Richard Dawkins: I can't be sure God does not exist
He is regarded as the most famous atheist in the world but last night Professor Richard Dawkins admitted he could not be sure that God does not exist.
He told the Archbishop of Canterbury, Dr Rowan Williams, that he preferred to call himself an agnostic rather than an atheist.
The two men were taking part in a public “dialogue” at Oxford University at the end of a week which has seen bitter debate about the role of religion in public life in Britain.
Last week Baroness Warsi, the Tory party chairman, warned of a tide of “militant secularism” challenging the religious foundations of British society.
The discussion, in Sir Christopher Wren’s Sheldonian Theatre, attracted attention from around the world.
As well as being relayed to two other theatres, it was streamed live on the internet and promoted fierce debate on the Twitter social network.
For an hour and 20 minutes the two men politely discussed "The nature of human beings and the question of their ultimate origin" touching on the meaning of consciousness, the evolution of human language – and Dr Williams’s beard.
For much of the discussion the Archbishop sat quietly listening to Prof Dawkins’s explanations of human evolution.
At one point he told the professor that he was “inspired” by “elegance” of the professor’s explanation for the origins of life – and agreed with much of it.
Prof Dawkins told him: “What I can’t understand is why you can’t see the extraordinary beauty of the idea that life started from nothing – that is such a staggering, elegant, beautiful thing, why would you want to clutter it up with something so messy as a God?”
Dr Williams replied that he “entirely agreed” with the “beauty” of Prof Dawkins’s argument but added: “I’m not talking about God as an extra who you shoehorn on to that.”
There was surprise when Prof Dawkins acknowledged that he was less than 100 per cent certain of his conviction that there is no creator.
The philosopher Sir Anthony Kenny, who chaired the discussion, interjected: “Why don’t you call yourself an agnostic?” Prof Dawkins answered that he did.
An incredulous Sir Anthony replied: “You are described as the world’s most famous atheist.”
Prof Dawkins said that he was “6.9 out of seven” sure of his beliefs.
“I think the probability of a supernatural creator existing is very very low,” he added.
He also said that he believed it was highly likely that there was life on other planets.
At one point he discussion strayed onto the theoretical question of whether a traditional cut throat razor could be described as a more complicated thing than an electric shaver.
There was laughter as the Archbishop said he would attempt an answer before adding: “Not that I know much about razors.”
During a wide-ranging discussion the Archbishop also said that he believed that human beings had evolved from non-human ancestors but were nevertheless “in the image of God”.
He also said that the explanation for the creation of the world in the Book of Genesis could not be taken literally.
“The writers of the Bible, inspired as I believe they were, they were nonetheless not inspired to do 21st Century physics,” he said.
When Prof Dawkins suggested that he believed the Pope took a rather more literal interpretation of the origins of humans, the Archbishop joked: “I will ask him some time.”
Atheist are scientist ( no I don't speak for them all only myself) We are open to the possibility of there being a god. We just haven't seen any evidence that points to it. If evidence presented itself that a god did exist, we would say " What do you know there is a god." But until that day, we believe that god doesn't exist, but will not say 100% he doesn't because there isn't any evidence to support a 100% claim of non existence.
Quoting romalove:
Most people who don't believe in God are open to that tiny possibility that proof will manifest of God. That means we never finish searching but have seen no evidence thus far.
To the OP, you do realize that even proof of a creator may not necessarily be proof of the God of Abraham? Proof could end up disproving all religions.
Dh is a fan of the ancient aliens theory.
Ever see the movie Stargate? Maybe our 'creator' came from another planet or galaxy.
This is pretty much the logic I use. :) I understand faith blah blah, but in my mind it just makes no sense how anyone can know those things with absolute certainty. The most logical thing, in my mind, is to just go with not knowing either way. There is no shame in that, but a lot of people see it as weak for some reason.
Quoting GLWerth:You cannot definitively know or not know.
Seems the height of arrogance to say you KNOW for certain that god exists and you know exactly what he/she/it wants.
Similarly, it seems the height of arrogance to say that you KNOW for absolute certain that he/she/it does not exist.
However, many people BELIEVE that god exists and many people BELIEVE that he/she/it does not exist.
I'm in the camp of saying honestly that I do not know. I've suffered (and seen) too many abuses at the hands of supposedly "godly" people to believe that he/she/it is an involved being, but I do see an order to the world, so I'm an agnostic.
