Michael Badnarik's Constitution Class 2/42
Based on what Badnarik says in the video about the corrolation between property ownership and rights, is it any wonder that our current government pushes the use of credit so much?
Do you see a connection between government control via the credit issued by banks?
If you had to describe in your own words how we have rights, and by what standard those rights are obtained, what would you say? (This will come in handy when trying to explain to others about their rights)
At the beginning Badnarik is reading from the Constitution and states that those who are educated and informed are the ones who will protect against corruption. Do you think that the government-funded education system has dumbed down recent generations? Do you think it is by accident or on purpose?
Based on what Badnarik says in the video about the corrolation between property ownership and rights, is it any wonder that our current government pushes the use of credit so much? It really isnt, and thats sad, but look at how much our government spends in credit.
Do you see a connection between government control via the credit issued by banks? yes, but in light of the bank bailouts lately it seems like the bank controls the government in stead of the other way.
sierraaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa
If you had to describe in your own words how we have rights, and by what standard those rights are obtained, what would you say? (This will come in handy when trying to explain to others about their rights) I would say that we have rights given to us but what ever non-denomitational higher power created humanity. some rights like to live and persure happiness are usually free to obtain but property right like he talks about are very hard to get if you want to own something. (I hope im understanding the question)
phoenix
At the beginning Badnarik is reading from the Constitution and states that those who are educated and informed are the ones who will protect against corruption. Do you think that the government-funded education system has dumbed down recent generations? Do you think it is by accident or on purpose? WOW i really do think it has dumbed on purpose, and alot of it is with the silly rituals of schools that we have like prom and homecomming and supurlatives for year books and class rings and I almost want to say sports but i think physical education is important for kids too. Kids in europe and Japan dont have these things. and they are in school 6 days a week. That sound like a lot but we barely make if 5 days a week for most of the year.
also you may have noticed I typed sierra and phoenix in the computer, thats because my daughter is in my lap and she typed her and her brothers names and she is watching me so I cant delete them so please ignore them
Quoting Eilish:
Based on what Badnarik says in the video about the corrolation between property ownership and rights, is it any wonder that our current government pushes the use of credit so much? By "pushing" credit the government makes the whole of the country beholden to them. They have made us slaves to their whim and will. This is why so many Americans are buying into the current propaganda coming from DC the we need to be "rescued" by the very people who legislated us into this crisis.Do you see a connection between government control via the credit issued by banks? If we all have debt that we have to pay back to banks and the banks are funded or owned by the government, then we are all owned by the government. Our homes and land, our cars, our belongings can be taken by the government at any time. This is an blatant way for the federal government to circumvent the established laws of property rights.
Giving money and power to government is like giving whiskey and car keys to teenage boys.
– P.J. O'RourkeIf you had to describe in your own words how we have rights, and by what standard those rights are obtained, what would you say? (This will come in handy when trying to explain to others about their rights) As in our other discussion, I believe our rights are given to us by our "higher power" ,be it God , Allah, Buddha, Mother Nature or whom ever it is you, the individual, believe you placed you( ie humanity) on this planet. Those rights can not be negotiated or rescinded by any government entity. They can't take away something they don't have the ability to grant.
At the beginning Badnarik is reading from the Constitution and states that those who are educated and informed are the ones who will protect against corruption. Do you think that the government-funded education system has dumbed down recent generations? Do you think it is by accident or on purpose? I believe the government allows children to "learn" what the government wants people to know.
That erroneous assumption is to the effect that the aim of public education is to fill the young of the species with knowledge and awaken their intelligence, and so make them fit to discharge the duties of citizenship in an enlightened and independent manner. Nothing could be further from the truth. The aim of public education is not to spread enlightenment at all, it is simply to reduce as many individuals as possible to the same safe level, to breed and train a standardized citizenry, to put down dissent and originality. That is its aim in the United States, whatever the pretensions of politicians, pedagogues and other such mountebanks, and that is its aim everywhere else.
– H.L. Mencken
Here are some other "interesting" quotes on education from people you may recognize. It's long but well worth the perusal...
