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Michigan Muslims rally against First Amendment (debunked)

Michigan Muslims rally against First Amendment

Michigan Muslims rally against First Amendment
From the event's website: "The gathering will be attended by over 1,000 community members, clergy, community leaders and public officials of all persuasions who continue to reject the messages of hate and Islamaphobia that have escalated in recent months and years, most recently with the production of the infamous film 'Innocence of Muslims.' " Photo Credit:Facebook

Led by a newspaper publisher, Muslim activists will call for putting limits on American free speech at a Dearborn rally this evening. You can't make this stuff up.

Nearly a decade after Dearborn's streets celebrated America for bringing down Saddam Hussein and opening a door to democracy in the Mideast, the same city will be the epicenter today of calls to squelch free speech. Protesting the film, "Innocence of Muslims," that has sparked protests in the Mideast, rally organizer Tarek Baydoun says that so-called blasphemy laws are necessary to prevent speech that hurts the "the religious feelings of Muslims."

This assault on the First Amendment in the name of the prophet Mohammed is a sad day in America — and confirms fears that Muslim-American activists do not understand the fundamental separation of church and state in the American Constitution.


9/30/12: This blog/article is clearly an attempt to aggravate people. Thanks to a great discussion and multiple contributions "we" have come to the conclusion that this article it bullshit.



by on Sep. 29, 2012 at 10:16 PM
Replies (441-450):
Meadowchik
by Silver Member on Oct. 3, 2012 at 8:10 AM
2 moms liked this

The OP posted what was in the Washington Times, which was an excerpt from the Detroit News, the original source.  That's where the quote came from originally.   You asked for a "legitimate news source." Are you saying that the Detroit News is not a legitimate News Source? 

Another way we can corroborate the quote is through the news site which tha event organizer and one quoted, Osama Siblani, publishes, Arab American News, which recently ran an opinion article saying, "The government and Congress must lead this effort. Only when our leaders stand with us to stop the hate will the hate stop. Only then will we realize God's plan for us." LINK  Congress makes the laws, the opinion is implying that we need to change the laws to address hate speech.  Therefore, Siblani's quote as printed in the Detroit News is consistent with the official opinion of his newspaper

BTW, Siblani's paper has a report on that rally as well, here's an excerpt from one of the speakers: "I want to thank you for taking time out of your busy schedule to come here and raise your voice in condemning the filthy movie that degrades our holy prophet in such a horrible way. We are gathering here to say that we as Muslims and all Muslims around the world do not accept this kind of bigotry, and this kind of message should not be taken in the name of freedom of speech. Freedom of speech does not entitle these bigots to attack our holy prophet," Imam Hassan Al-Qizwini stated." LINK

That's from the rally described by the OP. 

Quoting LilyofPhilly:

It's the same freaking article! Click on the link from the OP! Sheesh!
Quoting Meadowchik:

 


Quoting LilyofPhilly:




Quoting Meadowchik:


 


Quoting Veni.Vidi.Vici.:




Quoting Meadowchik:


 It's right there in what you quoted, not just the Methodist pastor, but the organizer of the event in the OP, Osama Siblani, said: "There is a need for deterrent legal measures against those individuals or groups that want to damage relations between people, spread hate and incite violence." He is talking about limiting free speech.


That doesn't mean that was the purpose of the rally.


Why is that so UNCLEAR to people?


 The fact of it being in the organiser's statement makes a reasonable case for it being atleast one purpose of the rally.


Can anyone find a legitimate news source where the organizer made this quote? You really trust the writer of this article to quote accurately?


