in my personal life.

mommom2000
by Bronze Member on Oct. 12, 2012 at 11:22 AM
1 mom liked this

How did he compromise his morals.  He believes that abortion isn't a choice he would make as a catholic, but sees that everyone should be allowed to make that choice for themselves.  Just because you don't push your beliefs on others doesn't mean you compromise your morals.  He is open minded enough to know everyone believes differently.

Quoting ladybugist:

Biden comprimised his morals to go along with the dems agenda.


imamomzilla
by on Oct. 12, 2012 at 11:24 AM
4 moms liked this

 bowing down

Quoting blondekosmic15:

Abortion is murder. To say you accept the Church's teaching concerning this moral law but have no right to defend the unborn child if a woman chooses to end that vulnerable human life is hypocrisy! Rev. 3:16. To claim you care about the poor, the hungry, the homeless, the unemployed, the sick but defend a woman's decision to kill her child is a grave act of hyprocrisy!

quote>

“The Catholic social doctrine talks about taking care of those who -- who can’t take care of themselves, people who need help. With regard to -- with regard to abortion, I accept my church’s position on abortion as a -- what we call a (inaudible) doctrine. Life begins at conception in the church’s judgment. I accept it in my personal life.

 



daniegrrl
by Member on Oct. 12, 2012 at 11:38 AM
3 moms liked this

Abortion is not a preferred choice for me but that doesn't mean that I have to enforce that on others. Abortion isn't all about religion and when you look at it both men have compromised their morals in this part of the debate because I believe that there is no room on this topic in the Catholic faith. Biden was fantastic in this. Trying to enforce ones views and morals on someone else is not giving them freedom and when it comes down to it I don't want a man telling me what I can or cannot do with my body. 

We have people out there who are pro-life but yet have no children of their own or do anything to help those children who are in need. If you aren't prepared to do anything to help and just pass judgement STFU!!!! 

I have 8 children and I go everyday with the looks and comments that are harsh and cruel because yes we do receive PA to help our family because in this economy we can't make enough money to support our family. I have gone back to school to change my career so I can better support my family. So when it comes to pro-life I am very passionately against it for many reasons:

1. We should be able to choose for ourselves 2. Not all of these pro-life people practice what they preach

Get a clue people it can start with abortion and if we give in the right to choose what to do with our bodies on that regard what will be the next right that they will go after.

I think we should just all agree to disagree on this one.

blondekosmic15
by Blonde on Oct. 12, 2012 at 11:47 AM
3 moms liked this

 

Quoting deepthinker:

I'm an Atheist but I'm going to chime in on this little religious discussion. How did Biden compromise his morals, and Ryan did not.  If you believe that Abortion is murder or is wrong and have that mentality.  Then even if a woman is raped, there is incest, or she could possibly lose her life, then abortion still would wrong. Correct? Biden didn't compromise his own morality in the eyes of his religion, because he stated what he believed, but said it is not his place to impose his beliefs on anyone else. 

Thank you for your questions and concerns. I am a 100% prolife. I was brutally beaten up, choked & raped by 2 men when I was 20 y/o. The innocent child does not deserve the death penalty to pay for the sins of the father. Paul Ryan's record concedes he is prolife. My understanding, Romney is the one who believes in exceptions. We are discussing the destruction of vulnerable human life. A Catholic cannot believe in nor support abortion and remain in the state of grace. We can sin in thought, word and deed. There are sins of omission one can commit. I have personally spoken to Physicians, read numerous medical articles, listened to many Drs being interviewed who respect life who say, whenever a life threatening complication arises, they are obligated to try and save both mother and child.

Which it is not.

Biden did not speak on exceptions to the rule, he spoke on the doctrine of his faith.  Yet he acknowledges his faith is not to be forced on anyone else, because it is our rights as American citizens to have freedom of religion. Of anything Ryan is the one who compromised his faith by making exceptions to the teaching of his faith which is not accepted in his doctrine.

Biden spoke on the doctrine of his faith but he severely compromises his faith when he supports a woman's choice to kill her unborn child. Silence is acceptance. The Church teaches abortion is murder. The Catholic Church has been consistent thru out the Centuries for more than 2000 yrs concerning this moral doctrine. Mitt Romney is not Catholic. He supports exceptions. Joe Biden is responsible for his yrs of support for abortion legislation. Yes, he is guilty of compromise and condoning a grave sin. Remember Lucifer is very clever. Centuries of practice. The devil is behind every abortion. He is the master of deception in terms of double talk and deceiving many. His primary goal, to attack God and destroy God's creation. What better way than to influence ppl. to partake in the destruction of human life. The unborn child is voiceless. We have the obligation to defend the most vulnerable when they are incapable of protecting their own life~

 

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