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We did the math: how the GOP will gerrymander [Rig] its way back to the White House

We did the math: how the GOP will gerrymander its way back to the White House


Still reeling from their second straight presidential loss to Barack Obama, Republicans are working to make drastic changes to how electoral college votes are allocated in key swing states.

Republicans in states like Michigan, Pennsylvania, and Virginia have all proposed scrapping the “winner take all” electoral vote system in favor of plans that would reward the GOP’s recent gerrymandering. The six states considering the varied plans are all swing states that have gone for Barack Obama twice now, and others have been hard fought but ultimately gone blue for even longer.

The plans vary. In Pennsylvania, lawmakers want to siphon off a handful of electoral votes for the runner-up candidate–which has been the Republican since 1992. In other states, the proposal calls for the overall winner of the popular vote to get two votes, while the rest of the votes are distributed by congressional district. That plan is already in place in Maine and Nebraska.

What does that look like when implemented in these swing states? Here’s how it would’ve played out in the 2012 election in a handful of states controlled by Republicans.

In Florida, where Romney lost by only 1%, Obama would have lost even bigger: Romney would have picked up more than half the state’s electoral votes.

FLORIDA RIGGED

In Ohio, where Obama eked out a 2% lead, Romney would have won two-thirds of the state’s votes.

OHIO RIGGED

In Wisconsin, Romney would have won half the state’s votes, despite losing the overall vote by 7%.

WISCONSIN RIGGED

And Romney would no longer have lost his home state of Michigan, even though he lost the popular vote there by 9%. Instead, he’d have picked up nine electoral votes.

MICHIGAN RIGGED

Pennsylvania’s plan, which allocates votes based on the overall percentage, gives Romney his smallest advantage, with only eight extra electoral votes. That’s still a nice bonus for a guy who lost the state by 5% and therefore lost all 20 electoral votes.

PENNSYLVANIA RIGGED

The plan advanced this week by a Virginia Senate subcommittee is even more lopsided, allocating the two extra votes not to the popular vote winner, but to the winner of the most congressional districts. The result? Romney picks up 9 of the state’s electoral votes, despite losing the state’s popular vote by 3%.

VIRGINIA RIGGED

If the plans currently on the table were implemented in these six states alone, Romney picks up another 60 electoral votes, bringing his total to 266 nationwide, making the race much closer but not ultimately taking the victory away from Barack Obama.

An analysis by Alan Abramowitz for the University of Virginia’s Center for Politics found that if a Maine—or Nebraska—style system had been in place nationwide for the 2012 election, Mitt Romney would have defeated Barack Obama, 276 electoral votes to 262 electoral votes, despite losing the popular vote by 4%. If the plan being pushed in Virginia became the law of the land nationwide, that difference would be even more stark.

This new plan reflects the fact that in all these states, Republicans are in control of the state house and have been since 2010. The successful pro-Republican gerrymandering that took place that year didn’t just protect the Republican control of the House of Representatives, but also laid the groundwork for taking back the presidency. If these plans, which are by most accounts legal (although they could be challenged in court), were to become law, it would be difficult for Democrats to win the presidency in 2016, even if they win by millions of votes.

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If they enforced bank regulations like they do park rules, we wouldn't be in this mess

by on Jan. 25, 2013 at 8:46 PM
Replies (41-50):
glitterteaz
by Ruby Member on Jan. 26, 2013 at 11:34 AM

you do realize in that "red" area that there is not as many people? Even though you are seeing red the popular vote was still blue. Meaning that the majority of that state voted for the blue. Those living out in fields voted red but there was fewer votes making it that way.

Quoting Imacakebaker:

Did you see all of the states in your example were RED?

Where was the people's voice in the RED areas?   It is a great example why we should split the ec votes.

Quoting brookiecookie87:

You think it's fair that the popular vote can be for Candidate X in a state but Candidate Y can win thanks to Gerrymandering? You think it is fair that the majority of a country can vote for Candidate X but thanks to Gerrymandering and the Electoral College a group can give the Presidency to who they want to win?

