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Westboro, what you ladies think of this?

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http://news.yahoo.com/petition-urges-white-house-classify-westboro-church-hate-192906943.html


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Jasmine

Mother to three beautiful kids, Faith Milany 5-24-06, Alexander 8-11-07, Khaleb Mobin 3-02-10
by on Dec. 28, 2012 at 9:05 AM
Replies (21-30):
Jers.
by on Dec. 28, 2012 at 1:27 PM

AGAIN, this is not about free speech - Scroll Up!

Quoting GLWerth:

They are indeed a hateful group, but unfortunately, their speech is protected.

We have a right to protest it. We have a right to stand between them and the objects of their hate (which seems to include everyone and everything save themselves), but the government doesn't have the right to stop them from speaking.

They are horrible, they are disgusting, but they have the right to speak.

And we have the right and responsibility to speak against them.


katy_kay08
by on Dec. 28, 2012 at 1:36 PM
1 mom liked this

The tax exempt code doesn't prevent them from being involved in all political activity or even prevent them from having a political agenda.  There is still quite a bit a church can do and still maintain it's tax exemption status.  

Jers.
by on Dec. 28, 2012 at 1:37 PM

Ignore them and they will go away? Do you really think that is the way they work? And in the meantime, they can keep their religious organization status and all the benefits that go along with it?  

No one is arguing their first amendment right.  We are arguing their status as a religious organization.  They can keep doing what they do and we will keep counter protestting, BUT they should do what they do classified as a hate group and not a church.

Quoting ReadWriteLuv:

I think every time we make a post about them, they win, no matter what the context. I refuse to discuss them or give credence to their cause. That said, I realize I am breaking my own rule by coming in here and replying to this post, but occasionally I like to make this stance known. By making a petition, signing a petition, and creating this post you are feeding their machine.

The only way to get rid of these people is to ignore them completely. Even negative press is good press. Let's all just stop discussing them and making them famous. It's what they want. And this petition will do you no good, they've brought their cases to high courts before, and won. That is why they are church, they are protected by that fact in addition to the 1st amendment. 


Jers.
by on Dec. 28, 2012 at 1:41 PM
1 mom liked this

No, but in 2011 the IRS removed tax-exempt statuses from many gay hate groups.  WBC is hate group on so many levels, so they should lose theirs too.

Quoting katy_kay08:

The tax exempt code doesn't prevent them from being involved in all political activity or even prevent them from having a political agenda.  There is still quite a bit a church can do and still maintain it's tax exemption status.  


ReadWriteLuv
by Silver Member on Dec. 28, 2012 at 1:49 PM
1 mom liked this
By making a big deal about them you are giving them what they want. This is their goal. This is their end game. They WANT to be hated. They WANT people to get in their faces and protest against them. You are playing info their hands. They've got you hook, line and sinker.

Quoting Jers.:

Ignore them and they will go away? Do you really think that is the way they work? And in the meantime, they can keep their religious organization status and all the benefits that go along with it?  

No one is arguing their first amendment right.  We are arguing their status as a religious organization.  They can keep doing what they do and we will keep counter protestting, BUT they should do what they do classified as a hate group and not a church.


Quoting ReadWriteLuv:

I think every time we make a post about them, they win, no matter what the context. I refuse to discuss them or give credence to their cause. That said, I realize I am breaking my own rule by coming in here and replying to this post, but occasionally I like to make this stance known. By making a petition, signing a petition, and creating this post you are feeding their machine.

The only way to get rid of these people is to ignore them completely. Even negative press is good press. Let's all just stop discussing them and making them famous. It's what they want. And this petition will do you no good, they've brought their cases to high courts before, and won. That is why they are church, they are protected by that fact in addition to the 1st amendment. 


Posted on the NEW CafeMom Mobile
Jers.
by on Dec. 28, 2012 at 1:51 PM

Well the last  counter protest my kids and I attended, WBC didn't show up - they never left their hotel room.

Quoting ReadWriteLuv:

By making a big deal about them you are giving them what they want. This is their goal. This is their end game. They WANT to be hated. They WANT people to get in their faces and protest against them. You are playing info their hands. They've got you hook, line and sinker.

Quoting Jers.:

Ignore them and they will go away? Do you really think that is the way they work? And in the meantime, they can keep their religious organization status and all the benefits that go along with it?  

No one is arguing their first amendment right.  We are arguing their status as a religious organization.  They can keep doing what they do and we will keep counter protestting, BUT they should do what they do classified as a hate group and not a church.


Quoting ReadWriteLuv:

I think every time we make a post about them, they win, no matter what the context. I refuse to discuss them or give credence to their cause. That said, I realize I am breaking my own rule by coming in here and replying to this post, but occasionally I like to make this stance known. By making a petition, signing a petition, and creating this post you are feeding their machine.

The only way to get rid of these people is to ignore them completely. Even negative press is good press. Let's all just stop discussing them and making them famous. It's what they want. And this petition will do you no good, they've brought their cases to high courts before, and won. That is why they are church, they are protected by that fact in addition to the 1st amendment. 



katy_kay08
by on Dec. 28, 2012 at 1:55 PM

Could you provide a list of which groups?  My search turned up one, and the reason for the removal was not filing proper documentation.  