 I looked it up, it's not in the OP.  The Detroit News has it:


http://apps.detnews.com/apps/blogs/watercooler/index.php?blogid=5561


 


 

 

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Meadowchik
by Silver Member on Oct. 3, 2012 at 8:15 AM
1 mom liked this

 I'm not sure if anyone else posted this, but it is an article about the rally in the OP from the newspaper published by the organizer of the rally in the OP:


Quote:

Unified rally at Dearborn Civic Center attacts over 1,000
Samer Hijazi
Monday, 10.01.2012, 05:05pm

 

DEARBORN-A message was heard loud and clear on Friday evening in Dearborn where a community rally standing up against violence and hate was held at the city's Civic Center located on Michigan Ave., where over 1,000 locals turned out to support the condemning of hate speech, while also defending the prophets of Islam.
The event included speeches from several local and religious leaders, who all supported a unified message as a community in response to the recent attacks against the religion of Islam, which intensified over the last several weeks due to an ant-Islamic video that caused worldwide uproar. The event started with a message from Osama Siblani, publisher of The Arab American News, who told the packed venue filled with adults and children that despite the intimidation that might have led the Muslim community into silence, he was stunned to see the community turn out to this particular event.
"When you were called to duty to come and stand up for prophet Muhammad and all the messengers of God, you said 'when and where' and now you are all here today. They keep dividing us into Sunni and Shia, but today all of us stand here more importantly as Muslims, more importantly as Americans and more importantly as human beings to condemn the violence, the hate, the extremism, the terrorism, and the attack on our prophet," Siblani told the crowd.
The crowd included both women and men of all ages as well as children and teenagers, many of whom held signs that displayed their love for the profit and denounced all forms of hate speech. Some of the signs in the audience included one's that read "we love prophet Muhammad" and "stand up against hate." Religious leaders from local mosque's were also present at the event, some of them taking the podium to address the crowd in both English and Arabic.
"I want to thank you for taking time out of your busy schedule to come here and raise your voice in condemning the filthy movie that degrades our holy prophet in such a horrible way. We are gathering here to say that we as Muslims and all Muslims around the world do not accept this kind of bigotry, and this kind of message should not be taken in the name of freedom of speech. Freedom of speech does not entitle these bigots to attack our holy prophet," Imam Hassan Al-Qizwini stated.
Attorney Tarek Beydoun, who was one of the head organizers of the event also got the crowd in attendance involved through social media, telling the crowd to take a picture of the packed room and use their twitter accounts along with the hash-tag "stopthehate" to spread the message to the entire world.
Other representation at the event included members from the Michigan Emergency Committee Against War and Injustice, the NAACP and CAIR-MI. Also present at the event was Dearborn Mayor Jack O'Reilly and Judge Richard Halloran from the Wayne County Circuit Court.
So we have the event organizer speaking on limiting the First Amendment, and a speaker at the rally doing so as well.  The gist of the OP was correct, in that atleast one of the themes of the rally was to speak against the First Amendment.  It is not debunked.
The newspaper also prints its official opinion on the subject, entitled, "Government must join us in efforts to stop hate," and it calls on the government and Congress to lead the way.  LINK

 

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LilyofPhilly
by Gold Member on Oct. 3, 2012 at 8:18 AM
Quoting Meadowchik:
You asked for a "legitimate news source." Are you saying that the Detroit News is not a legitimate News Source?



Do you not see the word "blog" in the link?
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Meadowchik
by Silver Member on Oct. 3, 2012 at 8:23 AM

See my post above. The quote in the OP as printed in the Detroit News is corroborated.

Quoting LilyofPhilly:

Quoting Meadowchick:
You asked for a "legitimate news source." Are you saying that the Detroit News is not a legitimate News Source?



Do you not see the word "blog" in the link?

 

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LilyofPhilly
by Gold Member on Oct. 3, 2012 at 8:28 AM
"The government and Congress must lead this effort. Only when our leaders stand with us to stop the hate will the hate stop. Only then will we realize God's plan for us." LINK

I see no reference in this link to abridging free speech. This is what the quote is referring to:

Nowhere is this culture of evil more evident than in the raging Islamophobia sweeping the country. Day after day, week after week, Muslims and Sikhs are being harrased, their homes, cars and institutions ravaged, their lives taken, their family members hurt. They are being fired from their jobs for praying, forced to eat food their religion prohibits and dress in a way they find immodest. They watch on TV their countries of origin go up in flames and their religion of birth being maligned. This is the American dream gone badly wrong.



He is asking that the government support Muslims against harrassment and violence.
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Meadowchik
by Silver Member on Oct. 3, 2012 at 8:29 AM

Yes, the MTA banned the posters, then was forced by court order to put them up.  In other words, it's not a localised issue in the US.

