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In A Cautious Debate Obama Gets The Points He Needed: Romney lied all night long and it will catch up to him quickly.

Like the first few rounds of a heavy weight fight, Mitt Romney and Barack Obama spent a cautious night together mostly dancing around each other. Each made their points, but not aggressively so.

Romney tried to be the aggressor but will have more tape that can be played against him the morning after.

Obama was the cautious champ, picking his moments and more concerned with overplaying his hand than winning every point in the first meeting.

Like Reagan’s cautious approach to the debates in 1984, Obama knows he is the president.

He has the votes where he needs them and he knows that it is more important to be true to those voters that hold the key to his re-election than to try to run up the score early to please his fans.

Anyone tuning in tonight to see the candidates go for broke was disappointed – and I think ultimately most people were disappointed – especially the reporters covering the race.

Obama did not win the night on its own, but that is not the job of an incumbent president with an electoral college lead.

Just like the selection of his running mate and just like the convention, Romney failed to deliver.

Romney’s aggressiveness may have produced the worst moment of the night for him – if Democrats recognize it and nail him on it.

Romney claimed to not know how anyone could not profit on their taxes for shipping jobs overseas. That is not only a lie, the benefit exists, but Romney reaped great financial rewards for doing just that.

He personally and repeatedly benefited from a tax law he denied existed.

The bigger problem for Romney is he defined himself to the American public as a politician that was not going to cut taxes for the rich, was going to cut taxes for the middle class, loves Medicare and supports popular government programs.

Wait till the truth catches up to Mitt Romney.

Alternately, Obama spent the evening being cautious. It was the right move. He was the president tonight. He defended his record and had the two best push back moments of the night.

First, as Romney denied his central campaign theme of delivering rate cuts to the wealthiest Americans, Obama rightly pointed out that Romney’s big idea was “never mind”.

Second, Obama dropped an excellent line when he questioned if Romney was keeping his plans secret because they were “too good” for the middle class.

Those are classic lines that will be replayed and underscore central themes of the president’s message and strategy.

Little that Romney said tonight was consistent with the campaign he has run for the last five years.

Obama made his points tonight without seeming shrill or arguing over a couple of minutes of time with the moderator like Romney.

Romney showed some of the annoyance he did during the GOP debates when he did not feel he got everything he was entitled to. Not a smart move on his part.

On easier targets like hitting Romney for talking about needing a new accountant or a clean shot to hit Romney on parking his money overseas – Obama passed. Again, It was the right move. The reward is not worth the risk. Surrogates will have endless hours to re-litigate the debate. They can deliver those zingers.

Romney did nothing to make himself more likable and he found no way to end the hemorrhaging of Hispanic voters, women or seniors.

It was on Medicare that Romney was weakest. That will not do for his campaign.

Obama boxed him in on vouchers and Romney’s return to a failed argument that Obama cut Medicare benefits is a loser.

Romney turned in the biggest flubs of the night. The first was when he said Americans don’t want Medicare. He meant to say Obamacare, but in the turn of a phrase Romney both seemed to reveal a truth about his philosophy about Medicare and elevate the Affordable Care Act to the program, along with Social Security, American voters feel most passionate about.

Romney must feel confident on the right because he embraced a bigger government and seemed to walk away from a commitment to cut taxes.

Those on the right worried about Romney playing the right wing have new reason to be worried tonight.

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If they enforced bank regulations like they do park rules, we wouldn't be in this mess

by on Oct. 4, 2012 at 6:01 AM
Replies (131-138):
brookiecookie87
by Platinum Member on Oct. 5, 2012 at 6:05 PM


Quoting fullxbusymom:

They both lie!!! Not a one tells the truth 100% and basically only tell the public what they think they want to hear. I am voting for Romney hands down, Obama has had 4 yrs and things imo are a thousand times worse than ever before. Put up or shut up and it is time he just shut up and got the hell out of office.



Would you be willing to at least agree that things are not a thousand times worst than they were when President Obama first took Office in January 2009? And that things have gotten better?