A public school
system, if it means the providing of free education for those who
desire it, is a noteworthy and beneficent achievement of modern times;
but when once it becomes monopolistic it is the most perfect instrument
of tyranny which has yet been devised. Freedom of thought in the middle
ages was combated by the Inquisition, but the modern method is far more
effective. Place the lives of children in their formative years,
despite the convictions of their parents, under the intimate control of
experts appointed by the state, force them then to attend schools where
the higher aspirations of humanity are crushed out, and where the mind
is filled with the materialism of the day, and it is difficult to see
how even the remnants of liberty can subsist. Such a tyranny, supported
as it is by a perverse technique used as the instrument in destroying
human souls, is certainly far more dangerous than the crude tyrannies
of the past, which despite their weapons of fire and sword permitted
thought at least to be free. The truth is that the materialistic
paternalism of the present day, if allowed to go on unchecked, will
rapidly make of America one huge "Main Street," where spiritual
adventure will be discouraged and democracy will be regarded as
consisting in the reduction of all mankind to the proportions of the
narrowest and least gifted of the citizens. God grant that there may
come a reaction, and that the great principles of Anglo-Saxon liberty
may be rediscovered before it is too late!
– J. Gresham Machen (1923)(rather prophetic, huh?)
"Parent choice''
proceeds from the belief that the purpose of education is to provide
individual students with an education. In fact, educating the
individual is but a means to the true end of education, which is to
create a viable social order to which individuals contribute and by
which they are sustained. "Family choice'' is, therefore, basically
selfish and anti-social in that it focuses on the "wants'' of a single
family rather than the "needs'' of society.
– Association of California School Administrators (Time to wake up America!)
Academies that are
founded at public expense are instituted not so much to cultivate men's
natural abilities as to restrain them.
– Baruch Spinoza (1632-1677)
Men had better be without education than be educated by their rulers.– Thomas Hodgskin, 1823
A general State
education is a mere contrivance for moulding people to be exactly like
one another; and as the mould in which it casts them is that which
pleases the dominant power in the government, whether this be a
monarch, an aristocracy, or a majority of the existing generation; in
proportion as it is efficient and successful, it establishes a
despotism over the mind, leading by a natural tendency to one over the
body.
– John Stuart Mill, "On Liberty"
Wherever is found
what is called a paternal government, there is found state education.
It has been discovered that the best way to insure implicit obedience
is to commence tyranny in the nursery.
– Benjamin Disraeli, British Prime Minister (1874)
The education of all
children, from the moment that they can get along without a mother's
care, shall be in state institutions at state expense.
– Karl Marx, "The Communist Manifesto"
The children who
know how to think for themselves spoil the harmony of the collective
society which is coming, where everyone would be interdependent.
– John Dewey, American educator
The individual has
always had to struggle to keep from being overwhelmed by the tribe. To
be your own man is hard business. If you try it, you will be lonely
often, and sometimes frightened. But no price is too high to pay for
the privilege of owning yourself.
– Rudyard Kipling
Only a system of state-controlled schools can be free to teach whatever the welfare of the State may demand.
– Ellwood P. Cubberley, Dean of the Stanford University School of Education(sound familiar?)
The urge to save humanity is almost always a false-face for the urge to rule it.
– H.L. Mencken
We must create out
of the younger generation a generation of Communists. We must turn
children, who can be shaped like wax, into real, good Communists.... We
must remove the children from the crude influence of their families. We
must take them over and, to speak frankly, nationalize them.(are we there yet?) From the
first days of their lives they will be under the healthy influence of
Communist children's nurseries and schools. There they will grow up to
be real Communists.
– Communist Party Education Workers Congress (1918)
Of all tyrannies, a
tyranny exercised for the good of its victims may be the most
oppressive. It may be better to live under robber barons than under
omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes
sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who
torment us for our own good will torment us without end, for they do so
with the approval of their own conscience.
– C.S. Lewis
It is the absolute right of the State to supervise the formation of public opinion.
– Joseph Goebbels, Nazi Germany(are we scared yet?)
Education is a weapon, whose effect depends on who holds it in his hands and at whom it is aimed.
– Joseph Stalin
The more subsidized
it is, the less free it is. What is known as "free education" is the
least free of all, for it is a state-owned institution; it is
socialized education - just like socialized medicine or the socialized
post office - and cannot possibly be separated from political control.
– Frank Chodorov, "Why Free Schools Are Not Free"
Those in society who
are in charge of schools must never forget that the parents have been
appointed by God himself as the first and principal educators of their
children and that their right is completely inalienable.