According to a recent article/report the IRS has not be conducting investigations of religious organizations for the last three years.

Quoting Jers.:

No, but in 2011 the IRS removed tax-exempt statuses from many gay hate groups.  WBC is hate group on so many levels, so they should lose theirs too.

Quoting katy_kay08:

The tax exempt code doesn't prevent them from being involved in all political activity or even prevent them from having a political agenda.  There is still quite a bit a church can do and still maintain it's tax exemption status.  



ReadWriteLuv
by Silver Member on Dec. 28, 2012 at 1:57 PM
1 mom liked this
They don't NEED to show up! The press told everyone they were there. They got their 5 minutes. They got the attention. They still got their name in papers and had a group of people who hate them to organize a protest against them. The only way that would have been sweeter for them is if armed gunmen came in and mowed them down, or if their hotel would have had a bomb threat. You play into their hands every time you discuss them or go to protest them. It's completely counter productive. The local and national medias should ignore them completely.

Quoting Jers.:

Well the last  counter protest my kids and I attended, WBC didn't show up - they never left their hotel room.


Quoting ReadWriteLuv:

By making a big deal about them you are giving them what they want. This is their goal. This is their end game. They WANT to be hated. They WANT people to get in their faces and protest against them. You are playing info their hands. They've got you hook, line and sinker.



Quoting Jers.:

Ignore them and they will go away? Do you really think that is the way they work? And in the meantime, they can keep their religious organization status and all the benefits that go along with it?  

No one is arguing their first amendment right.  We are arguing their status as a religious organization.  They can keep doing what they do and we will keep counter protestting, BUT they should do what they do classified as a hate group and not a church.



Quoting ReadWriteLuv:

I think every time we make a post about them, they win, no matter what the context. I refuse to discuss them or give credence to their cause. That said, I realize I am breaking my own rule by coming in here and replying to this post, but occasionally I like to make this stance known. By making a petition, signing a petition, and creating this post you are feeding their machine.

The only way to get rid of these people is to ignore them completely. Even negative press is good press. Let's all just stop discussing them and making them famous. It's what they want. And this petition will do you no good, they've brought their cases to high courts before, and won. That is why they are church, they are protected by that fact in addition to the 1st amendment. 



Posted on the NEW CafeMom Mobile
cammibear
by Gold Member on Dec. 28, 2012 at 2:01 PM
2 moms liked this
"Hate speech"/ "Hate Group" is nothing more than an attempt to silence those that speak out against moral relativity.

Violence against any person for any reason is already against the law. Labeling groups as hate groups because they speak out against things they consider to be bad for society is just hate from the opposite end. It's a violation of ones freedom of speech just because you don't like or agree with what they are saying.

In my hometown people lined the streets for miles to act as a buffer between Westboro and a fallen soldiers funeral. People traveled for miles to be a part of this out of respect for the family. That I stand behind. Giving government any control over any area of free speech I will stand against because it's unconstitutional.



Quoting Jers.:

hate group is an organized group or movement that advocates and practices hatredhostility, or violence towards members of a race, ethnicity, religion, gender, sexual orientation or other designated sector of society. 

I am not a group (nor do I advocate hatred, hostility or violence toward members of a race, ethnicity, religion, gender or sexual orientation).  

They can say and do whatever they want, but I am against them doing it all as a CHURCH and receiving federal benefits as a religious organization.  They are what the US defines as a hate group and they should be classified as such.  The US government should not financially support hate groups.


Quoting yourspecialkid:

 


Quoting Jers.:


I am all for free speech, but these people are the most deranged "church" I've ever seen.


Their antics certainly fit the definition of a hate group, so they should be classified as such.


Quoting yourspecialkid:


 They can petition what they want it is free speech....just like the folks at WBC can spew what they want.....the SCOTUS has already ruled what they spew as free speech.


 




 So should we classify YOU as a hate group too?  The free speech door has to swing both ways...............unless you really want to give someone the authority to decide what is hate speech.....I am sure the folks at WBC would feel YOU are a hater.


This is WHY the SCOTUS said they are using their right of free speech.


I am not supporting the WBC...I think they are awful..........BUT I will...to my last breath...support their right to free speech.......lest I lose mine.


 



Posted on the NEW CafeMom Mobile
Jers.
by on Dec. 28, 2012 at 2:03 PM

I should have said through 2011  - my mistake.  Only two lost their tax exempt status in 2011 and there weren't any in 2012.  I've asked for the list and will post it as soon as he emails it to me.

Quoting katy_kay08:

Could you provide a list of which groups?  My search turned up one, and the reason for the removal was not filing proper documentation.  

According to a recent article/report the IRS has not be conducting investigations of religious organizations for the last three years.

Quoting Jers.:

No, but in 2011 the IRS removed tax-exempt statuses from many gay hate groups.  WBC is hate group on so many levels, so they should lose theirs too.

Quoting katy_kay08:

The tax exempt code doesn't prevent them from being involved in all political activity or even prevent them from having a political agenda.  There is still quite a bit a church can do and still maintain it's tax exemption status.  




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