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I doubt I will get an answer because I have asked this several times in this board and have yet to get an even remotely logical response. I think it is pretty indisputable that healthcare prior to ACA was failing. Many, many people had no health insurance ad even more than that many were also denied treatment because of ore-existing conditions. On top of that, hospitals we're losing money because of unpaid healthcare costs due to lack of insurance. It wasn't working for many of Americans.

So, I'll ask again, if not ACA, what?

by on Nov. 13, 2012 at 8:07 AM
Replies (31-40):
Debmomto2girls
by Debbie on Nov. 13, 2012 at 10:13 AM

 Lol...too true

Quoting PTmomma3:

Tax cuts, of course!

It doesn't matter what question you ask, the only answer given by the Republican Party is tax cuts. If they would only let rich people keep more of their money all of the world's problems would solve themselves through the free market. Apparently, if given even more money, insurance companies would suddenly grow a conscious and offer affordable prices for all.

 

futureshock
by Ruby Member on Nov. 13, 2012 at 12:03 PM


Quoting GLWerth:

I'm very likely NOT the demographic you were looking for in this, but I'll answer anyway.

Single Payer. Take the for-profit insurance industry out of the equation and make sure that our society has access to the care they need. Really DO that providing for the general welfare stuff.

I agree.

Take the for-profit insurance industry out of the equation

motha2daDuchess
by Silver Member on Nov. 13, 2012 at 12:35 PM

right, my daughter was born with a heart defect WITH insurance we are swimming in medical bill debt. Her cardiologist apt is 5000.00 every 6 months....

Quoting lga1965:

Catastrophic ..yes .
My grandson had a small tumor on his leg. MRI, P.E.T. scan, biopsy just for starters. Before the diagnosis.
After the diagnosis of synovial sarcoma there were two surgeries . After that more biopsies and a thousand dollar brace to correct the "foot drop " resulting from the surgery that removed the tumor , muscle tissue and nerve. If they had no Health Insurance .......where would they be now, financially ?
If the tumor had been benign there still would have been the tests to pay for ... thousands.
We all need health care and only employed people are fortune to have it if they work full time.
Quoting yourspecialkid:

 


Quoting lga1965:

Nowdays it would be impossible to pay cash for medical care for your kids unless you are prepared to write a check for several hundred dollars. For ordinary illnesses or injuries.For anything complicated.,you would need to empty your savings, sell stock or take a home equity loan. Ask me how I know this.......

 This is not necessarily true.  In the town we used to live in there was a doctor's office that offered a cash price that was the same as what Medicare paid.  There was another office that offered their own plan that was income based...they had med/vision/dental.  Both of these offices had stopped taking new Medicare & Medicaid patients...because they were a drain.


I ended up having surgery on my ankle...and physical therapy.  My Mom still paid for it..with her low wage jobs.  Depending on what you need sometimes insurance can be a lot more expensive than what it is worth.


Personally, I would like a catastrophic policy....we can handle the little stuff ourselves....we could save a lot of money.


tooptimistic
by Kelly on Nov. 13, 2012 at 12:51 PM
1 mom liked this

Totally agree.

The only way to fix healthcare is to have Univeral Healthcare and a single payer system.

Quoting romalove:

 ACA won't change the money hospitals lose because there will still be many uninsured and of course undocumenteds use hospitals as their healthcare clinics, and end up not paying bills.

I think if we must have universal healthcare we have to have a single payer system.  The patchwork of ACA is going to be a disaster for the economy on many different levels.


tooptimistic
by Kelly on Nov. 13, 2012 at 12:58 PM

Sorry but the cost of our insurance is going up not down.  Our deductable is going up.  ACA didn't do anything about the cost.

Quoting Debmomto2girls:

 They couldn't afford the insurane because of outrageous fees.  ACA makes it cheaper than before.  If I had to go in another direction, it would be single payer not expanding Tricare, medicaid, etc.

Quoting yourspecialkid:

 

Quoting Debmomto2girls:

Quoting yourspecialkid:

 First of all, health CARE in the US is not failing.  We have excellent medical care here.  We have a problem with the delivery of services.


Requiring people to have INSURANCE will not fix the problem.  IMHO, insurance specifically the HMO/PPO type plans is part of our problem.  I grew up with no insurance, yet went to the doctor when I was sick.  I even had a serious injury...broke my ankle in 2 places.  My Mom paid out of pocket for it and it didn't bankrupt her.  We didn't run to the doctor for everything.  I am not saying we shouldn'ti have insurance, I am just saying we shouldn't be running to the doc for a hangnail just because we have a $20 copay.


It would have been much easier and much cheaper to create a buy in for Tricare, Medicare or Medicaid.  Ins co's should be able to sell across state lines...there should be limits on law suits...ins regulations should be consistent across state lines...employers should get out of the ins business...med facilities should be encouraged to post prices....let people choose...create competition..ins policies should allow people to choose the coverage they want....we do with auto/home policies...


With the exception of a few elements the new law is nothing more than an expensive bureaucratic ball of crap.  Senator Wyden of OR had a better plan..he was a Dem and couldn't get an ear.  Ryan and Wyden even worked together some...no one wanted to hear the plan.  Why did we have to pass a plan before we even knew what was in it? 


