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If you believe a woman should have her husbands consent before getting an abortion... sfag

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Do you think a woman needs her husbands consent for any other reproductive or pregnancy decision?

How about to get her tubes tied?

What if she wants a natural, no-intervention birth? Do she need his permission?

What if she wants a c-section? Or, flip that. What if he wants her to get a c-section? There are compelling studies showing that c-section is safer for the baby.

Can he forbid an epidural? Or require one?

It's his baby too, right? Doesn't he get the right to say how it is delivered?

by on Oct. 2, 2012 at 6:08 PM
Replies (61-70):
ramonafrog
by Bronze Member on Oct. 2, 2012 at 8:40 PM
As I previously stated...I am not interested in drama banter. I see that you are very passionate about your beliefs... Cool. I would never want to seem unconcerned about how other women choose to live.
My statements are purely about my own personal convictions and morals. I in no way mean to insinuate that I expect others to adapt to my way of thinking.
I still maintain that people know the possible results of having sex. I don't want more kids. However if our method of birth control were to mysteriously and magically fail... There's no doubt in my mind how I would proceed with my life. Sure it would be tough at times, no one ever promised life would be champagne and caviar.


Quoting paganbaby:

Consequences = punishment. If you have sex and have the misfourtune to get pregnant, you have to go through an entire pregnancy, labor and give birth against your will. Then you have the difficult choice of raising the baby you aren't financially or emotionally prepared for or the heart breaking one of giving them away to someone else.

Screw your body, the pain, the stretch marks, the engorged breasts. Screw your mind and the children who are left with a mother who is either stretched past her limits, or emotionally bankrupt and stuck picking up the peices after giving her baby away.

Yeah taking away a womans choice has NOTHING to do with the unborn at all. It's all about punishing women who dare open their legs.

Quoting ramonafrog:

Your logic?

I would never abort. Seriously... Under no circumstance. And the only one I find acceptable for others is in the case of rape.

Therefore not facing the consequences of your actions (choices, not forced) is a lack of personal responsibility....or, in your words, a way out... Which is considered a loophole. I do not think kids are punishment. I think people punish themselves and leave the door open for unecessary "problems" by acting irresponsibly




Quoting paganbaby:

That's only if you think children are a punishment.

Quoting ramonafrog:

A consequence loophole.





Quoting paganbaby:

An abortion is a loophole?

Quoting ramonafrog:

Loopholes... Gotta love em.







Quoting paganbaby:

*Shrugs* That may be true but there are ways out of those "consequences" and many woman chose to go that route. Now if my husband/boyfriend disagrees with what I've done then he doesn't have to stay with me. Either way, It's my choice, not his.

Quoting ramonafrog:

Sorry, I really don't want to get into any drama or debate... But, I think if a person has sex they know the possible consequence. Personal responsibility has become scarce. It's sad.









Quoting paganbaby:

I'm not an incubator. There's no reason why I should be forced to endure an pregnancy just so he can be a father. If I decided to continue with the pregnancy and chose adoption instead, that would be a different story. He could fight for his rights as a father then. But only then.

Btw, I completely disagree with the child support. Any parent should be able to walk away ie:sign away their rights, with no financial obligation.

Quoting ramonafrog:

I think it's a man's right to father his child. Women force men to be financially responsible (child support) when they don't want to be fathers... Why do women always have the final say so?






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ramonafrog
by Bronze Member on Oct. 2, 2012 at 8:51 PM
1 mom liked this
Hey... Shit happens. If anybody knows, I do. When I was 5 my mom was planning to leave my dad. it was gonna be my mom, me and my 3 year old sister. My dad was a mostly absent addict. He never mistreated us but he also predominately never provided for us. A week before we were gonna leave my mom found out she was pregnant. She had been using bc and was doing what she could to prevent pregnancy but still got pregnant. We have no family besides each other. Where would she have gone with 2 small kids and a baby on the way? So she stayed. My dad left for good 2 years later. Was life awesome? No. Was it hard at times? Sure. Did we go without? Never. Because my mom was a responsible person who chose to raise us properly and with good moral convictions and respect. Today...22 years later, she still has the Same job she found after my dad left and is number 2 in the company. Why? Personal responsibility and never giving up.
Quoting paganbaby:

Great point! I was going to say something along those lines too :-)

And I love the next question. I wonder how she's going to answer...