How exactly is that fair? Or by fair do you mean, "They didn't have the popular vote but this way they can still win"?

Quoting Imacakebaker:

I think its fair.  Did you notice all of those states were red.





timeforprogress
by Silver Member on Jan. 26, 2013 at 11:58 AM
Do you really think rural voters should have their votes carry more weight simply because the is more space between them and their neighbors?



The President won the popular vote in three states in question. That indicates that the states are not red. Ritual votes just tend to be Republican while urban populations trend to be more liberal.


Quoting Imacakebaker:

Did you see all of the states in your example were RED?

Where was the people's voice in the RED areas?   It is a great example why we should split the ec votes.

Quoting brookiecookie87:

You think it's fair that the popular vote can be for Candidate X in a state but Candidate Y can win thanks to Gerrymandering? You think it is fair that the majority of a country can vote for Candidate X but thanks to Gerrymandering and the Electoral College a group can give the Presidency to who they want to win?

How exactly is that fair? Or by fair do you mean, "They didn't have the popular vote but this way they can still win"?



Quoting Imacakebaker:

I think its fair.  Did you notice all of those states were red.






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Naturewoman4
by Platinum Member on Jan. 26, 2013 at 12:04 PM

I will go as far as to blame Bush.  He shouldn't of gotten us in the Iraq war.  He KNEW that the Real Estate crash was coming, yet did nothing.  Remember, I am neither a Dem. or Rep.  I vote for whomever I feel would best help this Country.  Obama wasn't that choice.  But, America spoke &  now we are stuck with him.  I believe the figures are 51% approval rating for Obama during the Elections.  To me, that is so pitiful & sad for a incumbent President.  It says about 1/2 of Americans didn't want Obama in there.  That's says A LOT.  

Anyway, it is what it is.  Thank God that after 4 yrs. Obama will be gone!!  Just hopefully Americans don't vote Biden in.  What a joke that would be.  But, IF another Dem. got in & followed what Obama did to win.  Well this Country will continue to be doomed.  Because, what is scary is if the next Dem. running for Pres., will follow in Obama's path.  Not caring about America, but just giving what 1/2 of Americans want.  That's "Freebies".  I truthfully don't care anymore.  Obama was voted in (I thought) to help this Country.  Imo he has done the opposite.  I believe the movie, Obama's 2016.  His plan for America, is to make us even with the rest of the World.  Therefore, destroying the Middle Class. 

 


Quoting brookiecookie87:

I never seen anyone so blinded by their bias that they would throw away any resemblance of a democracy their country has so their party will win.

Actually I am wrong. You are showing the thinking that the GOP members have. They will gladly gerrymander their parties way into Office. And if it was up to them (and you apparently) they would gladly destroy the democracy we have so they can win despite who the country actually votes for.

Because with the new system democracy would be gone. The popular vote would in no way determine who is President. It doesn't now but at least it is pretty darn close.

And I hate to break it to you. But our country has been screwed for awhile. Do you remember when Bush was leaving Office? (I am not blaming Bush either. It's a fundamental problem we are having with Capitalism).

Right now all the money is held at the very tip top of our country. The middle class is disappearing and that is the problem.

Capitalism needs a strong, big, middle class to function smoothly and properly (You could almost think of the middle class as the lubrication that keeps the system moving). The middle class should be able to split a little off for poverty and a few for wealth. But the middle class is so non-existent that 250k is considered middle class and that is in the top 3% of our country. It's backwards.

It doesn't matter who is in Office this system will persist.


Quoting Naturewoman4:

At this point, I sure hope they win anyway they can.  If not, the Dems. are going to totally destroy this Country.  But, then again, they already have.  Good news though, I only have to put up with Obama just for another 4 yrs.  That it's over FINALLY!  Hopefully, Biden won't run & won't win.  Otherwise, it's like having another Obama.  Either way it doesn't matter anymore, because this Country is screwed! 

 

 


 

brookiecookie87
by Platinum Member on Jan. 26, 2013 at 12:09 PM
1 mom liked this

If you are willing to blame Democrats and blame Republicans-You should be on my side of blaming both sides.

