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Elementary School Kids Elementary School Kids

What should the repercussion be when parents...

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don't support their child's education?

If a parent won't contact the school, attend conferences, monitor homework, get their child to school regularly, or return phone calls should there be a consequence for that?

Is this something CPS should get involved in or maybe the court system. Should involvement in education be tied to PA benefits? Or is it a parent's right to neglect their child's education?

Debate...

by on Nov. 17, 2012 at 6:15 PM
Replies (81-90):
maxswolfsuit
by Max on Nov. 18, 2012 at 6:33 PM


Quoting sandra1023:

I'm a social worker in Ky, and we get involved in these cases if it is reported.

Our social worker is involved. Most of the time, his involvement does get parents to do a little. But in the worst cases the parents know exactly what they can get away with before anything happens to them. And they take full advantage of that. 

sakpoints
by Member on Nov. 18, 2012 at 8:08 PM

Interesting topic, but I am not sure what repercussions could be installed.  Other than truancy which is backed by law I am not sure anything can be done to parents.

calsmom62
by on Nov. 18, 2012 at 8:12 PM
Wouldn't it be great if we could just fix all the kids with family issues?? God bless you for not giving up on your charges, at a time when teachers have more to do with fewer resources....


Quoting maxswolfsuit:

It's just a terrible situation all around. I think the older kids are focused on their own needs. No seems to care about the youngest one. 

All three are incredibly bright kids with a terrible outlook and attitude about school. :(

Quoting calsmom62:

I noticed in a later post you had indicated that the same family had one time been more involved when you had taught their older children .... Its too bad these older sibs couldnt be a resource for your current student...





Quoting maxswolfsuit:

Of course the child is coping with a difficult situation. But I can't call CPS based on that. I can only report if I have a solid reason to suspect abuse. A gut feeling isn't enough. I could be reprimanded for calling because of a parent avoiding me. If I did it every time this happened I most certainly would be reprimanded and flagged by CPS. 

Quoting calsmom62:

The behaviors you are describing(hiding from personnel, failure to respond habitually) would set off alarms to me that the child is not in a healthy environment, and a call to cps would not be unwarranted. Parents might be unsupported in a mental health situation, and the child may be coping with a difficult situation.








Quoting maxswolfsuit:


Quoting aetrom:

It is hard to judge because there are cases where parents are not able too.... But ii think that is few and far between. It is sad when that happens but seeing some neglect over the years it is minor IMO. Involving cps if there are no other signs would be extreme for already swamped caseworkers. There could be a tax incentive or something fir those who do and maybe that would motivate those who do not? I don't know!

What do you mean not able to?

I'm not talking about missing a conference because of a work schedule. I'm talking being 100% unavailable to school personnel. Including hiding when they come to your house to talk to you. 

I agree there's no way CPS could handle it. 

I'm just frustrated!









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sandra1023
by on Nov. 18, 2012 at 8:30 PM

I'm not sure what you mean by "CPS flagging you", as that isn't something that exists here.  We actually have a letter from someone's therapist stating that they have a severe mental illness and aren't able to make a referral and any from this person should be disregarded, yet we still have to go out if this person calls in a report.  Also, here, even if you are calling as a teacher/doctor/counselor/etc., you still don't have to give your name. 

maxswolfsuit
by Max on Nov. 18, 2012 at 8:44 PM


Quoting sandra1023:

I'm not sure what you mean by "CPS flagging you", as that isn't something that exists here.  We actually have a letter from someone's therapist stating that they have a severe mental illness and aren't able to make a referral and any from this person should be disregarded, yet we still have to go out if this person calls in a report.  Also, here, even if you are calling as a teacher/doctor/counselor/etc., you still don't have to give your name. 

Teachers do have to give our names.  As a school official I can't make an anonymous report unless I do it from home. And then I would have to leave out any details that would make it clear where I was getting the info. So I couldn't really make a full report.  They just changed that rule this year. I'm not sure why. 

If someone calls frequently for malicious reasons they are flagged and their calls aren't investigated. It's something that happens when exes constantly report one other to harass each other. 

maxswolfsuit
by Max on Nov. 18, 2012 at 8:45 PM


Quoting sakpoints:

Interesting topic, but I am not sure what repercussions could be installed.  Other than truancy which is backed by law I am not sure anything can be done to parents.

