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Pagan mom not allowed to hand out lit at school...

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after her son brought home a Bible that was given to him at school.


http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2088912/Pagan-mothers-fury-son-brings-home-Bible-school-witchcraft-books-banned.html

A school is being accused of not letting students practice religious freedom after they refused to let a pagan student's mother give out spell books, despite allowing bibles to be distributed.

Ginger Strivelli, from North Carolina, who practices Witchcraft, a form of Paganism, said she was upset when her 12-year-old son came home from North Windy Ridge intermediate school with a Bible.

She challenged the school about distributing the books, which were donated by the local Gideon group, and has prompted the Buncombe County Board of Education to reevaluate its policies regarding religious texts.

The Gideons International had delivered several boxes of the sacred books to the school office. The staff allowed interested students to stop by and pick them up.

But when Mrs Strivelli showed up at the school with Pagan spell books, she was turned away, despite being assured by the principal the school would make available religious texts donated by any group. 

School: North Windy Ridge intermediate school where children were given Gideon bibles

School: North Windy Ridge intermediate school where children were given Gideon bibles

The district announced in  statement: 'Buncombe County School officials are currently reviewing relevant policies and practices with school board attorneys. 

 

'During this review period, no school in the system will be accepting donations of materials that could be viewed as advocating a particular religion or belief.'

Debate: The handing out of bibles in the school has dragged it into controversy about religious freedom

Debate: The handing out of bibles in the school has dragged it into controversy about religious freedom

The First Amendment gives public schools two clear choices when it comes to the distribution of religious texts.

Michael Broyde, a professor and senior fellow at Emory University's Center for the Study of Law and Religion told Fox News: 'You can either open your public school up to all religious material, or you can say no religious material.

'You can't say, "You can distribute religious material, but only from the good mainstream faiths".

'America runs a grand, noble experiment in religious diversity without violence. There's no killing of the Jews. There's no Catholic-Protestant violence. We are very successful in this grand experiment.'

Ms Strivelli agrees with this stance that it should be all or nothing and said she found many others who agreeds: 'Many Christians have stood up and said they agree with me too. Because, as much as they may like the Bible, they don't want Jehovah's Witnesses coming in with Watch Tower (magazines) or Catholics coming in and having them pray the Rosary.'



Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2088912/Pagan-mothers-fury-son-brings-home-Bible-school-witchcraft-books-banned.html#ixzz2D0OQfqvy 
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by on Nov. 22, 2012 at 8:33 PM
Replies (31-40):
LavenderMom23
by Bronze Member on Nov. 22, 2012 at 9:59 PM

What kids can walk to their local church these days? The article mentioned an intermediate school.

Quoting punky3175:

If kids/people are interested they can walk themselves to their local church and ask questions there just like anyone else. It shouldn't be done in schools.

Quoting LavenderMom23:

It wasn't like they passed the Bibles out in classrooms. It was very respectful, the bibles were left for interested students. Students that took the time to walk themselves into the office. So I would not say they distributed these bibles. They were simply 'made available'. And how many students would voluntarily go in and pick one up? Not many in my area. I would have been okay with all religions dropping off their 'official' book if they have one and this gal could easily have been dismissed bc pagans don't have an official book. It's not about indoctrinating kids, its about supplying materials to those that already want it. Now if they advertised that this was the truth or passed them out it would be a different story.


punky3175
by Punky on Nov. 22, 2012 at 9:59 PM
1 mom liked this
The great thing about paganism? We don't need a 'higher authority' to tell us what to study, how to 'worship' or what to believe. So why couldn't the book mentioned below or even 'The Complete Idiots Guide to Paganism' be acceptable to leave for interested students?

Quoting LavenderMom23:

Because the book needs to be backed by a majority, to be sure content is accurate to that faith. Maybe your book is legit, but where is the rule/standard to know without an official text? Now if you could get a local religious leader to approve it that is like a High Priest or fills a smiliar role to approve it, then cool drop it off in the office. Definitely not upset about it being pagan. Just need a standard.