Both sides Gerrymander. The GOP are proposing this because it favors them. Democrats have proposed something similar in the past when it would favor them.

Both sides are responsible for the problems we are facing. Democrats didn't bring it this way on their own and neither did Republicans. And one side won't be able to fix it on their own either.

The picture below perfectly describes anyone who shouts, "Republicans would do better!" or "Democrats will fix what the republicans did!". Both sides are heavily influenced by money. Both sides will gladly undermine democracy if it means gains for their party.

Blaming Obama, or Bush won't solve anything. We need to focus on fixing the system. Otherwise we are driving on the freeway with 4 flat tires with half the people blaming the front tires and half the people blaming the back tires for the inevitable crash.

Quoting Naturewoman4:

I will go as far as to blame Bush.  He shouldn't of gotten us in the Iraq war.  He KNEW that the Real Estate crash was coming, yet did nothing.  Remember, I am neither a Dem. or Rep.  I vote for whomever I feel would best help this Country.  Obama wasn't that choice.  But, America spoke &  now we are stuck with him.  I believe the figures are 51% approval rating for Obama during the Elections.  To me, that is so pitiful & sad for a incumbent President.  It says about 1/2 of Americans didn't want Obama in there.  That's says A LOT.  

Anyway, it is what it is.  Thank God that after 4 yrs. Obama will be gone!!  Just hopefully Americans don't vote Biden in.  What a joke that would be.  But, IF another Dem. got in & followed what Obama did to win.  Well this Country will continue to be doomed.  Because, what is scary is if the next Dem. running for Pres., will follow in Obama's path.  Not caring about America, but just giving what 1/2 of Americans want.  That's "Freebies".  I truthfully don't care anymore.  Obama was voted in (I thought) to help this Country.  Imo he has done the opposite.  I believe the movie, Obama's 2016.  His plan for America, is to make us even with the rest of the World.  Therefore, destroying the Middle Class. 

 


Quoting brookiecookie87:

I never seen anyone so blinded by their bias that they would throw away any resemblance of a democracy their country has so their party will win.

Actually I am wrong. You are showing the thinking that the GOP members have. They will gladly gerrymander their parties way into Office. And if it was up to them (and you apparently) they would gladly destroy the democracy we have so they can win despite who the country actually votes for.

Because with the new system democracy would be gone. The popular vote would in no way determine who is President. It doesn't now but at least it is pretty darn close.

And I hate to break it to you. But our country has been screwed for awhile. Do you remember when Bush was leaving Office? (I am not blaming Bush either. It's a fundamental problem we are having with Capitalism).

Right now all the money is held at the very tip top of our country. The middle class is disappearing and that is the problem.

Capitalism needs a strong, big, middle class to function smoothly and properly (You could almost think of the middle class as the lubrication that keeps the system moving). The middle class should be able to split a little off for poverty and a few for wealth. But the middle class is so non-existent that 250k is considered middle class and that is in the top 3% of our country. It's backwards.

It doesn't matter who is in Office this system will persist.


Quoting Naturewoman4:

At this point, I sure hope they win anyway they can.  If not, the Dems. are going to totally destroy this Country.  But, then again, they already have.  Good news though, I only have to put up with Obama just for another 4 yrs.  That it's over FINALLY!  Hopefully, Biden won't run & won't win.  Otherwise, it's like having another Obama.  Either way it doesn't matter anymore, because this Country is screwed! 







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The Ninety-Nine Percent Moms   

If they enforced bank regulations like they do park rules, we wouldn't be in this mess

Naturewoman4
by Platinum Member on Jan. 26, 2013 at 12:13 PM

The only reason why I say this, is because the majority of voters voted Obama in for those "freebies".  They don't care about what happens to America.  As long as the check keeps coming in.  I live in Calif. a large pop. of Hispanics.  With the huge number of Electoral Votes Calif. gets, & the large numbers of people here that just want those 'freebies', the Calif. also have the largest number of illegals.  Which I'm sure a lot of them have 'legal' Hispanics here. 