The
argument that abortion is so wrong and you're murdering a baby is lost
on me when a person says, 'well if it's rape then it's fine.' You're
either in or your out.
I've known people who have gotten pregnant while
on birth control, who have had condoms break and use plan B. So you're
saying that because they had sex they have to keep a child they don't
want, even when acting responsibly?

Quoting rfhsure:

 The argument that abortion is so wrong and you're murdering a baby is lost on me when a person says, 'well if it's rape then it's fine.' You're either in or your out. I've known people who have gotten pregnant while on birth control, who have had condoms break and use plan B. So you're saying that because they had sex they have to keep a child they don't want, even when acting responsibly? Women don't "force" men to take care of financial responsibility. In this case the woman is asking about a marriage. In a marriage, financial responsiblity has already been worked out between the couple, so especially in this circumstance, that's a statement that's not really relevant. it's a man's right to father his child - if the child is born. There's many cases where the guy will talk himself up and once the baby pops out he turns out to be a deadbeat. personal choice is personal choice. That's great that you would never get an abortion unless you're raped, but if you were in a situation where you still acted responsibly and were about to have a child you couldn't take care of or didn't want to have you may think differently. Just because you wouldn't have an abortion doesn't mean it's wrong for anyone else to have one. And the circumstances you're describing are very general and not applicable to every, if not most situations. Just as you wouldn't want to be forced into an abortion, many women don't want to be forced into carrying a child. That's the one topic the posts author left out: What if your husband asked you have an abortion? that would be terrible wouldn't it? So why should he have rights to ask any of those other things of a woman?


Quoting ramonafrog:

Your logic?
I would never abort. Seriously... Under no circumstance. And the only one I find acceptable for others is in the case of rape.
Therefore not facing the consequences of your actions (choices, not forced) is a lack of personal responsibility....or, in your words, a way out... Which is considered a loophole. I do not think kids are punishment. I think people punish themselves and leave the door open for unecessary "problems" by acting irresponsibly



Quoting paganbaby:


That's only if you think children are a punishment.


Quoting ramonafrog:

A consequence loophole.




Quoting paganbaby:


An abortion is a loophole?


Quoting ramonafrog:

Loopholes... Gotta love em.






Quoting paganbaby:


*Shrugs* That may be true but there are ways out of those "consequences" and many woman chose to go that route. Now if my husband/boyfriend disagrees with what I've done then he doesn't have to stay with me. Either way, It's my choice, not his.


Quoting ramonafrog:

Sorry, I really don't want to get into any drama or debate... But, I think if a person has sex they know the possible consequence. Personal responsibility has become scarce. It's sad.








Quoting paganbaby:


I'm not an incubator. There's no reason why I should be forced to endure an pregnancy just so he can be a father. If I decided to continue with the pregnancy and chose adoption instead, that would be a different story. He could fight for his rights as a father then. But only then.


Btw, I completely disagree with the child support. Any parent should be able to walk away ie:sign away their rights, with no financial obligation.


Quoting ramonafrog:

I think it's a man's right to father his child. Women force men to be financially responsible (child support) when they don't want to be fathers... Why do women always have the final say so?









 


Posted on CafeMom Mobile
paganbaby
by Teflon Don on Oct. 2, 2012 at 8:51 PM


Ummm then why did you write this? And the only one I find acceptable for others is in the case of rape.

Quoting ramonafrog:

As I previously stated...I am not interested in drama banter. I see that you are very passionate about your beliefs... Cool. I would never want to seem unconcerned about how other women choose to live.
My statements are purely about my own personal convictions and morals. I in no way mean to insinuate that I expect others to adapt to my way of thinking.
I still maintain that people know the possible results of having sex. I don't want more kids. However if our method of birth control were to mysteriously and magically fail... There's no doubt in my mind how I would proceed with my life. Sure it would be tough at times, no one ever promised life would be champagne and caviar.