Quoting blues_pagan:

So just because Pagans don't have an "official" book means that we have no grounds to try to distribute materials in the same way?  I have a great book called Druid Magic that teaches people about the "magical" side of Pagan Druidism as well as the historical side.  Why shouldn't I be allowed to bring that in to leave out if the school allows Bibles?

Quoting LavenderMom23:

It wasn't like they passed the Bibles out in classrooms. It was very respectful, the bibles were left for interested students. Students that took the time to walk themselves into the office. So I would not say they distributed these bibles. They were simply 'made available'. And how many students would voluntarily go in and pick one up? Not many in my area. I would have been okay with all religions dropping off their 'official' book if they have one and this gal could easily have been dismissed bc pagans don't have an official book. It's not about indoctrinating kids, its about supplying materials to those that already want it. Now if they advertised that this was the truth or passed them out it would be a different story.



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blues_pagan
by on Nov. 22, 2012 at 10:00 PM
1 mom liked this

I always find it funny when people state things like, "Oh my it has all this bad stuff in it" and yet they fail to realize that Lot's daughters got him drunk and basically raped him after they left Sodom/Gamorrah.  They fail to realize that there are stories of the Israelites going in and killing entire cities, including women and children.  The list goes on and on in that book.

Quoting punky3175:

Beat me to it. ;-)

Quoting blues_pagan:

Have you read the bible?

It is full of incest, murder, prostitution, and much more.  

Quoting AlekD:

The fact is that we don't know what she was attempting to distribute therefore and arguments for or against her actions are based in ignorance. There are pagan works that are inappropriate for grade school, books that deal with things like "the great rite" sex magik blood magick etc. All we know is that she tried to distribute "spell books " that could mean anything. That's why I said I was withholding judgement unless and until it is revealed exactly what she was trying to distribute.



Quoting blues_pagan:

That book is a work of fiction.  I take it you also want Catcher in the Rye taken out of schools as well?

Quoting AlekD:

You need to ask why Diary of a Drug Fiend wouldn't exactly be appropriate for school?







Quoting blues_pagan:

I have read a lot of Crowley as well as others.  Once again, why shouldn't it be distributed at a public school?

Quoting AlekD:

I don't know if you have read much Crowley but there are definitely legitimate reasons why it might not he allowed to be distributed at a public school.











Quoting blues_pagan:

Why would that matter?

Quoting AlekD:

I would have to know what book she was handing out before casting judgement.






punky3175
by Punky on Nov. 22, 2012 at 10:00 PM
Doesn't mean it's any more acceptable to try to 'recruit' at the public school.

Quoting LavenderMom23:

What kids can walk to their local church these days? The article mentioned an intermediate school.

Quoting punky3175:

If kids/people are interested they can walk themselves to their local church and ask questions there just like anyone else. It shouldn't be done in schools.



Quoting LavenderMom23:

It wasn't like they passed the Bibles out in classrooms. It was very respectful, the bibles were left for interested students. Students that took the time to walk themselves into the office. So I would not say they distributed these bibles. They were simply 'made available'. And how many students would voluntarily go in and pick one up? Not many in my area. I would have been okay with all religions dropping off their 'official' book if they have one and this gal could easily have been dismissed bc pagans don't have an official book. It's not about indoctrinating kids, its about supplying materials to those that already want it. Now if they advertised that this was the truth or passed them out it would be a different story.


Posted on the NEW CafeMom Mobile
blues_pagan
by on Nov. 22, 2012 at 10:01 PM

The school was a Junior high school.

Quoting LavenderMom23:

What kids can walk to their local church these days? The article mentioned an intermediate school.

Quoting punky3175:

If kids/people are interested they can walk themselves to their local church and ask questions there just like anyone else. It shouldn't be done in schools.

Quoting LavenderMom23:

It wasn't like they passed the Bibles out in classrooms. It was very respectful, the bibles were left for interested students. Students that took the time to walk themselves into the office. So I would not say they distributed these bibles. They were simply 'made available'. And how many students would voluntarily go in and pick one up? Not many in my area. I would have been okay with all religions dropping off their 'official' book if they have one and this gal could easily have been dismissed bc pagans don't have an official book. It's not about indoctrinating kids, its about supplying materials to those that already want it. Now if they advertised that this was the truth or passed them out it would be a different story.