In my opinion, telling someone they cannot have treatment because they can't get insurance because of a pre-existing condition, is an epic fail. Yes, we give great medical care but you either have to have a job that provides insurance or be poor enough for medical assistance. That isn't right

 So why not just force the ins companies to cover pre-existing conditions?  Why go to the 2000 pages of bureaucracy....fail to address many of the reasons hc is expensive...force people to buy it...then give a big chunk of them exemptions?

Forcing people to buy...or be fined...for something they already couldn't afford won't fix our problem and we don't have the money to pay for hc for everyone.  This country is so broke it would take more than 30 to pay off our debt if the govt didn't spend another single dime.

Again...why not expand Tricare, Medicare or Medicaid....and offer a buy in?

 


tooptimistic
by Kelly on Nov. 13, 2012 at 1:03 PM

Ryan and Wyden had a different plan.

Quoting Debmomto2girls:

No, I do not own stock in an insruance company. I am an RN who is sick of the way the system was.  No other candidate had a plan. The ACA took care of some issues I thought would solve some of the healthcare problems.  I think universal healthcare and/or single payer could maybe help even more.

 

The point of my original post was there has been a lot of talk from the right wing about "Obamacare", etc but not one ever had an alternative solution. Obviously, you do not either. Expanding tricare, medicaid, etc is still not going to cover those in need.  It may cover slightly more. and BTW, how would the government pay for the expansion? people but not enough, If you think people can afford healthcare without insurance you ar living in a dreamland.

Quoting yourspecialkid:

 

Quoting Debmomto2girls:

 They couldn't afford the insurane because of outrageous fees.  ACA makes it cheaper than before.  If I had to go in another direction, it would be single payer not expanding Tricare, medicaid, etc.

Quoting yourspecialkid:

 

Quoting Debmomto2girls:

Quoting yourspecialkid:

 First of all, health CARE in the US is not failing.  We have excellent medical care here.  We have a problem with the delivery of services.


Requiring people to have INSURANCE will not fix the problem.  IMHO, insurance specifically the HMO/PPO type plans is part of our problem.  I grew up with no insurance, yet went to the doctor when I was sick.  I even had a serious injury...broke my ankle in 2 places.  My Mom paid out of pocket for it and it didn't bankrupt her.  We didn't run to the doctor for everything.  I am not saying we shouldn'ti have insurance, I am just saying we shouldn't be running to the doc for a hangnail just because we have a $20 copay.


It would have been much easier and much cheaper to create a buy in for Tricare, Medicare or Medicaid.  Ins co's should be able to sell across state lines...there should be limits on law suits...ins regulations should be consistent across state lines...employers should get out of the ins business...med facilities should be encouraged to post prices....let people choose...create competition..ins policies should allow people to choose the coverage they want....we do with auto/home policies...


With the exception of a few elements the new law is nothing more than an expensive bureaucratic ball of crap.  Senator Wyden of OR had a better plan..he was a Dem and couldn't get an ear.  Ryan and Wyden even worked together some...no one wanted to hear the plan.  Why did we have to pass a plan before we even knew what was in it? 


In my opinion, telling someone they cannot have treatment because they can't get insurance because of a pre-existing condition, is an epic fail. Yes, we give great medical care but you either have to have a job that provides insurance or be poor enough for medical assistance. That isn't right

 So why not just force the ins companies to cover pre-existing conditions?  Why go to the 2000 pages of bureaucracy....fail to address many of the reasons hc is expensive...force people to buy it...then give a big chunk of them exemptions?

Forcing people to buy...or be fined...for something they already couldn't afford won't fix our problem and we don't have the money to pay for hc for everyone.  This country is so broke it would take more than 30 to pay off our debt if the govt didn't spend another single dime.

Again...why not expand Tricare, Medicare or Medicaid....and offer a buy in?

 

 LOL @ the ACA making insurance cheaper than before....this is NOT going to happen.  The exemptions alone will eat up any savings even dreamt of by the ACA.  Have you not been reading the paper or listening to the news?

Why are you insisting on going with a plan that is no plan...do you own stock in some insurance companies...why are you so FOR something that doesn't address the biggest cost influences to begin with?

Please tell me how you would pay for a single payer system....considering the country owes more than the wealth of its entirety.

 


tooptimistic
by Kelly on Nov. 13, 2012 at 1:13 PM

My daughter was born with a birth defect too.  She sees a pulmonologist, a gi doc, a nutritionist, is tube fed at night.  Our part of her supplies alone are costing us 100's a month,  co pays on her prescriptions,on top of the co pays for the docs.   That's not even mentioning meeting the deductible at the beginning of the year, and the 900 a month that comes out of hubbies check for insurance.  We are still making monthly payment on top of that for her NICU stay (just our part)  My DH works two jobs so we can pay for medical expenses.  We have an autistic son too, that we pay twice a week $50 for co pays for therapy.  Know what Obamacare did for us?  Nothing, but require us to have health insurance.  The price each year goes up, the deductible each year goes up.  

