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One more reason we need Voter ID cards

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Felony charges related to election fraud have touched the 2008 race for the highest office in the land.

Prosecutors in South Bend, Ind., filed charges Monday against four St. Joseph County Democratic officials and deputies as part of a multiple-felony case involving the alleged forging of Democratic presidential primary petitions in the 2008 election, which put then-candidates Barack Obama and Hillary Clinton on the Indiana ballot.

The officials are accused of taking part in a scheme to fake signatures and names on the primary petitions needed to run for president. Court papers say the plan was hatched by local Democratic Party officials inside the local party headquarters.

Among those charged is the former long-time chairman of the St. Joseph County Democratic Party, Butch Morgan, who allegedly ordered the forgeries. He was forced to resign when the allegations were first made public last October, even though his lawyer, Shaw Friedman, told Fox News at the time that Morgan did not do anything wrong.

The St. Joseph County Board of Voter Registration's Democratic board member, Pam Brunette, Board of Voter Registration worker Beverly Shelton and Democratic volunteer and former board worker Dustin Blythe also face charges.

According to affidavits, St. Joseph County Voter Registration Office worker Lucas Burkett told investigators that he was part of the plan that started in January 2008 "to forge signatures on presidential candidate petitions instead of collecting actual signatures from citizens."

The documents state that Burkett told investigators that "he was heavily involved in St. Joseph County political activities with the local Democratic party," and that "he had, in fact, personally forged several such signatures," and had attended meetings at the local Democratic party headquarters, where it was agreed to forge the petitions. Morgan, the County Democratic Chairman, allegedly "instructed Mr. Burkett, Pamela Brunette, Beverly Shelton, and Dustin Blythe to forge ballot petitions for presidential candidates," and that "all of them agreed to follow these instructions" by copying names and signatures from old election petitions.

According to affidavits, Burkett told investigators it was his job to "forge petitions for candidate Barack Obama," Shelton "was assigned to forge petitions for candidate Hillary Clinton" and Blythe "was assigned to forge petitions for candidate John Edwards." When Edwards dropped out of the race at the end of January 2008 and Burkett refused to continue the forgeries, Morgan allegedly ordered Blythe to then forge petitions for Barack Obama.

Indiana State Police investigators identified a total of 22 petitions that appeared to be faked, yet sailed through the Voter Registration Board as legitimate documents. The signature of the board's Republican supervisor, Linda Silcott, which is required for legal certification, appeared to be rubber stamped on the documents. She told investigators that she did not remember signing or authorizing her rubber stamp to be used.

Silcott also told investigators that she recognized the handwriting on the alleged forged Obama petitions as that of Blythe's.

The South Bend Tribune and independent political newsletter Howey Politics Indiana have reported that a handwriting analyst concluded last fall that Blythe's handwriting matched some of the alleged Obama fakes. When Fox News caught up to Blythe as he left the Voter Registration Board last November and asked him if he forged any signatures or faked any petitions, he repeatedly replied, "I don't have anything to say."

The case raises the possibility that the president's campaign and that of Clinton's, could have been legally challenged in Indiana if the alleged forgeries were discovered during the race.

Under state law, presidential candidates need to qualify with 500 signatures from each of Indiana's nine congressional districts. Indiana elections officials say that in St. Joseph County, which is the 2nd Congressional District, the Obama campaign qualified with 534 signatures; Clinton's camp had 704.

But the signatures, which were certified by the elections board, were never challenged. If the number of legitimate signatures for Obama or Clinton fell below the legal requirement of 500, they could have been bounced from the state ballot. Reports have previously put the number of phony signatures for both candidates at about 150, but state investigators plucked names from the petitions at random and cited only 20 individual alleged forgeries as part of their case. They say their investigation of the petitions continues.

Multiple voters, including Indiana's former Democratic Gov. Joe Kernan, told Fox News that their names and signatures were phonies.

"That's not my signature," Charity Rorie told Fox News as she sat in her kitchen in Mishawaka, Ind.. The mother of four was stunned that her name and signature, and those of her husband, appeared on one of the Obama petitions. She said they "absolutely" were fakes and was troubled that personal details such as their address and birthdays were also included.

"It was shocking," she said. "Why did they do that, and where did they get it from?"