FromAtoZ
by AllieCat on Nov. 22, 2012 at 10:02 PM
1 mom liked this


Quoting LavenderMom23:

It wasn't like they passed the Bibles out in classrooms. It was very respectful, the bibles were left for interested students. Students that took the time to walk themselves into the office. So I would not say they distributed these bibles. They were simply 'made available'. And how many students would voluntarily go in and pick one up? Not many in my area. I would have been okay with all religions dropping off their 'official' book if they have one and this gal could easily have been dismissed bc pagans don't have an official book. It's not about indoctrinating kids, its about supplying materials to those that already want it. Now if they advertised that this was the truth or passed them out it would be a different story.

No religious book, Bible or otherwise, belong in a public school.  Whether that be in the officer or otherwise.

It is just best to leave it ALL out of the schools.


"A bird doesn't sing because it has an answer, it sings because it has a song." ~ Maya Angelou

AlekD
by Gold Member on Nov. 22, 2012 at 10:05 PM
1 mom liked this
Yes I know. But it is a historical book describing historical practices in pretty vague ways. I know you might disagree but that is irrelevant to my argument here.The fact remains that we do not know the nature of what she was attempting to distribute. Was it a scholarly look at paganism by a reputable author? A book of spells? A tract written by her personally? Something her high priest or priestess has prepared? We have no idea. The story doesn't say. You may be right, that she was distributing something informative and useful and is being unjustly discriminated against. But you may be wrong, she might have been trying to distribute a book that explains complex sex acts and violent rites. Paganism has no hierarchy, literally anyone can write a book and say it reflects pagan thought. I just think it is foolish, especially for someone as smart as you, to argue for her actions when there is so little information about those actions.



Also, not sure why you are so adament to win an argument against me since I said I was withholding judgement based on lack of information, not simply saying the school was right to deny her.


Quoting blues_pagan:

Have you read the bible?

It is full of incest, murder, prostitution, and much more.  

Quoting AlekD:

The fact is that we don't know what she was attempting to distribute therefore and arguments for or against her actions are based in ignorance. There are pagan works that are inappropriate for grade school, books that deal with things like "the great rite" sex magik blood magick etc. All we know is that she tried to distribute "spell books " that could mean anything. That's why I said I was withholding judgement unless and until it is revealed exactly what she was trying to distribute.





Quoting blues_pagan:

That book is a work of fiction.  I take it you also want Catcher in the Rye taken out of schools as well?

Quoting AlekD:

You need to ask why Diary of a Drug Fiend wouldn't exactly be appropriate for school?









Quoting blues_pagan:

I have read a lot of Crowley as well as others.  Once again, why shouldn't it be distributed at a public school?

Quoting AlekD:

I don't know if you have read much Crowley but there are definitely legitimate reasons why it might not he allowed to be distributed at a public school.















Quoting blues_pagan:

Why would that matter?

Quoting AlekD:

I would have to know what book she was handing out before casting judgement.





Posted on the NEW CafeMom Mobile
FromAtoZ
by AllieCat on Nov. 22, 2012 at 10:07 PM
1 mom liked this


Quoting AlekD:

Yes I know. But it is a historical book describing historical practices in pretty vague ways. I know you might disagree but that is irrelevant to my argument here.The fact remains that we do not know the nature of what she was attempting to distribute. Was it a scholarly look at paganism by a reputable author? A book of spells? A tract written by her personally? Something her high priest or priestess has prepared? We have no idea. The story doesn't say. You may be right, that she was distributing something informative and useful and is being unjustly discriminated against. But you may be wrong, she might have been trying to distribute a book that explains complex sex acts and violent rites. Paganism has no hierarchy, literally anyone can write a book and say it reflects pagan thought. I just think it is foolish, especially for someone as smart as you, to argue for her actions when there is so little information about those actions.



Also, not sure why you are so adament to win an argument against me since I said I was withholding judgement based on lack of information, not simply saying the school was right to deny her.


Quoting blues_pagan:

Have you read the bible?

It is full of incest, murder, prostitution, and much more.  

