Cropped and Docked??????

[1sofar]

I started a debate in one of my other groups because I am cropping my puppies ears next week.

I understand some people do not like these practices. But the practice is legal, and it is my choice.

Anyway do you crop and dock? Do you think the practice should be outlawed?

One lady even said I should give my puppy to home that would love it, because i obviously did not.

[solen]

This may not be a popular response here, but I do not like the idea of docking ears.  I think it is a very cruel surgery.  Most vets will not do it.  It is cosmetic surgery for a dog. 

When I got my first dobie, I planned on cropping his ears.  I thought that was how a dobie should look. Many people talked me out of it.  To them, I am grateful.  I loved Kaiser's floppy ears and he loved having them rubbed.  I am proud of myself for listening to others and changing my mind about something I thought I was right about.  (my father was a stubborn man who would dig his heels in deeper if anyone ever expressed a contrary opinion to his, I learned to be that way from him.  As an adult,  I have tried very hard to change my ways and now listen to other opinions.  I have learned a lot over the years because of this open mindedness)

So, I am VERY glad I listened to others about this.  It was the first major thing that I was able to admit that I was wrong about and change my opinion about.  I truly believe it is very cruel and unnecessary.  I have friends with dobies who crop.  They know my point of view, I respect theirs, and we are still friends, so please don't bash me for this opinion.  If you didn't ask for opinions I wouldn't share.

We rescued our next dobie, and I requested floppy ears because I have grown to love the look so much and I know others prefer cropped, so I wanted to rescue a floppy ear boy.

Both of my dobies had their tails done before I know about them.  I would never dock a tail myself, but it is something else to be wacked by their tail if they do have one! (and it will clear a coffee table!)

But knowing what I know now, I would even leave the tail, even though I like the look of the cropped tail better.  With all the surgeries I have been through myself in life, I really don't want to do anything to myself or my loved ones that isn't truly necessary.  (I live in Newport Beach, land of the plastic surgery and don't botox lipo or face lift......if I won't do it to myself......seems mean to subject anyone else to it.)  And it is surgery.  And they cannot be socialize while the ears are posted.  (now I know a lot of people who don't social puppies until later for fear of them "catching" something, but I trust that most dogs are vaccinated and the risk for that didn't concern me, having an anti social doberman did)

This is just my opinion, but one I do feel strongly about.  MAKE SURE you really want to do it before proceeding.  Do some reseach about it.  Good luck whatever you decide.  And enjoy your puppy!!!!!!

[pjacademy]

I am so very on the fence about this one. I LOVE the look of cropped but hate the procedure. After seeing how painful it was for Anakin those first few days....it about broke my heart. Aslo after seeing how much they actually cut off :(

But it was hubby's dog so I let him decide.

[pjacademy]

I wonder if the same people that are anti crop/dock are also anti circumsion? Anti plastic surgery? Anti tatoo or piercings?

At some point ya have to just say to each their own :)

[1sofar]

They started a spinoff thread. Some are making arguments about why they criced but are so against cropping and docking.

I prefer tails gone period. Ears I honestly don't care either way, I do like the cropped look. Hubby has the final say.

I just thought it quite extreme to say I do not deserve to have a dog because of the ear cropping.

Oh the names I am being called!!!! LOL

Quoting pjacademy:

I wonder if the same people that are anti crop/dock are also anti circumsion? Anti plastic surgery? Anti tatoo or piercings?

At some point ya have to just say to each their own :)

[Blueliner]

I'm pro cropping/docking. I couldn't care less what others decided to do but I want to have the option. I don't consider it cruel, the puppy is under anesthesia and usually back to playing around and acting normal by the next day. The ears are completely healed in a week or less (at least the should be!) It's actually very hard to find a reputable breeder (see my sticky post to learn exactly what "reputable breeder" entails) that does not crop their puppies before sending them to their homes.

When my Dobe was a puppy about 5 months old we were walking in a park ans some woman started asking me about the ears, I explained it too her and that they are healed but taped to learn to stand up. She seemed genuinely curious, her friend on the other hand started going off on me about how cruel it was. She was walking a Pug, so I started going off on her about why I believe it's animal cruelty just to breed a dog that can't breath! She walked off in a "huff" lol.