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If they enforced bank regulations like they do park rules, we wouldn't be in this mess

Meadowchik
by Silver Member on Oct. 5, 2012 at 6:52 PM

 

Quoting brookiecookie87:

 

Quoting Meadowchik:

 

4 Year Sets makes no sense unless you are just comparing every instance of 4 years. Then everything would be different. There are President Terms where the debt that is owed has been trippled.

But if Romney is going to claim that President Obama has created more debt than almost all the Previous Presidents Combined there should be something to back that up already.

It makes no sense to give him a time block where he wasn't even President to make the numbers work.

The fiscal year 2008 represents what we subtract.  or do NOT count towards Obama.  Remember that there will be money spent after this term that Obama had something to do with, which I did not include.

If you don't think fiscal 2008 to fiscal 2012 is reasonable, then what is, when comparing debt under one president to any other(s)?

To be continued....

But now you are adding to his words to make them accurate.

I did not add to his words. Romney said, "The president's put in place as much public debt, almost as much debt held by the public as all prior presidents combined." 


He did not say in the future. Or you will. He said he already has.   Again-If you are willing to skew the data only looking at a certain type and then looking at time periods that don't make sense but match what you want to say.

I already asked you what time period you think makes sense, you did not answer that.

Then of course. But this whole debate was that Romney lied and you wanted facts. So skewing the data doesn't help the case much. There are plenty of honest ways he could have pointed out how much the debt has increased under Obama. There was no need to lie and no need for people to try and skew the data for him.

 

Actually it is rather complex no matter how you look at it. 

Remember that at the very beginning when you first claimed Romney "lied," you said, "Romney said President Obama has ran up our debt as much as all the prior Presidents Combined. That is not true.
When President Obama took Office the debt was around 10Trillion. Now it is around 15.6Trilion. 5 is not greater than 10 no matter how you cut it. Not my opinion but a lie from Romney." 

You misquoted Romney.  He said "debt held by the public," and your numbers there were not numbers reflecting debt held by the public, which does not include intragovernmental holdings.  Romney also said "put in place."  That could mean more or different than you assumed, as well.

So how have you demonstrated he lied if you could not even accurately quote Romney? 

 

The most pressing social issue today is the economy

Visit Mitt Romney for President, CafeMom Group

Sisteract
by Whoopie on Oct. 5, 2012 at 6:59 PM

A thousand times worse, in what way? Do you have a link for that # or are you talking about your personal predicament?

Quoting fullxbusymom:

They both lie!!! Not a one tells the truth 100% and basically only tell the public what they think they want to hear. I am voting for Romney hands down, Obama has had 4 yrs and things imo are a thousand times worse than ever before. Put up or shut up and it is time he just shut up and got the hell out of office.


Separation of church and state is for the protection of BOTH church and state.
Leading with hate and intolerance only leads to MORE hate and intolerance.
fullxbusymom
by Bronze Member on Oct. 5, 2012 at 7:16 PM
Just what I personally feel, personally have experienced and witnessed. He SUCKS ass and may just may be the worst president we have had in the history of this country.

Quoting Sisteract:

A thousand times worse, in what way? Do you have a link for that # or are you talking about your personal predicament?

Quoting fullxbusymom:

They both lie!!! Not a one tells the truth 100% and basically only tell the public what they think they want to hear. I am voting for Romney hands down, Obama has had 4 yrs and things imo are a thousand times worse than ever before. Put up or shut up and it is time he just shut up and got the hell out of office.


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Sisteract
by Whoopie on Oct. 5, 2012 at 7:22 PM

I am sure you realize that everyone has a unique and valid opinion as well, right?

If you look at the factual numbers pasted above (by brooke), you will see that the economy is actually better than in Nov 08.

So many variables: education and skill levels, experience...some are doing better and some aren't. It's really not all BO's fault- personal choices factor in as well.

Quoting fullxbusymom:

Just what I personally feel, personally have experienced and witnessed. He SUCKS ass and may just may be the worst president we have had in the history of this country.

Quoting Sisteract:

A thousand times worse, in what way? Do you have a link for that # or are you talking about your personal predicament?