"I did not sign for Barack Obama," Democratic voter Robert Hunter told Fox News as he stared at the Obama petition that included his name and purported signature supporting the candidate. While he observed that the scrawl looked "very close" to his real one, it was not.

"I always put 'Junior' after my name, every time... there's no 'Junior' there," Hunter told us. "I don't like anybody using my name for anything other than myself."

"It's scary," Charity said. "A lot of people have already lost faith in politics and the realm of politics and that solidifies our worries and concerns."

As for Burkett, a 26-year-old lifelong Democrat, "he is the whistle-blower in this," his lawyer, Andrew B. Jones, told Fox News.

"Lucas really is the hero in this situation. He is someone who stood up for good government, and has cooperated with the state police and will continue to do so."

If you suspect voter or election fraud where you live, tell the Fox News Voter Fraud Unit: voterfraud@foxnews.com

 

 

 



Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2012/04/02/4-indiana-dems-charged-with-election-fraud-in-2008/#ixzz1y4uDL3AS

Sorry, I couldn't figure out how to get rid of the picture.   I will post further on voter registration fraud for those who are actually interested in learning the truth.

Oh, and by the way, Jefferson Country is in the northwestern part of Indiana, which includes Gary, a very democratically held stronghold.  So, see even the dems can get cheated by voter fraud issues. 

grandma B

by on Jun. 17, 2012 at 3:02 PM
Replies (71-80):
shannonnigans
by Platinum Member on Jun. 20, 2012 at 10:56 AM
LOL you bet your ass I did! It was hard to miss! Although some things remain the same, such as "most rudest" and the constant and erroneous use of commas.

What was consistent however was when I asked "her" to show me where I was wrong and cite her authority. Remarkably, the silence was the same as always.

Quoting Della529:

 Did you notice the difference in writing style in that response from NW?


Quoting shannonnigans:

No, that dog won't hunt. You run from any debate like the scared rabbit that you are. I disputed your point, gave you the cite unlike yourself who has never cited an authority when asked. As predicted, you ignored the cite. Like before. Like always. You've never debated one thing. Your disjointed ramblings are already the stuff of legend and you duck everyone else who exposes you, not just me.

Your racist tripe is well known all over this board and I'll be happy to quote some of your greatest hits.

Now here is your big chance. Debate this, let's hear it. Show me how that study is wrong, and how voter fraud is rampant. Cite your sources and provide examples. This is your big opportunity right here.


Quoting Naturewoman4:


I'm curious is this your normal personality?  Because, you have got to be the most rudest person I've ever met.  (luckily I won't meet).  When I come across a post like yours, I usually just ignore it.  People like you, aren't even worth my time & energy.  But, I just had to finally make a comment about the type of person you are.  Do you have a troubled life?  Are you unlucky in love?  Because, I believe when ppl make comments like yours, that means they are the following:



1. VERY insecure



2.  VERY unhappy



3.  Having ALOT of personal problems



Sounds alot like what you may be going through.  I feel sorry for you...Don't even bother commenting on this, because as usual I don't respond or even read posts like this, especially yours.  For YOUR sake, you'd be ALOT better off & 'appear' to look slightly intelligent at best, IF you would just stick to the thread & disagree with posters if you choose.  But, then just debate them, instead of this childish way you go about it.  You lose ALL credibility IMO. 



Quoting shannonnigans:

As usual, it's almost impossible to read this grammatical mess, but the largest study of voter fraud ever undertaken showed that voter fraud, notwithstanding what party was examined, is virtually nonexistent.

http://www.brennancenter.org/content/section/category/allegations_of_voter_fraud

Unlike you, I can cite a source. You will never read it nor would you understand it anyway.






Quoting Naturewoman4:



Whether it's voting to put people on a Ballot or voting in an Election period, it all can result in ALOT of voter fraud imo.  I hope they can come up with a system, whether it's "Voter ID Cards" or something else, but I just want this upcoming Election 'free' from Voter Fraud.  It's really quite concerning to think there were Voter Fraud & that Obama could of not of even been on the Ballot to begin with.  Therefore, he wouldn't of even of been elected President.  Too bad that wasn't caught earlier, perhaps then we could of had a better chance of being out of this recession by now, had we had a different President.bad




 




 



Posted on CafeMom Mobile
katy_kay08
by on Jun. 20, 2012 at 11:03 AM

I've asked you a very simple question Naturewoman.  I've called you no names, I've provided sources with my comments and have only asked you questions on topic.  I will note that you still have not actually addressed the question I asked.  