– Pope John Paul II
In all countries,
in all centuries, the primary reason for government to set up schools
is to undermine the politically weak by convincing their children that
the leaders are good and their policies are wise. The core is religious
intolerance. The sides simply change between the Atheists, Catholics,
Protestants, Unitarians, etc., depending whether you are talking about
the Soviet Union, the Austro-Hungarian Empire, America, etc. A common
second reason is to prepare the boys to go to war and the girls to
cheer them on.
– Marshall Fritz, Founder of The Alliance for the Separation of School & State
Charter schools are just public schools on a slightly longer leash. A dog on a long leash is still a dog on a leash.
– Marshall Fritz
Nothing enrages
me more than when people criticize my criticism of school by telling me
that schools are not just places to learn maths and spelling, they are
places where children learn a vaguely defined thing called
socialization. I know. I think schools generally do an effective and
terribly damaging job of teaching children to be infantile, dependent,
intellectually dishonest, passive and disrespectful to their own
developmental capacities.
– Seymour Papert
A family member
asked my wife, "Aren't you concerned about his (our son's)
socialization with other kids?" My wife gave this response: "Go to your
local middle school, junior high, or high school, walk down the
hallways, and tell me which behavior you see that you think our son
should emulate."
– Manfred B. Zysk (yeah home schooler!)
Government schools
can't teach reading, writing, and arithmetic – why should we trust them
to teach morality, respect, and character? If public education does for
ethics what it's done for learning, we'll end up with a generation of
immoral, disrespectful, and characterless students.
– Steve Dasbach (Ithink we already have)
Whenever people talk
glibly of a need to achieve educational "excellence," I think of what
an improvement it would be if our public schools could just achieve
mediocrity.
– Thomas Sowell (So true, so true)
When the state or
federal government controls the education of all of our children, they
have the dangerous and illegitimate monopoly to control and influence
the thought process of our citizens.
–Michael Badnarik, 2004 Libertarian Party Presidential Candidate
Sarah Batz
Bad Spellers of America Unight!
Great quotes sarah!
Emancipate yourself from mental slavery, none but ourselves can free our minds-Bob Marley
Check out my Group at CafeMom
Quoting Eilish:
Based on what Badnarik says in the video about the corrolation between property ownership and rights, is it any wonder that our current government pushes the use of credit so much? To me, it seems that credit is the "American way". (And the more I'm learning, it seems to be the way of the world) With property ownership you gain certain rights but I see taking out credit on that property as a privilege. Indebtedness now turns into the right of the banker/goverment to sieze your property.
Do you see a connection between government control via the credit issued by banks? Absolutely, aren't they essentially the same?
If you had to describe in your own words how we have rights, and by what standard those rights are obtained, what would you say? (This will come in handy when trying to explain to others about their rights) Rights are not obtained, they just are. They are not something that is given nor taken away.
At the beginning Badnarik is reading from the Constitution and states that those who are educated and informed are the ones who will protect against corruption. Do you think that the government-funded education system has dumbed down recent generations? Do you think it is by accident or on purpose? This one is a hard one for me to comment on for some reason. I do not think the education system has on purpose dumbed down recent generations. I feel that education of our children is in the hands of the parents and in the end the parent is responsible. My daughter goes to public school (kindergarten) and I supplement at home. I do not feel that the education the state provides is intended to be the sole souce of education and learning. I guess what I'm trying to say is that the level of dumbness of you/me or your/my child is your/my responsibility. :D
Based on what Badnarik says in the video about the corrolation between property ownership and rights, is it any wonder that our current government pushes the use of credit so much?
In what way does our government PUSH the use of credit? And, are you speaking about state gov'ts' or local or federal or all? I see that the GOV"Ts use credit and perhaps by 'example' 'push' it, but I don't recall ever being PUSHED by any gov't entity to take out credit. Please clarify.
Do you see a connection between government control via the credit issued by banks?
Only to the degree of their influence/regulatory status over them. But, again, since I have never been PUSHED by the govt to request credit be 'extended' to me, I do not see it on 'individuals'. With regards to the monies that all of us deposit into those banks and to the degree that businesses rely on extended credit yes. I think they exercise MORE overt control when they mandate that those businesses take MY income and MATCH it with their own funds and forward that money to the gov't OR they face prosecution. That is much more troubling than the WILLFUL choice of individual or business to request a credit line.