Quoting motha2daDuchess:a

right, my daughter was born with a heart defect WITH insurance we are swimming in medical bill debt. Her cardiologist apt is 5000.00 every 6 months....

Quoting lga1965:

Catastrophic ..yes .
My grandson had a small tumor on his leg. MRI, P.E.T. scan, biopsy just for starters. Before the diagnosis.
After the diagnosis of synovial sarcoma there were two surgeries . After that more biopsies and a thousand dollar brace to correct the "foot drop " resulting from the surgery that removed the tumor , muscle tissue and nerve. If they had no Health Insurance .......where would they be now, financially ?
If the tumor had been benign there still would have been the tests to pay for ... thousands.
We all need health care and only employed people are fortune to have it if they work full time.
Quoting yourspecialkid:

 


Quoting lga1965:

Nowdays it would be impossible to pay cash for medical care for your kids unless you are prepared to write a check for several hundred dollars. For ordinary illnesses or injuries.For anything complicated.,you would need to empty your savings, sell stock or take a home equity loan. Ask me how I know this.......

 This is not necessarily true.  In the town we used to live in there was a doctor's office that offered a cash price that was the same as what Medicare paid.  There was another office that offered their own plan that was income based...they had med/vision/dental.  Both of these offices had stopped taking new Medicare & Medicaid patients...because they were a drain.


I ended up having surgery on my ankle...and physical therapy.  My Mom still paid for it..with her low wage jobs.  Depending on what you need sometimes insurance can be a lot more expensive than what it is worth.


Personally, I would like a catastrophic policy....we can handle the little stuff ourselves....we could save a lot of money.



LindaClement
by Linda on Nov. 13, 2012 at 1:25 PM
1 mom liked this

I also agree.

Insurance companies are legal racketeers whose primary job is to take money off people --no matter what their feel-good advertising might suggest.

Like a good neighbour, state farm is there... unlike a good neighbour, usually to say 'no.'

Quoting futureshock:


Quoting GLWerth:

I'm very likely NOT the demographic you were looking for in this, but I'll answer anyway.

Single Payer. Take the for-profit insurance industry out of the equation and make sure that our society has access to the care they need. Really DO that providing for the general welfare stuff.

I agree.

Take the for-profit insurance industry out of the equation


motha2daDuchess
by Silver Member on Nov. 13, 2012 at 1:27 PM

already? how? what did they raise? have you looked into the state help have you tried to get all you can, does he work 2 full time jobs>? have you checked out what will help with the ACA?

Quoting tooptimistic:

My daughter was born with a birth defect too.  She sees a pulmonologist, a gi doc, a nutritionist, is tube fed at night.  Our part of her supplies alone are costing us 100's a month,  co pays on her prescriptions,on top of the co pays for the docs.   That's not even mentioning meeting the deductible at the beginning of the year, and the 900 a month that comes out of hubbies check for insurance.  We are still making monthly payment on top of that for her NICU stay (just our part)  My DH works two jobs so we can pay for medical expenses.  We have an autistic son too, that we pay twice a week $50 for co pays for therapy.  Know what Obamacare did for us?  Nothing, but require us to have health insurance.  The price each year goes up, the deductible each year goes up.  

Quoting motha2daDuchess:a

right, my daughter was born with a heart defect WITH insurance we are swimming in medical bill debt. Her cardiologist apt is 5000.00 every 6 months....

Quoting lga1965:

Catastrophic ..yes .
My grandson had a small tumor on his leg. MRI, P.E.T. scan, biopsy just for starters. Before the diagnosis.
After the diagnosis of synovial sarcoma there were two surgeries . After that more biopsies and a thousand dollar brace to correct the "foot drop " resulting from the surgery that removed the tumor , muscle tissue and nerve. If they had no Health Insurance .......where would they be now, financially ?
If the tumor had been benign there still would have been the tests to pay for ... thousands.
We all need health care and only employed people are fortune to have it if they work full time.
Quoting yourspecialkid:

 


Quoting lga1965:

Nowdays it would be impossible to pay cash for medical care for your kids unless you are prepared to write a check for several hundred dollars. For ordinary illnesses or injuries.For anything complicated.,you would need to empty your savings, sell stock or take a home equity loan. Ask me how I know this.......

 This is not necessarily true.  In the town we used to live in there was a doctor's office that offered a cash price that was the same as what Medicare paid.  There was another office that offered their own plan that was income based...they had med/vision/dental.  Both of these offices had stopped taking new Medicare & Medicaid patients...because they were a drain.


I ended up having surgery on my ankle...and physical therapy.  My Mom still paid for it..with her low wage jobs.  Depending on what you need sometimes insurance can be a lot more expensive than what it is worth.


Personally, I would like a catastrophic policy....we can handle the little stuff ourselves....we could save a lot of money.




Rowdys.Mommy
by Bronze Member on Nov. 13, 2012 at 1:31 PM

I dont think the ACA will change much.

I think the government overstepped by putting in the policy that we have to have insurance, thats infringing a little too close on my personal rights. Some of the things that he is putting in the ACA are good but others are not. Something needs to be done but not all of this.

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