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What's the deal about teachers?

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Please explain what I'm missing here. I know I'm missing something, but I just can't seem to grasp it.

I'm in WI.  We just has an overhaul of our public workers' unions, including the teachers. Teachers now have to pay a small percent for their health insurance, and a small percent for their pension.  (less than 10% for both I think it's 6% of the premiums for insurance, and 8% for pensions, but not 100% sure).  And collective bargaining has ended, meaning teachers CAN be represented by a union, however the union doesn't have much say for anything other than salary raises up to a few percent per year.

So my middle-of-the-road-friend and I were talking about another "friend", we all went to school together.  My friend mentions our other friend, who is a teacher, is looking into quitting and going into another line of work b/c of the politics, b/c so much was taken away. My middle-of-the-road friend didn't elaborate, she doesn't like politics talk.

So I come home and look up other friend, public employees salaries are all accessible online.  She makes 43k and gets 31k in benefits - so while she makes 43k, she costs us 74k.  Pension, healthcare, sick days (I think WI teachers get like 12 or something crazy like that), vacation days,  I'm not sure how all of that addes up to 31k!   As a taxpayer I think that's crazy.  She gets paid a decent amount, nothing huge, not too low.  Certainly livable and then some - plus she doesn't have to save much for retirement since that nice cushy pension will be waiting for her.   I get that teacher is a job, some teachers have it harder than others, but almost all have about 3 months off during the year.  I get that while school is in session they might work more than 40 hr/wk, but I doubt they work so much more that it averages to 40hr/wk for 50 wks. (I doubt it's 2000 hrs, like a regular job).

I just hear so many teachers complain about their job and go on and on how hard it is to be a teacher. but I can't think it's much harder than any other job. And other jobs don't have summers off, and end with a cushy pension. 

What am I missing?  They lost a little in the union stuff that happened, but they used to not pay anything for their health and pension.  Don't they see that they had a ridiculousy sweet deal before and now they have just a sweet deal.  Don't they see they were taking advantage of the tax payers and now, well they still have a good job, with good ay and awesome benefits.

I was a TA while in grad school, I got my tution for free and got paid, like 5k - that was a sweet deal for the amount of work I did (very little).  I wouldn't have fussed if they cut my pay b/c I shouldn't have made that much to begin with.


CafeMom Tickers

by on Jan. 15, 2013 at 6:23 PM
Replies (21-30):
LauraKW
by "Dude!" on Jan. 15, 2013 at 7:19 PM

 

Quoting romalove:


Quoting LauraKW:

 *noting for future reference says the white wine lover*

Quoting romalove:


Quoting LauraKW:

 Doesn't verde mean green?  You have green wine?  As I watch my child kill a virtual minecraft sheep.  Damn, loading my glass now.

Quoting romalove:


Quoting LauraKW:

 I have a large bottle of Moscato.  Is yours red or white?

Quoting romalove:


Quoting LauraKW:

 Bring cookies.

Quoting TruthSeeker.:

 

Quoting LauraKW:

 I'm just going to watch this one.

  I'll sit on your bench. I'm a little disgruntled with my daughters teacher right now, so I don't have many nice things to say about teachers.

 

I'm furious with one of my daughter's teachers right now, so I'm bringing a large bottle of wine.  I will share.

 

I have a Vino Verde.

 

Yes, it means "green wine".  It's from Portugal, and it's a lightly sparkling very crisp white wine.  A hint of sweetness as well, it's great over ice.  I love it especially in the summer but I am not picky and will drink it whenever.

 

Do you have a Trader Joe's near you?  They carry two or three different kinds all under $5 a bottle.

 Nope, but I have internet and live in a state that ships wine.  Didn't even know there were states where you couldn't ship wine until I lived in one.  Don't move to Oklahoma.  For a lot of different reasons.

romalove
by Roma on Jan. 15, 2013 at 7:20 PM


Quoting LauraKW:

 

Quoting romalove:


Quoting LauraKW:

 *noting for future reference says the white wine lover*

Quoting romalove:


Quoting LauraKW:

 Doesn't verde mean green?  You have green wine?  As I watch my child kill a virtual minecraft sheep.  Damn, loading my glass now.