If you had to describe in your own words how we have rights, and by what standard those rights are obtained, what would you say? (This will come in handy when trying to explain to others about their rights)
If someone 'extends' it to you, it's not a right, but a privilege. A right is something over which NO PERSON or entity has discretion.
At the beginning Badnarik is reading from the Constitution and states that those who are educated and informed are the ones who will protect against corruption. Do you think that the government-funded education system has dumbed down recent generations?
YES
Do you think it is by accident or on purpose?
Unequivocally there has always been agenda driven people who saw it as a vehicle to promote their ideals. Let's not forget that the FIRST institutions of learning were set up by the religious communities with the EXPRESS intent of keeping morality at the forefront. That was soon followed by the 'Conscience' driven women who wanted schooling for the poor children so they could teach them proper 'culture', hygeine, manners, and provide them with some skills...they wanted them OFF of the streets, to be 'molded' in the 'right' way to behave. Then there are those who decided to use the public schools to strip away parental authority by suggesting they were better equipped to teach sex education or about the problems with drugs etc. Society was told that it would be through education that there would be no need to discuss legality or illegality of abortion, because the problem was one of timid parents too embarrassed to discuss sex or drugs or whatever openly with their children. We've seen them used for social engineering from allowing boys and girls to be schooled together to integration to what role a child should play in their family to reporting 'suspect' parents to suggesting the religion of the parents must be 'set aside' for the 'real' science or learning to teaching that lifestyle choices are biological and not conscious choices...So, while I DO think there ARE deliberate actions we could point to, I do not think anyone could support an argument of any ORGANIZED and SPECIFIC entity pushing through these agenda. But that many have seen it and used it as a tool for so much MORE than academia.
The credit/debt system has been pushed on you via the Federal Reserve ... our monetary system is not backed by gold or silver, but on "good faith" or credit. The only reason why you have dollars (and bear with for a minute) is because you owe debt in some form or another .... the dollar is not a monetary certificate but rather an IOU. If all debt in America was payed off (in the private, public and government sectors) there would be no dollars in circulation. So you actually have been pushed to use credit without even knowing it.
Aside from that, it is now a way of life to owe for a home, a car, credit cards, furnishings, etc..... Your credibility as a trust worthy person is now ENTIRELY based on your credit score. If you servive within our society, then you have credit pushed on in order to survive. If you live outside of the system, then you are forced to live outside of society.
Our government now pays for everything with debt. The bail out for example. That is money that the Fed will print up that is payed for by your children's credit - they will be the one's who owe the money back. The war has been payed for by credit - either to other countries or the Fed.
Google - fiat currency.
Quoting norwegianwood:
Based on what Badnarik says in the video about the corrolation between property ownership and rights, is it any wonder that our current government pushes the use of credit so much?
In what way does our government PUSH the use of credit? And, are you speaking about state gov'ts' or local or federal or all? I see that the GOV"Ts use credit and perhaps by 'example' 'push' it, but I don't recall ever being PUSHED by any gov't entity to take out credit. Please clarify.
Do you see a connection between government control via the credit issued by banks?
Only to the degree of their influence/regulatory status over them. But, again, since I have never been PUSHED by the govt to request credit be 'extended' to me, I do not see it on 'individuals'. With regards to the monies that all of us deposit into those banks and to the degree that businesses rely on extended credit yes. I think they exercise MORE overt control when they mandate that those businesses take MY income and MATCH it with their own funds and forward that money to the gov't OR they face prosecution. That is much more troubling than the WILLFUL choice of individual or business to request a credit line.
If you had to describe in your own words how we have rights, and by what standard those rights are obtained, what would you say? (This will come in handy when trying to explain to others about their rights)
If someone 'extends' it to you, it's not a right, but a privilege. A right is something over which NO PERSON or entity has discretion.
At the beginning Badnarik is reading from the Constitution and states that those who are educated and informed are the ones who will protect against corruption. Do you think that the government-funded education system has dumbed down recent generations?
YES
Do you think it is by accident or on purpose?