 Illegals here get benefits.  Costing us millions of dollars in tax money.  Do people here care?  Nope.  I'm just glad that Obama is not a dictator.  Although, I'm sure he & 1/2 of this Country wishes he was.  I really don't want a Dem. or Rep. to be in the White House.  I'd like to see a 3rd party.  But, for now & god knows how many yrs. to come.  Americans want those 'freebies'.  A lot don't want to work for them.  Our Country has become a laughing stock to the World.   


Quoting trippyhippy:

So you are fine with cheating a large percentage of the population out of their vote as long as it makes your guy win? So you only care about democracy, the constitution and rights if it makes things go your way? Good to know. This discredits almost every argument you have ever made or will ever make on this site. Quite the patriot aren't you?


Quoting Naturewoman4:

At this point, I sure hope they win anyway they can.  If not, the Dems. are going to totally destroy this Country.  But, then again, they already have.  Good news though, I only have to put up with Obama just for another 4 yrs.  That it's over FINALLY!  Hopefully, Biden won't run & won't win.  Otherwise, it's like having another Obama.  Either way it doesn't matter anymore, because this Country is screwed! 



 

Naturewoman4
by Platinum Member on Jan. 26, 2013 at 12:25 PM

I do blame both sides & I don't trust either side.  But, the point is, that Obama had 4 yrs. he has made it much worse.  He didn't fix anything imo.  He doesn't know how to create jobs or help businesses to succeed.  He hurts the same business.  He doesn't help get our jobs back to the U.S.  I honestly & sincerely don't believe he even cares about America.  The ONLY reason why he won re-election is because of the 'freebies' he hands out.

  I'm not saying that Reps. aren't corrupt either, just this Election I believe that Romney or any of the other GOP's would of helped this Country way more than Obama.  I believe Romney would of been the best for the job, with the Economy & Jobs.  Something that I thought  was the No. 1 priority to Americans.  Guess not.  Obama will have now 8 yrs., & I would bet everything I have, that he still will not help this Country.  Americans still won't be back to work.  Our debt will continue to go over the cliff.  Our crime will get worse & worse.  We haven't seen anything yet.  Sad


Quoting brookiecookie87:

If you are willing to blame Democrats and blame Republicans-You should be on my side of blaming both sides.

Both sides Gerrymander. The GOP are proposing this because it favors them. Democrats have proposed something similar in the past when it would favor them.

Both sides are responsible for the problems we are facing. Democrats didn't bring it this way on their own and neither did Republicans. And one side won't be able to fix it on their own either.

The picture below perfectly describes anyone who shouts, "Republicans would do better!" or "Democrats will fix what the republicans did!". Both sides are heavily influenced by money. Both sides will gladly undermine democracy if it means gains for their party.

Blaming Obama, or Bush won't solve anything. We need to focus on fixing the system. Otherwise we are driving on the freeway with 4 flat tires with half the people blaming the front tires and half the people blaming the back tires for the inevitable crash.

Quoting Naturewoman4:

I will go as far as to blame Bush.  He shouldn't of gotten us in the Iraq war.  He KNEW that the Real Estate crash was coming, yet did nothing.  Remember, I am neither a Dem. or Rep.  I vote for whomever I feel would best help this Country.  Obama wasn't that choice.  But, America spoke &  now we are stuck with him.  I believe the figures are 51% approval rating for Obama during the Elections.  To me, that is so pitiful & sad for a incumbent President.  It says about 1/2 of Americans didn't want Obama in there.  That's says A LOT.  

Anyway, it is what it is.  Thank God that after 4 yrs. Obama will be gone!!  Just hopefully Americans don't vote Biden in.  What a joke that would be.  But, IF another Dem. got in & followed what Obama did to win.  Well this Country will continue to be doomed.  Because, what is scary is if the next Dem. running for Pres., will follow in Obama's path.  Not caring about America, but just giving what 1/2 of Americans want.  That's "Freebies".  I truthfully don't care anymore.  Obama was voted in (I thought) to help this Country.  Imo he has done the opposite.  I believe the movie, Obama's 2016.  His plan for America, is to make us even with the rest of the World.  Therefore, destroying the Middle Class. 