If our truancy lows were better it would help a great deal. When I hear how strict they are in other areas I can't believe it. 

sandra1023
by on Nov. 18, 2012 at 8:55 PM


Quoting maxswolfsuit:


Quoting sandra1023:

I'm not sure what you mean by "CPS flagging you", as that isn't something that exists here.  We actually have a letter from someone's therapist stating that they have a severe mental illness and aren't able to make a referral and any from this person should be disregarded, yet we still have to go out if this person calls in a report.  Also, here, even if you are calling as a teacher/doctor/counselor/etc., you still don't have to give your name. 

Teachers do have to give our names.  As a school official I can't make an anonymous report unless I do it from home. And then I would have to leave out any details that would make it clear where I was getting the info. So I couldn't really make a full report.  They just changed that rule this year. I'm not sure why. 

If someone calls frequently for malicious reasons they are flagged and their calls aren't investigated. It's something that happens when exes constantly report one other to harass each other. 

Wow, no idea what state you are in, but I would love it if we had the malicious callers flagged here.  60% of our calls are what we call "spite referrals".  Also, here, teachers don't have to give names.  There are many times that by the report itself, we can figure out it was probably a teacher, but we don't know for sure.

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maxswolfsuit
by Max on Nov. 18, 2012 at 9:04 PM


Quoting sandra1023:


Quoting maxswolfsuit:


Quoting sandra1023:

I'm not sure what you mean by "CPS flagging you", as that isn't something that exists here.  We actually have a letter from someone's therapist stating that they have a severe mental illness and aren't able to make a referral and any from this person should be disregarded, yet we still have to go out if this person calls in a report.  Also, here, even if you are calling as a teacher/doctor/counselor/etc., you still don't have to give your name. 

Teachers do have to give our names.  As a school official I can't make an anonymous report unless I do it from home. And then I would have to leave out any details that would make it clear where I was getting the info. So I couldn't really make a full report.  They just changed that rule this year. I'm not sure why. 

If someone calls frequently for malicious reasons they are flagged and their calls aren't investigated. It's something that happens when exes constantly report one other to harass each other. 

Wow, no idea what state you are in, but I would love it if we had the malicious callers flagged here.  60% of our calls are what we call "spite referrals".  Also, here, teachers don't have to give names.  There are many times that by the report itself, we can figure out it was probably a teacher, but we don't know for sure.


I'm in FL. I think these procedures are all statewide, but it could be county policy I suppose.

We used to have the choice to give our names or not. But this year we were told we must include our names when we give the report. Maybe it's so they can get more info later. There has definitely been a change in policy when it comes to talking to us. In the last couple of years I've gotten several calls asking for info on families that are being investigated. Before that I never got any. They would talk to the school guidance counselor but never the teacher. 

They don't tell the parents who does the reporting. But state law now says the person being investigated has a right to see the report as written or given. So even though they don't see the part with my name, if I say, "Johnny came to class today and told me XY and Z," it's pretty clear who the report came from. So we have to be very careful about we say. I haven't done any reporting since the law changed thankfully. 

I only know about the flagging thing because I've had parents ask me to call because their reports can't be taken any more. (insert eye roll here)

maxswolfsuit
by Max on Nov. 18, 2012 at 9:05 PM

Thanks!

I will say my resources haven't changed much in the last few years. I'm pretty lucky with that. 

Quoting calsmom62:

Wouldn't it be great if we could just fix all the kids with family issues?? God bless you for not giving up on your charges, at a time when teachers have more to do with fewer resources....


Quoting maxswolfsuit:

It's just a terrible situation all around. I think the older kids are focused on their own needs. No seems to care about the youngest one. 

All three are incredibly bright kids with a terrible outlook and attitude about school. :(

Quoting calsmom62:

I noticed in a later post you had indicated that the same family had one time been more involved when you had taught their older children .... Its too bad these older sibs couldnt be a resource for your current student...





Quoting maxswolfsuit:

Of course the child is coping with a difficult situation. But I can't call CPS based on that. I can only report if I have a solid reason to suspect abuse. A gut feeling isn't enough. I could be reprimanded for calling because of a parent avoiding me. If I did it every time this happened I most certainly would be reprimanded and flagged by CPS. 