Unequivocally there has always been agenda driven people who saw it as a vehicle to promote their ideals. Let's not forget that the FIRST institutions of learning were set up by the religious communities with the EXPRESS intent of keeping morality at the forefront. That was soon followed by the 'Conscience' driven women who wanted schooling for the poor children so they could teach them proper 'culture', hygeine, manners, and provide them with some skills...they wanted them OFF of the streets, to be 'molded' in the 'right' way to behave. Then there are those who decided to use the public schools to strip away parental authority by suggesting they were better equipped to teach sex education or about the problems with drugs etc. Society was told that it would be through education that there would be no need to discuss legality or illegality of abortion, because the problem was one of timid parents too embarrassed to discuss sex or drugs or whatever openly with their children. We've seen them used for social engineering from allowing boys and girls to be schooled together to integration to what role a child should play in their family to reporting 'suspect' parents to suggesting the religion of the parents must be 'set aside' for the 'real' science or learning to teaching that lifestyle choices are biological and not conscious choices...So, while I DO think there ARE deliberate actions we could point to, I do not think anyone could support an argument of any ORGANIZED and SPECIFIC entity pushing through these agenda. But that many have seen it and used it as a tool for so much MORE than academia.
Quoting Eilish:
The credit/debt system has been pushed on you via the Federal Reserve ... our monetary system is not backed by gold or silver, but on "good faith" or credit. The only reason why you have dollars (and bear with for a minute) is because you owe debt in some form or another .... the dollar is not a monetary certificate but rather an IOU. If all debt in America was payed off (in the private, public and government sectors) there would be no dollars in circulation. So you actually have been pushed to use credit without even knowing it.
Actually, I think it a bit of a stretch. Even if it were backed by gold or silver, as it Britain, there would be paper money because it simply isn't realistic for people to carry around slabs of gold or coin. So, even in that case, it is STILL basically an 'iou' backed or no with gold or silver. Only to the degree that the value of said 'iou' fluctuates is it 'credit' really, and that would be the case even if backed by gold or silver, because as comodities, their value is also unfixed. I do believe that it was wrong to move away from the gold standard, but not because of this fairly LOOSE association to 'credit'.
Aside from that, it is now a way of life to owe for a home, a car, credit cards, furnishings, etc..... Your credibility as a trust worthy person is now ENTIRELY based on your credit score. If you servive within our society, then you have credit pushed on in order to survive. If you live outside of the system, then you are forced to live outside of society.
I also don't buy into 'it's pushed' and therefore it is not MY choice. I NEVER had any credit until I married my husband who had TONS--his 1st wife had QVC on speed-dial. And, no you are not forced to live 'outside' of society. It may come as a shock to you but COUNTLESS thousands of Americans get by just FINE without credit. AND..that's not the 'gov't' PUSHING me, but PRIVATE industry. In the end, it's still MY choice. You use the same argument that many use to suggest that mortgage BUYERS who bought more than they could afford were not 'responsible' ..it was the greedy, looking for a living realtors and mortgage brokers who FORCED them into shady deals...sorry. When I bought my first house, I didn't ask THEM to tell ME what I could afford. I asked them how much house a set monthly payment-that I calculated I was willing to spend--would get me. And I DIDN"T BUDGE on that. I don't know why THEY couldn't have done the same. They were JUST as accountable...more so, imo. I grew up hearing 'Buyer Beware' ...and I DID.
Our government now pays for everything with debt. The bail out for example. That is money that the Fed will print up that is payed for by your children's credit - they will be the one's who owe the money back. The war has been payed for by credit - either to other countries or the Fed.
Well, first of all, I heard a discussion on just this issue and in fact it has not yet been decided. The PRIMARY choice would be BONDS, not printing money, but either results in just putting off actually PAYING as you spend, so point taken. It's just that the latter involves INFLATION on top of deficit, interest spending on our children.
I wasn't questioning this, but the wording makes it sound as if you think it a deliberate move to 'make citizens' dependent upon credit. I don't see it quite that way. I think these things come about rather too haphazard and convoluted to suggest conspiracy to bring about the mess...it's like with the schools...one little 'brilliant' idea or agenda at a time. But, ULTIMATELY...who's responsible for the state we're in? I say WE THE PEOPLE...WE allow it.
P
Google - fiat currency.
We seem to be having a miscomunication in terms here ... I will have to do some digging to show you what i am talking about....back later.