Quoting romalove:


Quoting LauraKW:

 I have a large bottle of Moscato.  Is yours red or white?

Quoting romalove:


Quoting LauraKW:

 Bring cookies.

Quoting TruthSeeker.:

 

Quoting LauraKW:

 I'm just going to watch this one.

  I'll sit on your bench. I'm a little disgruntled with my daughters teacher right now, so I don't have many nice things to say about teachers.

 

I'm furious with one of my daughter's teachers right now, so I'm bringing a large bottle of wine.  I will share.

 

I have a Vino Verde.

 

Yes, it means "green wine".  It's from Portugal, and it's a lightly sparkling very crisp white wine.  A hint of sweetness as well, it's great over ice.  I love it especially in the summer but I am not picky and will drink it whenever.

 

Do you have a Trader Joe's near you?  They carry two or three different kinds all under $5 a bottle.

 Nope, but I have internet and live in a state that ships wine.  Didn't even know there were states where you couldn't ship wine until I lived in one.  Don't move to Oklahoma.  For a lot of different reasons.

LOL Oklahoma has nothing to fear from me, next move I make is someplace warm.....with palm trees.....and potential for year round pina coladas.....

lga1965
by on Jan. 15, 2013 at 7:28 PM
1 mom liked this

 

Quoting Sagely:

I'm a teacher.

I don't complain about my salary, but if anyone is offering me a raise...I'll take it.

Honestly, I wonder about those who are so bitter about what teachers make. It's not a secret. If someone really thought teaching was a "sweet deal," then why didn't they go for teaching??

Sometimes though, after having a rough day and needing to vent, not finding an ear of sympathy can contribute to burn out. Similarly, unrealistic expectations for us to produce geniuses out of jail birds with no resources can lead to burn out.

I don't judge anyone for their careers or for any efforts they might make to try to gain a higher salary or a better schedule. More power to you. I chose teaching because I wanted to. Not because I couldn't find anything else.

 I admire you and all teachers who teach because they like to teach and then you have to deal with people who think you have an easy job. You DO have to work during the summer,right? For a few weeks anyway, to prepare at the school for the upcoming year. And most states insist that you take college courses often to upgrade your certificate,right? And you take home students papers and work to grade and to prepare each evening for the next day, right? Its not an easy job. People who think so have no clue. And no matter how hard you try, there are kids who show no repect ( Usually because their parents don't respect education or teachers). And you DON'T make enough money!

I can't imagine the stress involved in dealing with arrogant and unedcuated parents. I see the disrespect in the replies from many Moms here at CM. Teachers try to teach against all odds to prepare kids for their futures. Some parents don't even think of the future. Too bad.

Some of us appreciate you!  :-) Good job!

 

lga1965
by on Jan. 15, 2013 at 7:33 PM

 

Quoting desertlvn:

1) People are always complaining about teachers. 

2)The responsibility is outrageous. It is incredibly stressful. I am TEACHING children everyday for an entire school year. I am constantly aware of how every word and action impact EVERY child in the class. 

3)Every parent loves their child. Our children are the most important things in our lives. So the "customer service" that is involved with the job is completely overpowering. We don't have enough homework, we give too much, we are too strict, we aren't strict enough, we don't help enough, we do too much hand-holding..... The negativity that parents bring into the classroom far outweighs the positives, and it is IMPOSSIBLE to please everyone.

4)The media is constantly portraying teachers in a bad light.

5) The standards constantly change. Meaning we have to revamp our resources and lessons frequently.

6) I plan every minute that I teach. Not easy.

7) Jobs have been cut every year since I have been teaching. In my city 12 entire schools in one district are closing down. Job security my ass.

Part 1- I'll come back and post part 2 soon when I have some time.