Quoting paganbaby:

Consequences = punishment. If you have sex and have the misfourtune to get pregnant, you have to go through an entire pregnancy, labor and give birth against your will. Then you have the difficult choice of raising the baby you aren't financially or emotionally prepared for or the heart breaking one of giving them away to someone else.

Screw your body, the pain, the stretch marks, the engorged breasts. Screw your mind and the children who are left with a mother who is either stretched past her limits, or emotionally bankrupt and stuck picking up the peices after giving her baby away.

Yeah taking away a womans choice has NOTHING to do with the unborn at all. It's all about punishing women who dare open their legs.

Quoting ramonafrog:

Your logic?

I would never abort. Seriously... Under no circumstance. And the only one I find acceptable for others is in the case of rape.

Therefore not facing the consequences of your actions (choices, not forced) is a lack of personal responsibility....or, in your words, a way out... Which is considered a loophole. I do not think kids are punishment. I think people punish themselves and leave the door open for unecessary "problems" by acting irresponsibly




Quoting paganbaby:

That's only if you think children are a punishment.

Quoting ramonafrog:

A consequence loophole.





Quoting paganbaby:

An abortion is a loophole?

Quoting ramonafrog:

Loopholes... Gotta love em.







Quoting paganbaby:

*Shrugs* That may be true but there are ways out of those "consequences" and many woman chose to go that route. Now if my husband/boyfriend disagrees with what I've done then he doesn't have to stay with me. Either way, It's my choice, not his.

Quoting ramonafrog:

Sorry, I really don't want to get into any drama or debate... But, I think if a person has sex they know the possible consequence. Personal responsibility has become scarce. It's sad.









Quoting paganbaby:

I'm not an incubator. There's no reason why I should be forced to endure an pregnancy just so he can be a father. If I decided to continue with the pregnancy and chose adoption instead, that would be a different story. He could fight for his rights as a father then. But only then.

Btw, I completely disagree with the child support. Any parent should be able to walk away ie:sign away their rights, with no financial obligation.

Quoting ramonafrog:

I think it's a man's right to father his child. Women force men to be financially responsible (child support) when they don't want to be fathers... Why do women always have the final say so?







Lilypie - Personal pictureLilypie Breastfeeding tickers

ramonafrog
by Bronze Member on Oct. 2, 2012 at 8:55 PM
Clearly they are free to choose for themselves... But personally I find it Unnecessary for others unless they are truly not responsible for what happened.
Seriously, I cannot stress enough that my opinions are fundamentally based on people simply being responsible for their own actions.


Quoting paganbaby:


Ummm then why did you write this? And the only one I find acceptable for others is in the case of rape.

Quoting ramonafrog:

As I previously stated...I am not interested in drama banter. I see that you are very passionate about your beliefs... Cool. I would never want to seem unconcerned about how other women choose to live.

My statements are purely about my own personal convictions and morals. I in no way mean to insinuate that I expect others to adapt to my way of thinking.

I still maintain that people know the possible results of having sex. I don't want more kids. However if our method of birth control were to mysteriously and magically fail... There's no doubt in my mind how I would proceed with my life. Sure it would be tough at times, no one ever promised life would be champagne and caviar.




Quoting paganbaby:

Consequences = punishment. If you have sex and have the misfourtune to get pregnant, you have to go through an entire pregnancy, labor and give birth against your will. Then you have the difficult choice of raising the baby you aren't financially or emotionally prepared for or the heart breaking one of giving them away to someone else.

Screw your body, the pain, the stretch marks, the engorged breasts. Screw your mind and the children who are left with a mother who is either stretched past her limits, or emotionally bankrupt and stuck picking up the peices after giving her baby away.

Yeah taking away a womans choice has NOTHING to do with the unborn at all. It's all about punishing women who dare open their legs.

Quoting ramonafrog:

Your logic?


I would never abort. Seriously... Under no circumstance. And the only one I find acceptable for others is in the case of rape.