I've provided a non partisan report on voter fraud.  I won't read breitbart's website.  It is the one of the least credible "sources" taking up space on the web.  

How would voter identification have prevented the alleged crime in the OP?  

Are you aware that Indiana has one of the strictest voter identification laws in the country?  

The OP's example was not a case of voter fraud.  It was a case of election fraud.  Do you know the difference?  Do you know which is far more likely to happen and which is more likely to cause the most damage?  

While Conservative voters are distracted by the red herring of voter identification, it allows attention to be diverted from the real risk to our voting system, election fraud and that is unfortunately a bipartisan concern...or should be at least.  

Quoting Naturewoman4:

There's a reason why ppl come & go in this group.  Because, if they disagree with what ALOT of you on here says, they just get bashed & called names.  How is that debating?  Why would anyone want to even debate those ppl?  Alot of CM's on here don't want a Debate, they don't want the truth, the proof, they just want to call ppl names.  That's why I ignore alot of ppls posts on here.  I find it quite funny that when ppl on here keep asking you to address the questions they ask, yet they don't even address the questions when they are ask.  But, I'm going to go ahead & discuss this subject of Voter ID cards, even though I KNOW it's going to be ignored or called out for being lies.

Voter ID Cards WILL help protect the Election Integrity & Voter ID Laws.  It WAS the Dems. who were predominantly responsible for the Jim Crow Laws against Black Americans Voting.  Dems. have historically exhabited a tendency to go to any lengths to ensure that the results of Elections turn out in their favor.  As was the case during Jim Crow when they didn't want Americans to participate in choosing non-racist lenders.  ACORN was a failed organization & there has been 55 convictions for Voter Fraud & Voter ID Fraud from the Acorn's efforts which leaned heavily in favor of the Dem. Party.

http://www.breitbart.com/Big-Government/2012/04/13/voter-laws-racist-or-reasonable

*just click on the article "Voter ID: Racist or Reasonable"

(not that most ppl on here are going to read it & I know will say it's ALL false)

Quoting katy_kay08:

Naturewoman, do you want to address the on topic question that was asked of you or are you planning to ignore it?  

It requires no research on your part but rather an explanation of how voter identification would have prevented the case cited in the the OP.  

Quoting Naturewoman4:

You're so right Grandmab.  Perhaps, you & I should just keep up the conversation going, because it's obvious all the lefties on here just don't get it.  They are ALL SO AFRAID that their little Obama man is going to lose, then they'll loose their paychecks.  Well they better get use to it, because Obama is going to loose.  They better start saving their PA checks they get each month.  Because, it's going to soon all end for them.  NO MORE living off the Gov./Taxpayers.  What's really funny is they have no objection to showing ID's for getting a job, getting a passport, driver's license, Library Card, & all other things that require an ID for, yet they have a problem showing a Voter ID card to vote??  WOW!!  I wonder why?  tsk tsk

'










katy_kay08
by on Jun. 20, 2012 at 11:09 AM

You can get the report on Voter Fraud here

Brennan Center for Justice


Allegations of Voter Fraud

The "voter fraud" cry has been increasingly used to justify policies that suppress legitimate voters. But the cry is baseless; allegations of voter fraud—especially polling place impersonation fraud—almost always prove to be inflated or inaccurate. The Brennan Center carefully examines allegations of fraud to get at the truth behind the claims. The truth of the matter is that voter fraud—votes knowingly cast by ineligible individuals—is exceedingly rare; one is more likely to be struck by lightning than to commit voter fraud. Our work debunking the voter fraud myth is available at Truth About Fraud.

In 2007, the Brennan Center released The Truth About Voter Fraud, the most extensive analysis of voter fraud claims to date. The report finds that most allegations of fraud turn out to be baseless—and that of the few allegations remaining, most reveal election irregularities and other forms of election misconduct, rather than fraud by individual voters. The type of individual voter fraud supposedly targeted by recent legislative efforts—especially efforts to require certain forms of voter ID—simply does not exist.