 I appreciate you. I was majoring in Education in college until I observed Student Teaching and I just KNEW I didn't have the guts to teach. SO I changed my major to Business and Finance.:-) It takes a special kind of person to teach.

Teaching is a tough job and people who don't value education or teaching can be unbelievably arrogant and unfair.

 

desertlvn
by Silver Member on Jan. 15, 2013 at 7:38 PM
5 moms liked this

Part 2-

1) I work under a microscope. I am constantly judged by others: student test scores, every grade on a paper, every word spoken, how I look and behave in public, every lesson I teach, my tone of voice, every typo, everything is watched all the time. (No subtle nose pick for me, no fixing a wedgie)

2) I am at work from 7am until 4pm. Working the entire time. This does not include lesson planning, grading papers, workshops, etc. Yet people don't believe me when I tell them how many hours I work. (Same thing for all of my "vacations")

3) It is the ultimate multi-tasking job. I am all things parent while I am trying to teach. Nose bleeds, lost teeth, splinters, hurt feelings, lost items, etc. I am constantly juggling ALL kids' needs while teaching inspiring lessons.

4) My enormous salary is frequently spent on my students: their needs, their education, and their comfort are looked after by my eyes and my money.

Part 3 to come.....

jean_marie1987
by Member on Jan. 15, 2013 at 7:42 PM
1 mom liked this
Yes, and we also have summer school.

It's even more difficult at special schools for emotionally disturbed kids, which is where I work. A plus to that is that many of the parents do appreciate us, since they did choose our school.


Quoting lga1965:

 


Quoting Sagely:

I'm a teacher.

I don't complain about my salary, but if anyone is offering me a raise...I'll take it.

Honestly, I wonder about those who are so bitter about what teachers make. It's not a secret. If someone really thought teaching was a "sweet deal," then why didn't they go for teaching??

Sometimes though, after having a rough day and needing to vent, not finding an ear of sympathy can contribute to burn out. Similarly, unrealistic expectations for us to produce geniuses out of jail birds with no resources can lead to burn out.

I don't judge anyone for their careers or for any efforts they might make to try to gain a higher salary or a better schedule. More power to you. I chose teaching because I wanted to. Not because I couldn't find anything else.

 I admire you and all teachers who teach because they like to teach and then you have to deal with people who think you have an easy job. You DO have to work during the summer,right? For a few weeks anyway, to prepare at the school for the upcoming year. And most states insist that you take college courses often to upgrade your certificate,right? And you take home students papers and work to grade and to prepare each evening for the next day, right? Its not an easy job. People who think so have no clue. And no matter how hard you try, there are kids who show no repect ( Usually because their parents don't respect education or teachers). And you DON'T make enough money!


I can't imagine the stress involved in dealing with arrogant and unedcuated parents. I see the disrespect in the replies from many Moms here at CM. Teachers try to teach against all odds to prepare kids for their futures. Some parents don't even think of the future. Too bad.


Some of us appreciate you!  :-) Good job!


 

Posted on the NEW CafeMom Mobile
turtle68
by Mahinaarangi on Jan. 15, 2013 at 7:52 PM
1 mom liked this

 IMO they dont have it as great as it should be....IMO services for the people should also have refunds for their education once they hit a 10 year active service period.

I am grateful for all teachers...I could not do that shit even if I was paid a million.

desertlvn
by Silver Member on Jan. 15, 2013 at 8:20 PM
3 moms liked this

Part 3-

1) I have to hold the attention span of children all day long. I have to be interesting enough, exciting enough, energetic enough, creative enough, and inspiring enough to keep children on task and learning. It is EXHAUSTING!

2) Not only do I have to teach well, parent well, and be interesting, I also have to manage well. I need to prevent and intervene accidents, behavior problems, interpersonal problems, and keep the class safe from themselves and each other. 

3) I often do things I do not philosophically agree with. Example: I think testing hurts kids, community, and education.

4) I am shut in a box with no one to interact with but children. I happen to have a gift for teaching and love, love, LOVE it.... but it does get grating. 