Therefore not facing the consequences of your actions (choices, not forced) is a lack of personal responsibility....or, in your words, a way out... Which is considered a loophole. I do not think kids are punishment. I think people punish themselves and leave the door open for unecessary "problems" by acting irresponsibly






Quoting paganbaby:

That's only if you think children are a punishment.

Quoting ramonafrog:

A consequence loophole.







Quoting paganbaby:

An abortion is a loophole?

Quoting ramonafrog:

Loopholes... Gotta love em.









Quoting paganbaby:

*Shrugs* That may be true but there are ways out of those "consequences" and many woman chose to go that route. Now if my husband/boyfriend disagrees with what I've done then he doesn't have to stay with me. Either way, It's my choice, not his.

Quoting ramonafrog:

Sorry, I really don't want to get into any drama or debate... But, I think if a person has sex they know the possible consequence. Personal responsibility has become scarce. It's sad.











Quoting paganbaby:

I'm not an incubator. There's no reason why I should be forced to endure an pregnancy just so he can be a father. If I decided to continue with the pregnancy and chose adoption instead, that would be a different story. He could fight for his rights as a father then. But only then.

Btw, I completely disagree with the child support. Any parent should be able to walk away ie:sign away their rights, with no financial obligation.

Quoting ramonafrog:

I think it's a man's right to father his child. Women force men to be financially responsible (child support) when they don't want to be fathers... Why do women always have the final say so?







Posted on CafeMom Mobile
PurpleChaos
by Member on Oct. 2, 2012 at 8:56 PM

For me that's definitely an iffy thing. Because when you're married, it's not some casual encounter. And yes while it is the womans body, the child is also the mans. He married her, and she married him, thus making huge decisions like an abortion a mutual consent. Only if the abortion is for convenience, not medical reasons. 

As for your other questions I say no, it's not really the same. Those are in regards to comfort during the delivery process, not something that sucks a fetus out in pieces or melts it. I think they're too different to really compare IMO. 

azpreemiemom
by on Oct. 2, 2012 at 8:58 PM

No, I don't think a husband should have to consent to any reproductive decisions regarding women. Yes, it is his baby too, however I always picture a battered wife being stuck in a bad situation becaue she can't get an abortion.

parentalrights1
by on Oct. 2, 2012 at 9:01 PM
2 moms liked this

I think if the man vetoes the decision to abort and the woman dies during labor, then he should be offered up for execution too.

The idea that a man can essentially tell a woman that she has to use her body as an incubator and endure all the physical and emotional pain that comes with pregnancy while he just sits on the side doing nothing but being a dictator is completely asinine.

Lizardannie1966
by on Oct. 2, 2012 at 9:02 PM
1 mom liked this

I've been blessed for 26+ years by a man that respectfully has always deferred to me when it came to medical decisions for my body.

So to be fair, I've always consulted with him and talked over things with him concerning my medical decisions.

In the end, however, he has always and WILL always recognize that I give the final green or red light and vice versa. IE...HE has the final thought on medical decisions for himself though he has always talked things over with me.

Quoting paganbaby:


Do you think a woman needs her husbands consent for any other reproductive or pregnancy decision?

How about to get her tubes tied?

What if she wants a natural, no-intervention birth? Do she need his permission?

What if she wants a c-section? Or, flip that. What if he wants her to get a c-section? There are compelling studies showing that c-section is safer for the baby.

Can he forbid an epidural? Or require one?

It's his baby too, right? Doesn't he get the right to say how it is delivered?


ashellbell
by shellbark on Oct. 2, 2012 at 9:02 PM
1 mom liked this
The "only rape" exception is so silly.
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mom23heathens
by Member on Oct. 2, 2012 at 9:03 PM

 The abortion decision i am iffy about. On one hand I think that he should be informed brcause he is the father but i don't know about needing consent. On the other hand i feel that if she didn't want a child she should have looked out for herself and used some form of birht control. All other aspects of reproduction are her business, however being married her husband is entitled to diclosure. It's not fair to keep something like this a secret. If he really wishes to be a father and she can't conceive any more he needs to know. All aspects of delivery are her decision as well because even though he is the father he isn't going through all the physical discomfort.

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