It's certainly an international issue.

Quoting Moniker:

Are you sure about that? I thought the subway ads went up already? 

Meadowchik
by Silver Member on Oct. 3, 2012 at 8:42 AM

There are already laws against violence and workplace discrimination.  In the cases those have been violated, they need to be better-enforced.  Congress makes the laws, does not enforce the law.

And, back to the subject of the OP, and as I showed in a previous post, a speaker at the rally in question did say that the First Amendment does not protect works like the film the "Innocence of Muslims:"

"I want to thank you for taking time out of your busy schedule to come here and raise your voice in condemning the filthy movie that degrades our holy prophet in such a horrible way. We are gathering here to say that we as Muslims and all Muslims around the world do not accept this kind of bigotry, and this kind of message should not be taken in the name of freedom of speech. Freedom of speech does not entitle these bigots to attack our holy prophet," Imam Hassan Al-Qizwini stated.

http://www.arabamericannews.com/news/index.php?mod=article&cat=InOurOpinion&article=5969 

So even if you discount the quote that the Detroit News printed, we still have this quote from another rally speaker above which was printed in the newspaper that the rally organizer publishes.

Quoting LilyofPhilly:

"The government and Congress must lead this effort. Only when our leaders stand with us to stop the hate will the hate stop. Only then will we realize God's plan for us." LINK

I see no reference in this link to abridging free speech. This is what the quote is referring to:

Nowhere is this culture of evil more evident than in the raging Islamophobia sweeping the country. Day after day, week after week, Muslims and Sikhs are being harrased, their homes, cars and institutions ravaged, their lives taken, their family members hurt. They are being fired from their jobs for praying, forced to eat food their religion prohibits and dress in a way they find immodest. They watch on TV their countries of origin go up in flames and their religion of birth being maligned. This is the American dream gone badly wrong.



He is asking that the government support Muslims against harrassment and violence.

 

LilyofPhilly
by Gold Member on Oct. 3, 2012 at 8:44 AM
"This kind of message should not be taken in the name of freedom of speech. Freedom of speech does not entitle these bigots to attack our holy prophet," Imam Hassan Al-Qizwini stated.


And that is for the courts to decide. If speech incites violence, then it is not protected by the first amendment. The Iman seems to be referencing this exception. He is stating his opinion that the video falls under such an exception. I don't personally agree, but I haven't seen the video either.
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Veni.Vidi.Vici.
by on Oct. 3, 2012 at 8:45 AM
1 mom liked this


Quoting Meadowchik:

There are already laws against violence and workplace discrimination.  In the cases those have been violated, they need to be better-enforced.  Congress makes the laws, does not enforce the law.

And, back to the subject of the OP, and as I showed in a previous post, a speaker at the rally in question did say that the First Amendment does not protect works like the film the "Innocence of Muslims:"

"I want to thank you for taking time out of your busy schedule to come here and raise your voice in condemning the filthy movie that degrades our holy prophet in such a horrible way. We are gathering here to say that we as Muslims and all Muslims around the world do not accept this kind of bigotry, and this kind of message should not be taken in the name of freedom of speech. Freedom of speech does not entitle these bigots to attack our holy prophet," Imam Hassan Al-Qizwini stated.

http://www.arabamericannews.com/news/index.php?mod=article&cat=InOurOpinion&article=5969 

So even if you discount the quote that the Detroit News printed, we still have this quote above which was printed in the newspaper that the rally organizer publishes.

 

Thank you! Thank you for all of your diligence and your insightful replies.

Veni.Vidi.Vici.
by on Oct. 3, 2012 at 8:47 AM
1 mom liked this


Quoting LilyofPhilly:

"This kind of message should not be taken in the name of freedom of speech. Freedom of speech does not entitle these bigots to attack our holy prophet," Imam Hassan Al-Qizwini stated.


And that is for the courts to decide. If speech incites violence, then it is not protected by the first amendment. The Iman seems to be referencing this exception. He is stating his opinion that the video falls under such an exception. I don't personally agree, but I haven't seen the video either.

I cannot determine which side you're debating.

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