5) It is very rare to get a "good job", a "thank you SO much for everything that you do", a "my daughter LOVED that lesson you did yesterday.... 

6) I am expected to powerful enough to overcome children's life hardships. Poverty, abuse, family deaths, CPS involved, learning disabilities, bad attitudes, family negativity towards education, phobias, physical handicaps, in-utero damage, parental mental illness, child mental illness, etc. Difficult and exhausting beyong belief.

I could go on. But I'm probably boring you. My point is, this job is WAY harder than people can imagine. It almost seems pointless to try to prove it, since there is such a big culture of disrespect toward teachers this day and age.

JakeandEmmasMom
by Platinum Member on Jan. 15, 2013 at 8:27 PM
Bless you and thank you for all that you do.

Quoting desertlvn:

Part 3-

1) I have to hold the attention span of children all day long. I have to be interesting enough, exciting enough, energetic enough, creative enough, and inspiring enough to keep children on task and learning. It is EXHAUSTING!

2) Not only do I have to teach well, parent well, and be interesting, I also have to manage well. I need to prevent and intervene accidents, behavior problems, interpersonal problems, and keep the class safe from themselves and each other. 

3) I often do things I do not philosophically agree with. Example: I think testing hurts kids, community, and education.

4) I am shut in a box with no one to interact with but children. I happen to have a gift for teaching and love, love, LOVE it.... but it does get grating. 

5) It is very rare to get a "good job", a "thank you SO much for everything that you do", a "my daughter LOVED that lesson you did yesterday.... 

6) I am expected to powerful enough to overcome children's life hardships. Poverty, abuse, family deaths, CPS involved, learning disabilities, bad attitudes, family negativity towards education, phobias, physical handicaps, in-utero damage, parental mental illness, child mental illness, etc. Difficult and exhausting beyong belief.

I could go on. But I'm probably boring you. My point is, this job is WAY harder than people can imagine. It almost seems pointless to try to prove it, since there is such a big culture of disrespect toward teachers this day and age.

Posted on CafeMom Mobile
JCB911
by Bronze Member on Jan. 15, 2013 at 8:28 PM

I'm impressed by the number of replies in just a short time.

I don't think teachers have an easy job, but I also don't think it's the hardest job out there.  I wouldn't want to be a teacher - I like my kids and a few of my friends' kids but mostly I find other kids annoying (I'm honest).  I think 43k in salary a year is decent, I'd say pay could be a bit more.  I'd think for her having worked there about 4-5 years I'd think 50k.  But THIRTY THOUSAND for benefits - how is that possible.  I'd think 10k, maybe.  I think pensions are ridiculous, and shoudl have been done away with by now. 

Kids educaiton is important but that doesn't mean it needs to cost what it does.  I attended the school board meeting this past summer - 14k per student is what the district gets.  How in the world do they make it cost that much.  Figure a class of 20 is costing the taxpayers a quarter of a million dollars - for what?  So 25% can drop out. We have a really expensive private school that costs 12-13k,  and it's an AMAZING school. Amazing!. Our public schools, get more, and do WAY less.

We homeschool, (for lots of reasons).  This is our first year doing it. I think it'll be tough to teach when I have both kids doing school b/c I'm teaching two different kids on two very different levels.  Teachers are at least teaching the same material, not all in the grade are at the same level.  And after the first few years, don't most teachers re-use their lesson plans from the previous year (My honest teacher friends admit to it). So while the first couple years can be a LOT of work, after that it's not that bad (heard from others, and makes sense).

I don't see a teacher being compensatied 75k, as reasonable, certainly not one with just a few years in.  50-60k maybe.  For 75k, maybe i'll start tolerating other people's kids more.

I just like to dream what I could do with 14k per student. I'll have 2 (maybe 3) students. 

Also wish kids/parents just had more options than public,private, homeschool - but I suppose most parents just want to be rid of their kids for the day, or need to be.

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