Quoting AlekD:

The fact is that we don't know what she was attempting to distribute therefore and arguments for or against her actions are based in ignorance. There are pagan works that are inappropriate for grade school, books that deal with things like "the great rite" sex magik blood magick etc. All we know is that she tried to distribute "spell books " that could mean anything. That's why I said I was withholding judgement unless and until it is revealed exactly what she was trying to distribute.





Quoting blues_pagan:

That book is a work of fiction.  I take it you also want Catcher in the Rye taken out of schools as well?

Quoting AlekD:

You need to ask why Diary of a Drug Fiend wouldn't exactly be appropriate for school?









Quoting blues_pagan:

I have read a lot of Crowley as well as others.  Once again, why shouldn't it be distributed at a public school?

Quoting AlekD:

I don't know if you have read much Crowley but there are definitely legitimate reasons why it might not he allowed to be distributed at a public school.















Quoting blues_pagan:

Why would that matter?

Quoting AlekD:

I would have to know what book she was handing out before casting judgement.





I get what you are saying and I am not passing judgement on this lady either.  Or the Gideons as they are known for distributing Bibles.  If any thing, the school was at fault for accepting the Bibles.

Any religious material should not be allowed to be handed out in any public school.  Whether that be by way of the material sitting on a desk and let people pick one if they want, or otherwise.

You keep it all out and then no one can complain, be offended or otherwise.  Or at least that is how it should be in a perfect world.

"A bird doesn't sing because it has an answer, it sings because it has a song." ~ Maya Angelou

Luv.My.Kidz
by on Nov. 22, 2012 at 10:08 PM
1 mom liked this

Whether the "Bible" was in the office for students to take as will or not.... the refusal of the "Pagan spell book" was uncalled for. If one religious avenue can do it, all can. PERIOD.

blues_pagan
by on Nov. 22, 2012 at 10:09 PM
1 mom liked this

I am not trying to win an arguement.  All I am trying to point out is that using your logic the Bible should also be banned from being handed out due to having much of the same writing in it.  And the practices described are far from vague.  

Either way, I think that what happened to this woman is wrong.  Either you allow all religious beliefs or you don't.  I would go for don't.

Quoting AlekD:

Yes I know. But it is a historical book describing historical practices in pretty vague ways. I know you might disagree but that is irrelevant to my argument here.The fact remains that we do not know the nature of what she was attempting to distribute. Was it a scholarly look at paganism by a reputable author? A book of spells? A tract written by her personally? Something her high priest or priestess has prepared? We have no idea. The story doesn't say. You may be right, that she was distributing something informative and useful and is being unjustly discriminated against. But you may be wrong, she might have been trying to distribute a book that explains complex sex acts and violent rites. Paganism has no hierarchy, literally anyone can write a book and say it reflects pagan thought. I just think it is foolish, especially for someone as smart as you, to argue for her actions when there is so little information about those actions.



Also, not sure why you are so adament to win an argument against me since I said I was withholding judgement based on lack of information, not simply saying the school was right to deny her.


Quoting blues_pagan:

Have you read the bible?

It is full of incest, murder, prostitution, and much more.  

Quoting AlekD:

The fact is that we don't know what she was attempting to distribute therefore and arguments for or against her actions are based in ignorance. There are pagan works that are inappropriate for grade school, books that deal with things like "the great rite" sex magik blood magick etc. All we know is that she tried to distribute "spell books " that could mean anything. That's why I said I was withholding judgement unless and until it is revealed exactly what she was trying to distribute.





Quoting blues_pagan:

That book is a work of fiction.  I take it you also want Catcher in the Rye taken out of schools as well?

Quoting AlekD:

You need to ask why Diary of a Drug Fiend wouldn't exactly be appropriate for school?









Quoting blues_pagan:

I have read a lot of Crowley as well as others.  Once again, why shouldn't it be distributed at a public school?

Quoting AlekD:

I don't know if you have read much Crowley but there are definitely legitimate reasons why it might not he allowed to be distributed at a public school.















Quoting blues_pagan:

Why would that matter?

Quoting AlekD:

I would have to know what book she was handing out before casting judgement.






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