Naturewoman4
by Platinum Member on Jun. 20, 2012 at 11:11 AM

The Law states that YOU HAVE to be a Legal Citizen in order to vote period.  Otherwise, it IS Voter Fraud.  I believe there's certain circumstances where if you have a certain card stating you have legal residency (not sure what it's called) you can vote.  But, in MOST cases it is illegal to vote.  Which SHOULD BE the case.  ALL others are Voter Fraud IMO.  I think as long as the Gov. butts out of those States that have "Voter ID Cards", then they'll be no problem. 

The ONLY reason why Holder & the dumbsocialists are against Voter ID is that they want Non-Citizens & ILLEGALS ALIENS to vote for Socialists.  I'm sure the Reps. ARE all over that & ARE prepared for that.  But, hopefully very soon we won't have to worry about Holder anymore, as he might be removed from office.  :)  As far as the Fingerprinting Scanners, I don't see what's the problem with that?  What are ppl afraid of?  IF it's going to assure the integrity of the Elections, what's the big deal?  I would think EVERYONE would want that. 

 The gym I belong to does that.  IF you take a Poll I'm sure MOST Americans wouldn't mind having this in place.  It also could help out with the fastest crime that is going on in this Country "Identity Thief".  I honestly don't see what ppl are afraid of?  I feel ppl that are against it, has something to hid.  IF it's going to help stop Fraud & Identity Thief, WHY not use it?

Quoting Jesi_79:

Here is the problem, while you have to be a citizen to vote in federal elections, each state has different rules as to who is eleigoble to vote in statewide elections, and that freedom of rules trickles down to county and municipal elections.  Several major cities allow any resident, regardless of immigration status or felony status, to vote.  They would be eligible for Voter IDs in their voting jurisdiction where they have the right to vote.

And you can forget fingerprint scanning... if you are not a felon the state has no right to that information. 

Quoting Naturewoman4:

A Voter ID wouldn't even go to those that aren't a LEGAL Citizen of this Country.  A Voter ID is for those that are "Legal" American Citizens.  IF someone couldn't 'qualify' for a Driver's License, Passport, Immigration Document, or other IDs shouldn't even be in this Country.  ILLEGALS aren't able to vote.  Implementing a 'fingerprint scanning' to prove it is YOU that is voting & you ARE a Citizen of this Country, would IMO prevent ANY fraud that may arise come this election. 

 Because, I believe, that's why Obama & his Admin. has tried to block the Voter ID from happening in those States that have.  And WHY?  Because, Obama WANTS/NEEDS illegal votes, to have a chance at winning.  (which he doesn't).  But, I wouldn't put it cross him & his Admin. to commit Voter Fraud, by allowing Illegals to vote.  That's why Reps. have to have a careful watch so that doesn't happen.  I just find it funny how Obama has to resort to anything & everything to win.  He & his Admin. are very worried that he will lose.  That's why I'm pretty sure they'll try to get Illegals to vote, even if they commit Voter Fraud.  Obama feels he can get away with anything anyway.  So, sad that a President has to resort to these 'criminal' ways of his.

Quoting Jesi_79:

An optional Voter ID would be great for people who cannot afford or qualify for a drivers license. passport, immigration document, or other ID.  But a required voter ID progam sounds too much like a National ID to garner my support.

 

 


katy_kay08
by on Jun. 20, 2012 at 11:14 AM

Legal residents cannot vote, only citizens.  

You accuse people of being disrespectful and resorting to name calling.  Are you going to rise to the level of discourse you demand of others?  Based on your name calling below it seems you aren't.  

Quoting Naturewoman4:

The Law states that YOU HAVE to be a Legal Citizen in order to vote period.  Otherwise, it IS Voter Fraud.  I believe there's certain circumstances where if you have a certain card stating you have legal residency (not sure what it's called) you can vote.  But, in MOST cases it is illegal to vote.  Which SHOULD BE the case.  ALL others are Voter Fraud IMO.  I think as long as the Gov. butts out of those States that have "Voter ID Cards", then they'll be no problem. 

The ONLY reason why Holder & the dumbsocialists are against Voter ID is that they want Non-Citizens & ILLEGALS ALIENS to vote for Socialists.  I'm sure the Reps. ARE all over that & ARE prepared for that.  But, hopefully very soon we won't have to worry about Holder anymore, as he might be removed from office.  :)  As far as the Fingerprinting Scanners, I don't see what's the problem with that?  What are ppl afraid of?  IF it's going to assure the integrity of the Elections, what's the big deal?  I would think EVERYONE would want that. 