I think a lot of vets don't crop simply because they lack the skill (it's not taught in veterinary school), not anyone can do a nice crop. It takes someone who as much a skilled artist as they are a skilled surgeon to create a nice crop! Show breeders only use a handful of vets to crop and they will pay to have them flown in and then ~$500 a pup for the whole litter. Skilled "croppers" are rare.

People in this country circumcise their children, even have surgeries to pin back their ears if they stick out, at ages where the child doesn't have a choice. I don't see it as any different. I actually would not do either of those to a child, but this is my dog, I love him, but he is a dog, not a child. My dog if VERY well cared for and loved. He is exercised, trained, played with, given vet care, groomed, given attention/affection, he's a house dog, he's fed and expensive high quality diet. I think there are bigger issues out there than cropping and docking, lets crack down on people chaining their dogs, keeping them as junk yard dogs, neglecting them, fighting them, keeping them outside, etc.

I've also seen people who have cropped their pit bulls ears with scissors! Now THAT is cruel, and if cropping is made illegal then I foresee a lot more idiots trying to do it on their own!

Now like I said, I don't care what ANY one else does, they can crop or not, dock or not, but I prefer cropped and docked Dobes. It's my personal preference and I don't believe my dog has suffered for it. If I hadn't gotten him from a top breeder already cropped by a top "cropper" then I likely wouldn't have had him cropped simply because I'd rather have floppy ears then an ugly crop any day!

As for your decision, if you like the look, you're prepared to handle the after care, and you can find a vet with a GREAT rep for nice crops with a great portfolio showing off their crops then go for it!

All that said, If this post turns into any more then a polite discussion I will delete it. I don't want drama in this group!

[Blueliner]

I thought I'd add what I see as "pros" to cropping.

They are less likely so suffer from ear infections. Yes some cropped Dobes will get ear infections and many floppy eared Dobes won't but over all they are less likely. This has been true in my experience, my hound dog gets her share of ear infections even when we are on top of keeping her ears clean. Our cropped Dobe has never had one and we don't clean his ears even half as often.

Some people will try to claim that cropping ears takes away some of the dogs ability to communicate with other dogs through body language and can lead to more doggy "misunderstandings". This may be true of breeds where they remove nearly the whole ear, such as Pit Pulls, but in breeds where the crops are long this appears to be the exact opposite. Wolves have prick ears and use a range of ear positions to communicate emotions and such with other wolves. My Doberman has a well done long crop and has/uses a full range of ear positions. He is much easier to read then my floppy eared dog whose ear positions are less obvious. Floppy ears in a sense are less natural, I know that's reaching a little but it really depends on how you look at things.

I've heard people argue that cropping a dog can lead to ears that are sensitive for life or lead to "phantom pains" in the ears. Once again if the dog has a well done well cared for crop this should not happen. My Dobe loves having his ears rubbed. I've met plenty of dogs that are overly touchy (even aggressive) about having their ears handled because they didn't get the proper socialization to ear handling as puppies. This can make things more difficult for vets and groomers to handle them and treat them. It can make it harder for the owner as well and even dangerous for children) When my Dobe was a puppy siting for weekly postings he'd almost always fall asleep as we posted his ears because it was relaxing to him. Obviously this can be avoided by taking time to regularly handle your puppy's ears, but cropping and posting does insure that they will have that regular handling.

 

[beth100706]

We  and dock but I am from the "to each his own camp". If you don't like cropping and docking then don't do it. Dobies are awesome looking dogs either way. I think it's sad for anyone to try to make another person feel bad for choosing to crop. I'm sorry people were so nasty in your other group.

[Blueliner]

So did you have his ears done this week? How did it go? Any cone head pics?

[1sofar]

Sorry, I kept saying next week. His op is actually the 22nd. I will post picks.

Quoting Blueliner:

So did you have his ears done this week? How did it go? Any cone head pics?

[1sofar]

We go to get posted in the morning. He has had no problems. He does not seem to care. I would have no reservations about cropping in the future.