Quoting fullxbusymom:

They both lie!!! Not a one tells the truth 100% and basically only tell the public what they think they want to hear. I am voting for Romney hands down, Obama has had 4 yrs and things imo are a thousand times worse than ever before. Put up or shut up and it is time he just shut up and got the hell out of office.



Separation of church and state is for the protection of BOTH church and state.
Leading with hate and intolerance only leads to MORE hate and intolerance.
kailu1835
by Ruby Member on Oct. 5, 2012 at 8:19 PM

Way to try and make it look like Obama won.  He didn't, by the way, and I doubt he'll win the election either.

pvtjokerus
by Platinum Member on Oct. 5, 2012 at 8:42 PM

U betcha' I'll blame him for the terrorist attacks due to his catering to the those he shouldn't have catered to......but let me know if you want to have a serious debate about this.  I'll be more than happy to go a round or two about this issue.  As for your below chart ......who is the author of it before I comment?

Quoting brookiecookie87:



Looking at what he came into, stopping that Recession, and making a recovery. You call that bad? (This contributes a lot to Unemployment, falling dollar, and lower credit rating).

Are you really blaming him for "terrorist attacks"? Does that mean we can blame President Bush and Republicans for 9/11?

Quoting pvtjokerus:

His answers are acceptable in the forum that he was in.  Stop running with the media liberal line.  Let's face it.  Obama can't defend his 4 years of failure: unemployment, falling dollar, lowered credit rating, terrorist attacks, failed foreign policy, cronyism among his inner circle, lies to the American public and so on and so on.

Quoting brookiecookie87:

Did you watch the debate?

When Obama pointed out Mitt Romney hasn't showed which tax loopholes/deductions he will close did he specify which? If he has been giving those details out can you present them?

Mitt Romney said he would replace Dodd Frank wall street reforms but he doesn't say which ones.

Mitt Romney said he will cut spending on programs that are not needed-But refuses to say which ones.


Obama says it better than I can. That 1 minute clip pretty much responds to everything Mitt Romney said.

Quoting pvtjokerus:

Romney freakin' laid out Frank and Dodd.  He gave points.  He has been given points but your precious liberal media has not been reporting them.  Sorry, you can't spin this one.  Facts are facts and Obama's arrogance got the best of him last night.

Quoting brookiecookie87:

 

Quoting CreziaMommyTo2:

well i guess you got that article from a bias opinion reporter, because everywhere else and from what i saw last night  ROMNEY KICKED ASS!

Yes-If by Kicked Ass you mean he dodged any attempt to give details on his plans. Denied his own Tax Plan.

Like I said earlier. It is really easy to look like the winner if you refuse to give any details about any of your plans but require the utmost scrutiny of your opponent, while at the same time denying anything that looks bad on you but again refusing to give any details if called on about it.



 

 

 

 


fullxbusymom
by Bronze Member on Oct. 5, 2012 at 10:14 PM
Some things are better and some parts are far worse. Yes I have done my research too. Sorry you will NEVER convince me he is a good president. The topics that are important to me and passionate about he is the complete opposite on and actually has done damage too. So each to their own, that is why it is America. I will be voting for Romney.

Quoting Sisteract:

I am sure you realize that everyone has a unique and valid opinion as well, right?

If you look at the factual numbers pasted above (by brooke), you will see that the economy is actually better than in Nov 08.

So many variables: education and skill levels, experience...some are doing better and some aren't. It's really not all BO's fault- personal choices factor in as well.

Quoting fullxbusymom:

Just what I personally feel, personally have experienced and witnessed. He SUCKS ass and may just may be the worst president we have had in the history of this country.



Quoting Sisteract:

A thousand times worse, in what way? Do you have a link for that # or are you talking about your personal predicament?

Quoting fullxbusymom:

They both lie!!! Not a one tells the truth 100% and basically only tell the public what they think they want to hear. I am voting for Romney hands down, Obama has had 4 yrs and things imo are a thousand times worse than ever before. Put up or shut up and it is time he just shut up and got the hell out of office.



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