 The gym I belong to does that.  IF you take a Poll I'm sure MOST Americans wouldn't mind having this in place.  It also could help out with the fastest crime that is going on in this Country "Identity Thief".  I honestly don't see what ppl are afraid of?  I feel ppl that are against it, has something to hid.  IF it's going to help stop Fraud & Identity Thief, WHY not use it?


Della529
by Matlock on Jun. 20, 2012 at 11:20 AM

 Your link doesn't work.

Try this one: http://justice-integrity.org/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=453:cutting-through-vote-fraud-claims-hypocrisy

Quoting Naturewoman4:

There's a reason why ppl come & go in this group.  Because, if they disagree with what ALOT of you on here says, they just get bashed & called names.  How is that debating?  Why would anyone want to even debate those ppl?  Alot of CM's on here don't want a Debate, they don't want the truth, the proof, they just want to call ppl names.  That's why I ignore alot of ppls posts on here.  I find it quite funny that when ppl on here keep asking you to address the questions they ask, yet they don't even address the questions when they are ask.  But, I'm going to go ahead & discuss this subject of Voter ID cards, even though I KNOW it's going to be ignored or called out for being lies.

Voter ID Cards WILL help protect the Election Integrity & Voter ID Laws.  It WAS the Dems. who were predominantly responsible for the Jim Crow Laws against Black Americans Voting.  Dems. have historically exhabited a tendency to go to any lengths to ensure that the results of Elections turn out in their favor.  As was the case during Jim Crow when they didn't want Americans to participate in choosing non-racist lenders.  ACORN was a failed organization & there has been 55 convictions for Voter Fraud & Voter ID Fraud from the Acorn's efforts which leaned heavily in favor of the Dem. Party.

http://www.breitbart.com/Big-Government/2012/04/13/voter-laws-racist-or-reasonable

*just click on the article "Voter ID: Racist or Reasonable"

(not that most ppl on here are going to read it & I know will say it's ALL false)

Quoting katy_kay08:

Naturewoman, do you want to address the on topic question that was asked of you or are you planning to ignore it?  

It requires no research on your part but rather an explanation of how voter identification would have prevented the case cited in the the OP.  

Quoting Naturewoman4:

You're so right Grandmab.  Perhaps, you & I should just keep up the conversation going, because it's obvious all the lefties on here just don't get it.  They are ALL SO AFRAID that their little Obama man is going to lose, then they'll loose their paychecks.  Well they better get use to it, because Obama is going to loose.  They better start saving their PA checks they get each month.  Because, it's going to soon all end for them.  NO MORE living off the Gov./Taxpayers.  What's really funny is they have no objection to showing ID's for getting a job, getting a passport, driver's license, Library Card, & all other things that require an ID for, yet they have a problem showing a Voter ID card to vote??  WOW!!  I wonder why?  tsk tsk

'

 

 

 



 


 

 

Naturewoman4
by Platinum Member on Jun. 20, 2012 at 11:30 AM

That's exactly my point, it doesn't matter IF I post a link any links or posts that are against anything that you & many others on here says, it won't be read or it will be dismissed as not credible.  Yet you want me to read yours?   So, what's the point?  I will continue to posts my opinions/links on various threads on here though, whether or not I get bashed, called names, because I know it is those that are insecure & have low self-esteem is why they resort to debating in this matter. 

 I always wondered if alot of you here don't want a debate on various topics, that goes against what you all believe, then what's the point?  Just debate amongst yourselves.  Also, what's the point to answering any of your questions, when you all don't even answer mine.  I've noticed that happening alot in here.  But, to answer a few of your questions.  You & others attack the poster of this thread for pointing out that Fraud whether Voter Fraud or Voter Registration Fraud and even the Fraud that the poster orginally stated, is a real problem. 

 Again, someone points out something that most of you on here just don't want to see or admit it's a problem.  Then, most of you resort to the name calling.  Who in their right mind wants to debate ppl like you all?  I'm ok with debating an issue, but the way it usually starts off is with attacks right off the bat.  So, how is that anything a person would want to participate in???  Katy_Kay, you have ask fair questions, but the problem is that again, even you do the same thing most of the other posters do.  They won't answer any questions when ask, they don't read any links that THEY keep asking for, they just say they won't read them because TO THEM they are not credible.  So, what's the point?