Quoting norwegianwood:
Quoting Eilish:
The credit/debt system has been pushed on you via the Federal Reserve ... our monetary system is not backed by gold or silver, but on "good faith" or credit. The only reason why you have dollars (and bear with for a minute) is because you owe debt in some form or another .... the dollar is not a monetary certificate but rather an IOU. If all debt in America was payed off (in the private, public and government sectors) there would be no dollars in circulation. So you actually have been pushed to use credit without even knowing it.
Actually, I think it a bit of a stretch. Even if it were backed by gold or silver, as it Britain, there would be paper money because it simply isn't realistic for people to carry around slabs of gold or coin. So, even in that case, it is STILL basically an 'iou' backed or no with gold or silver. Only to the degree that the value of said 'iou' fluctuates is it 'credit' really, and that would be the case even if backed by gold or silver, because as comodities, their value is also unfixed. I do believe that it was wrong to move away from the gold standard, but not because of this fairly LOOSE association to 'credit'.
Aside from that, it is now a way of life to owe for a home, a car, credit cards, furnishings, etc..... Your credibility as a trust worthy person is now ENTIRELY based on your credit score. If you servive within our society, then you have credit pushed on in order to survive. If you live outside of the system, then you are forced to live outside of society.
I also don't buy into 'it's pushed' and therefore it is not MY choice. I NEVER had any credit until I married my husband who had TONS--his 1st wife had QVC on speed-dial. And, no you are not forced to live 'outside' of society. It may come as a shock to you but COUNTLESS thousands of Americans get by just FINE without credit. AND..that's not the 'gov't' PUSHING me, but PRIVATE industry. In the end, it's still MY choice. You use the same argument that many use to suggest that mortgage BUYERS who bought more than they could afford were not 'responsible' ..it was the greedy, looking for a living realtors and mortgage brokers who FORCED them into shady deals...sorry. When I bought my first house, I didn't ask THEM to tell ME what I could afford. I asked them how much house a set monthly payment-that I calculated I was willing to spend--would get me. And I DIDN"T BUDGE on that. I don't know why THEY couldn't have done the same. They were JUST as accountable...more so, imo. I grew up hearing 'Buyer Beware' ...and I DID.
Our government now pays for everything with debt. The bail out for example. That is money that the Fed will print up that is payed for by your children's credit - they will be the one's who owe the money back. The war has been payed for by credit - either to other countries or the Fed.
Well, first of all, I heard a discussion on just this issue and in fact it has not yet been decided. The PRIMARY choice would be BONDS, not printing money, but either results in just putting off actually PAYING as you spend, so point taken. It's just that the latter involves INFLATION on top of deficit, interest spending on our children.
I wasn't questioning this, but the wording makes it sound as if you think it a deliberate move to 'make citizens' dependent upon credit. I don't see it quite that way. I think these things come about rather too haphazard and convoluted to suggest conspiracy to bring about the mess...it's like with the schools...one little 'brilliant' idea or agenda at a time. But, ULTIMATELY...who's responsible for the state we're in? I say WE THE PEOPLE...WE allow it.
P
Google - fiat currency.
---I think this is a valid concern. It's very scary that our society runs off of credit. It's very conspicuous to me that the current government is encouraging credit. ---
Do you see a connection between government control via the credit issued by banks?
-- Yes, I think they are one in the same.--
If you had to describe in your own words how we have rights, and by what standard those rights are obtained, what would you say? (This will come in handy when trying to explain to others about their rights)
----We were given rights by God, in which no one can or should take away. (I think for people who don't believe in God, they find it harder to accept this, and maybe stand up and demand those rights. The government seems to be taking God out of everything possible, maybe to help those thoughts along?) Our founding fathers further stated this in writing. ---
At the beginning Badnarik is reading from the Constitution and states that those who are educated and informed are the ones who will protect against corruption. Do you think that the government-funded education system has dumbed down recent generations? Do you think it is by accident or on purpose?
--Oh by far, I don't think it was by accident that children don't know enough about the history or foundations of our country. There is definitely a reason for the ignorance of children. Men have always desired power; it hasn't changed in 2009. There was an article brought to my attention on the912project that spoke about a family in NC, who were homeschooling. The children tested 2 grades higher, but the judge was forcing the mother to put the children back into the school system. I will have to find the link to the article, for a better quotations of the facts!----
Michael Badnarik's Constitution Class 1/42 : ETA Poll -please respond
- Eilish
on Feb. 9, 2009 at 1:32 PM