Makes sense to me. Atheism essentially is lack of belief in a deity. I would think that anyone should always be open to new evidence about any belief. I don't believe in unicorns, but would be willing to re-examine that belief if I ever saw one. Does that mean I secretly DO believe in unicorns? No, it just means that I'm going to take into account new evidence if it presents itself, even though I'm a strong 6.9 out 7 when it comes to unicorn disbelief.
Quoting Friday:
Quoting romalove:
Most people who don't believe in God are open to that tiny possibility that proof will manifest of God. That means we never finish searching but have seen no evidence thus far.
To the OP, you do realize that even proof of a creator may not necessarily be proof of the God of Abraham? Proof could end up disproving all religions.Dh is a fan of the ancient aliens theory.
Ever see the movie Stargate? Maybe our 'creator' came from another planet or galaxy.
I haven't seen it. I will admit I rarely watch science fiction (Star Wars and Close Encounters are notable exceptions, and Close Encounters is one of my all time favorite movies).
Scientologists believe in that theory, we came from ancient aliens.
Regarding the "God" question, my response would be "what came before them, how did they get to be".
There is always "what came before that". :-)
Quoting romalove:
Quoting Stephanie329:
You have put into words something I've been pondering. In my experience - in general - religious people do not consider this. But then the old standby "you just have to have faith" will cover any argument.Quoting romalove:
Quoting IhartU:
Quoting romalove:
Most people who don't believe in God are open to that tiny possibility that proof will manifest of God. That means we never finish searching but have seen no evidence thus far.
To the OP, you do realize that even proof of a creator may not necessarily be proof of the God of Abraham? Proof could end up disproving all religions.
I wonder how many have actually considered this? When proof does come, what if it's proof of Zeus or Odin and not the god of Abraham?
Could be a god no one ever thought about or considered. Could be a god who isn't interested in sending messages or telling people how to live.
Could be anything since there is no proof of anything.
And of course they are right. You must take on "faith" that which is unproven and/or unprovable.
But I mentioned this because I have a sneaking suspicion that the OP has an ulterior motive in posting this about Richard Dawkins. I think she is not alone in thinking that atheists are denying God instead of saying we don't find evidence for God. The former is an active thing to do, a rejection. The latter is, I haven't found it yet so I'm saying I don't believe in something I can't find, but if something arises, I am always open to proof. There is this belief that if you could be made to understand or stop rejecting or believe in God, if you can open yourself to that possibility, that you would believe in "their" God.
And I am trying to point out that this isn't the case.
Makes sense. I've been told many times that I'm not Christian because I don't want to follow their rules. Some don't seem to be able to process the idea that we just don't see the evidence and they have some need to insist that we are just angry or regecting a god.
I've often wondered why they won't believe me when I give my reasons and have to assign their own to me.
Believing that all of our amazing world, and the intricate and mind-bogglingly complex life that lives here, did not start from absolutely nothing is not religion.
Quoting romalove:
Quoting momversuswild:
...and he admits that evolution requires a leap of faith...
I like when people can just admit it.
I like it when creationists admit that they are pretending religion is science, and that there is no objective proof of creation.
Quoting romalove:
Quoting Friday:
Quoting romalove:
Most people who don't believe in God are open to that tiny possibility that proof will manifest of God. That means we never finish searching but have seen no evidence thus far.
To the OP, you do realize that even proof of a creator may not necessarily be proof of the God of Abraham? Proof could end up disproving all religions.Dh is a fan of the ancient aliens theory.
Ever see the movie Stargate? Maybe our 'creator' came from another planet or galaxy.
I haven't seen it. I will admit I rarely watch science fiction (Star Wars and Close Encounters are notable exceptions, and Close Encounters is one of my all time favorite movies).
Scientologists believe in that theory, we came from ancient aliens.
Regarding the "God" question, my response would be "what came before them, how did they get to be".
There is always "what came before that". :-)
It's a cool movie, never watched any of the series. In the movie, Ra the god of ancient Egypt was an alien. I'm a huge sci-fi geek, grew up on it and married one.
I always wondered about the Christian assertion that believing the Big Bang was silly because the mass had to have some from somewhere but then I'm supposed to believe God just always was.
Is Yoga a religion?
- candlegal
on Feb. 25, 2012 at 8:34 AM