Quoting katy_kay08:

I've asked you a very simple question Naturewoman.  I've called you no names, I've provided sources with my comments and have only asked you questions on topic.  I will note that you still have not actually addressed the question I asked.  

I've provided a non partisan report on voter fraud.  I won't read breitbart's website.  It is the one of the least credible "sources" taking up space on the web.  

How would voter identification have prevented the alleged crime in the OP?  

Are you aware that Indiana has one of the strictest voter identification laws in the country?  

The OP's example was not a case of voter fraud.  It was a case of election fraud.  Do you know the difference?  Do you know which is far more likely to happen and which is more likely to cause the most damage?  

While Conservative voters are distracted by the red herring of voter identification, it allows attention to be diverted from the real risk to our voting system, election fraud and that is unfortunately a bipartisan concern...or should be at least.  

Quoting Naturewoman4:

There's a reason why ppl come & go in this group.  Because, if they disagree with what ALOT of you on here says, they just get bashed & called names.  How is that debating?  Why would anyone want to even debate those ppl?  Alot of CM's on here don't want a Debate, they don't want the truth, the proof, they just want to call ppl names.  That's why I ignore alot of ppls posts on here.  I find it quite funny that when ppl on here keep asking you to address the questions they ask, yet they don't even address the questions when they are ask.  But, I'm going to go ahead & discuss this subject of Voter ID cards, even though I KNOW it's going to be ignored or called out for being lies.

Voter ID Cards WILL help protect the Election Integrity & Voter ID Laws.  It WAS the Dems. who were predominantly responsible for the Jim Crow Laws against Black Americans Voting.  Dems. have historically exhabited a tendency to go to any lengths to ensure that the results of Elections turn out in their favor.  As was the case during Jim Crow when they didn't want Americans to participate in choosing non-racist lenders.  ACORN was a failed organization & there has been 55 convictions for Voter Fraud & Voter ID Fraud from the Acorn's efforts which leaned heavily in favor of the Dem. Party.

http://www.breitbart.com/Big-Government/2012/04/13/voter-laws-racist-or-reasonable

*just click on the article "Voter ID: Racist or Reasonable"

(not that most ppl on here are going to read it & I know will say it's ALL false)

Quoting katy_kay08:

Naturewoman, do you want to address the on topic question that was asked of you or are you planning to ignore it?  

It requires no research on your part but rather an explanation of how voter identification would have prevented the case cited in the the OP.  

Quoting Naturewoman4:

You're so right Grandmab.  Perhaps, you & I should just keep up the conversation going, because it's obvious all the lefties on here just don't get it.  They are ALL SO AFRAID that their little Obama man is going to lose, then they'll loose their paychecks.  Well they better get use to it, because Obama is going to loose.  They better start saving their PA checks they get each month.  Because, it's going to soon all end for them.  NO MORE living off the Gov./Taxpayers.  What's really funny is they have no objection to showing ID's for getting a job, getting a passport, driver's license, Library Card, & all other things that require an ID for, yet they have a problem showing a Voter ID card to vote??  WOW!!  I wonder why?  tsk tsk

'

 

 

 



 


 



katy_kay08
by on Jun. 20, 2012 at 11:43 AM

chuckle...I've asked you a very on topic question and this is the second time you have gone off on a tangent accusing people of not wanting to "debate" the topic without actually answering the on topic question posed to you.  

I would love to stay on the topic presented.  Want to give it a try?  

How would stricter voter identification laws have prevented the alleged crime in the OP?  

As for your exclamations of feigned outrage over your links going unread.  If I were to use Daily Kos, Huffington Post or Media Matters or Bill Maher you would quickly discredit them as highly biased and their credibility would be in question.   When you use a source that has been proven to be bordering on criminally dishonest it should be expected to be brushed aside as irrelevant.  


Quoting Naturewoman4:

That's exactly my point, it doesn't matter IF I post a link any links or posts that are against anything that you & many others on here says, it won't be read or it will be dismissed as not credible.  Yet you want me to read yours?   So, what's the point?  I will continue to posts my opinions/links on various threads on here though, whether or not I get bashed, called names, because I know it is those that are insecure & have low self-esteem is why they resort to debating in this matter. 