Quoting calsmom62:

The behaviors you are describing(hiding from personnel, failure to respond habitually) would set off alarms to me that the child is not in a healthy environment, and a call to cps would not be unwarranted. Parents might be unsupported in a mental health situation, and the child may be coping with a difficult situation.








Quoting maxswolfsuit:


Quoting aetrom:

It is hard to judge because there are cases where parents are not able too.... But ii think that is few and far between. It is sad when that happens but seeing some neglect over the years it is minor IMO. Involving cps if there are no other signs would be extreme for already swamped caseworkers. There could be a tax incentive or something fir those who do and maybe that would motivate those who do not? I don't know!

What do you mean not able to?

I'm not talking about missing a conference because of a work schedule. I'm talking being 100% unavailable to school personnel. Including hiding when they come to your house to talk to you. 

I agree there's no way CPS could handle it. 

I'm just frustrated!










MsLogansMommy
by Bronze Member on Nov. 19, 2012 at 12:17 AM

I heard 504 plans only allow for accommodations. IEP's allow for Accommodations, Time lines, Assessments, Eligibility, Program, Least Restrictive Environment, Related Services (DIS), Goals and Objectives, Complaints and Disagreements.

Quoting maxswolfsuit:

Have you considered getting a 504 plan for her? The process for that is much quicker and she has a medical diagnosis so she would most likely qualify. Is she doing better this year?

I don't know how the school justified not evaluating. As far as I know, if you request in writing they have to follow up. Maybe that's not the rule everywhere. 

But if her ADHD is what's impacting her learning she might not qualify for an IEP. The 504 may be the better option. 

Quoting MsLogansMommy:

when my dd was in kinder she had behavior problems due to ADHD and she was suspended from kinder 4 times her teacher also talked about having her repeat kinder I requested from the school to have her evaluated for LDs and they declined they said they didnt see a reason and then the teacher never mentioned holding her back again in fact she then said that my dd was still struggling but was passing. My dd has a diagnosis of ADHD combined type and I sent a copy of that with my request for evaluation and I also mentioned in the letter my concern that my dd is dyslexic the principal refused to have her tested. I would have pursued the issue further but by the time I had gotten to that point the school year was almost over and I knew we were going to be in a different district for 1st grade so now we are at a new school and I am going to try again to have her evaluated.

Quoting maxswolfsuit:


Quoting MsLogansMommy:

I have a question and this may be a little off topic but it does tie into the statement about teachers being held solely responsible by evaluations on their students progress. I am a parent who is involved, I always answer the phone, return calls, respond to notes, and attend all meetings, unless I have child care issues. My dd struggles at school and last year she was denied an IEP. What happens when a parent reaches out for help for their child and the school offers none? I am in the process of contacting sylvan for additional help but they are very expensive and I dont know if it is in my budget so where do I turn for additional assistance for my child? btw I sit with her every night and help her with home work I suspect she may have a learning disability and I am in the process of requesting evaluation from this school since we are at a diff school this year

What do you mean your child was denied an IEP?

IEPs aren't just assigned to students. Students qualify for one after extensive testing or tracking. Normally it takes around a year to do this thoroughly, effectively and accurately. In order for an IEP to really benefit the child there must be data to indicate why the child is struggling and what type of instruction would be best for her. Giving students extra help isn't going to be very beneficial if it's the wrong kind of help.

What makes you suspect a processing disorder? What kinds of grades does your child earn? How far behind do you think she is? What evaluation has the school done? What does the new school say about your concerns?

Also keep in mind that just because a student doesn't have an IEP that doesn't mean they aren't getting help. In most places a child who is being evaluated in put in a program called Response to Intervention (RTI). During the RTI process the student is getting one on one help daily or several times a week on the skills they need the most help in. Kids can get lots of extra help without any kind of label. 

Also, I would never use a big tutoring company like Sylvan. They charge outrageous fees but pay tutors very little. Teachers can make much more tutoring on their own. All the Sylvan tutors I know are either teachers who can't get jobs or people with no teaching certification. I know two people in two different states who were told by Sylvan to lie if anyone asked about their certification because they had none. 

Check Craig's List, call the local library or ask at the school if there any teachers who will tutor. You may even be able to find an education student. It will be less that Sylvan and you'll get instruction for your child. Not a canned program with progress monitoring that is intentionally designed to make it look like the kids are making more progress than they are. 


 



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