 I always wondered if alot of you here don't want a debate on various topics, that goes against what you all believe, then what's the point?  Just debate amongst yourselves.  Also, what's the point to answering any of your questions, when you all don't even answer mine.  I've noticed that happening alot in here.  But, to answer a few of your questions.  You & others attack the poster of this thread for pointing out that Fraud whether Voter Fraud or Voter Registration Fraud and even the Fraud that the poster orginally stated, is a real problem. 

 Again, someone points out something that most of you on here just don't want to see or admit it's a problem.  Then, most of you resort to the name calling.  Who in their right mind wants to debate ppl like you all?  I'm ok with debating an issue, but the way it usually starts off is with attacks right off the bat.  So, how is that anything a person would want to participate in???  Katy_Kay, you have ask fair questions, but the problem is that again, even you do the same thing most of the other posters do.  They won't answer any questions when ask, they don't read any links that THEY keep asking for, they just say they won't read them because TO THEM they are not credible.  So, what's the point?

Quoting katy_kay08:

I've asked you a very simple question Naturewoman.  I've called you no names, I've provided sources with my comments and have only asked you questions on topic.  I will note that you still have not actually addressed the question I asked.  

I've provided a non partisan report on voter fraud.  I won't read breitbart's website.  It is the one of the least credible "sources" taking up space on the web.  

How would voter identification have prevented the alleged crime in the OP?  

Are you aware that Indiana has one of the strictest voter identification laws in the country?  

The OP's example was not a case of voter fraud.  It was a case of election fraud.  Do you know the difference?  Do you know which is far more likely to happen and which is more likely to cause the most damage?  

While Conservative voters are distracted by the red herring of voter identification, it allows attention to be diverted from the real risk to our voting system, election fraud and that is unfortunately a bipartisan concern...or should be at least.  

Quoting Naturewoman4:

There's a reason why ppl come & go in this group.  Because, if they disagree with what ALOT of you on here says, they just get bashed & called names.  How is that debating?  Why would anyone want to even debate those ppl?  Alot of CM's on here don't want a Debate, they don't want the truth, the proof, they just want to call ppl names.  That's why I ignore alot of ppls posts on here.  I find it quite funny that when ppl on here keep asking you to address the questions they ask, yet they don't even address the questions when they are ask.  But, I'm going to go ahead & discuss this subject of Voter ID cards, even though I KNOW it's going to be ignored or called out for being lies.

Voter ID Cards WILL help protect the Election Integrity & Voter ID Laws.  It WAS the Dems. who were predominantly responsible for the Jim Crow Laws against Black Americans Voting.  Dems. have historically exhabited a tendency to go to any lengths to ensure that the results of Elections turn out in their favor.  As was the case during Jim Crow when they didn't want Americans to participate in choosing non-racist lenders.  ACORN was a failed organization & there has been 55 convictions for Voter Fraud & Voter ID Fraud from the Acorn's efforts which leaned heavily in favor of the Dem. Party.

http://www.breitbart.com/Big-Government/2012/04/13/voter-laws-racist-or-reasonable

*just click on the article "Voter ID: Racist or Reasonable"

(not that most ppl on here are going to read it & I know will say it's ALL false)

Quoting katy_kay08:

Naturewoman, do you want to address the on topic question that was asked of you or are you planning to ignore it?  

It requires no research on your part but rather an explanation of how voter identification would have prevented the case cited in the the OP.  

Quoting Naturewoman4:

You're so right Grandmab.  Perhaps, you & I should just keep up the conversation going, because it's obvious all the lefties on here just don't get it.  They are ALL SO AFRAID that their little Obama man is going to lose, then they'll loose their paychecks.  Well they better get use to it, because Obama is going to loose.  They better start saving their PA checks they get each month.  Because, it's going to soon all end for them.  NO MORE living off the Gov./Taxpayers.  What's really funny is they have no objection to showing ID's for getting a job, getting a passport, driver's license, Library Card, & all other things that require an ID for, yet they have a problem showing a Voter ID card to vote??  WOW!!  I wonder why?  tsk tsk

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Peanutx3
by Ruby Member on Jun. 20, 2012 at 11:51 AM

Giggle

katy_kay08
by on Jun. 20, 2012 at 11:57 AM

Nature, I did ask the group how they felt about the government requiring all citizens be fingerprinted, as I expect most of the Conservatives that answered were against the idea.  

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