 

 

Quoting brookiecookie87:

I never seen anyone so blinded by their bias that they would throw away any resemblance of a democracy their country has so their party will win.

Actually I am wrong. You are showing the thinking that the GOP members have. They will gladly gerrymander their parties way into Office. And if it was up to them (and you apparently) they would gladly destroy the democracy we have so they can win despite who the country actually votes for.

Because with the new system democracy would be gone. The popular vote would in no way determine who is President. It doesn't now but at least it is pretty darn close.

And I hate to break it to you. But our country has been screwed for awhile. Do you remember when Bush was leaving Office? (I am not blaming Bush either. It's a fundamental problem we are having with Capitalism).

Right now all the money is held at the very tip top of our country. The middle class is disappearing and that is the problem.

Capitalism needs a strong, big, middle class to function smoothly and properly (You could almost think of the middle class as the lubrication that keeps the system moving). The middle class should be able to split a little off for poverty and a few for wealth. But the middle class is so non-existent that 250k is considered middle class and that is in the top 3% of our country. It's backwards.

It doesn't matter who is in Office this system will persist.


Quoting Naturewoman4:

At this point, I sure hope they win anyway they can.  If not, the Dems. are going to totally destroy this Country.  But, then again, they already have.  Good news though, I only have to put up with Obama just for another 4 yrs.  That it's over FINALLY!  Hopefully, Biden won't run & won't win.  Otherwise, it's like having another Obama.  Either way it doesn't matter anymore, because this Country is screwed! 

 

 

 

 

 

 


 

brookiecookie87
by Platinum Member on Jan. 26, 2013 at 12:25 PM
3 moms liked this

Then I can confident tell you that you are wrong about why people voted for President Obama.

I have a lot of Democrat friends and a lot of liberal friends. None of them voted for President Obama for "freebies".

I know lots of people who voted for President Obama because they felt that Mitt Romney was out of touch with the majority of America and only out for the top 1%.

I know lots of people who voted for President Obama because Mitt Romney made a lot of claims but out right refused to clarify/explain claims or how they would work.

I know lots of people who voted for President Obama because Mitt Romney seemed completely okay with lying during his campaign and making a lie part of his campaign (The You didn't Build it speech and the Jeep moving American Jobs to China).

I know lots of people who voted for President Obama because they felt Mitt Romney would continue to encourage the Republican behavior and limiting the rights of Women.

I know lots of people who voted for President Obama because they felt he was the better choice.

I know lots of people who voted for President Obama because he wasn't Mitt Romney.

I am actually pretty positive that if the GOP pushed out someone besides Mitt Romney they would have had a pretty high chance of winning.

But I don't know anyone that voted for President Obama because of, "Freeibies". This is something Republicans/Conservatives say to explain why they lost.



Quoting Naturewoman4:

The only reason why I say this, is because the majority of voters voted Obama in for those "freebies".  They don't care about what happens to America.  As long as the check keeps coming in.  I live in Calif. a large pop. of Hispanics.  With the huge number of Electoral Votes Calif. gets, & the large numbers of people here that just want those 'freebies', the Calif. also have the largest number of illegals.  Which I'm sure a lot of them have 'legal' Hispanics here. 

 Illegals here get benefits.  Costing us millions of dollars in tax money.  Do people here care?  Nope.  I'm just glad that Obama is not a dictator.  Although, I'm sure he & 1/2 of this Country wishes he was.  I really don't want a Dem. or Rep. to be in the White House.  I'd like to see a 3rd party.  But, for now & god knows how many yrs. to come.  Americans want those 'freebies'.  A lot don't want to work for them.  Our Country has become a laughing stock to the World.   


Quoting trippyhippy:

So you are fine with cheating a large percentage of the population out of their vote as long as it makes your guy win? So you only care about democracy, the constitution and rights if it makes things go your way? Good to know. This discredits almost every argument you have ever made or will ever make on this site. Quite the patriot aren't you?


Quoting Naturewoman4:

At this point, I sure hope they win anyway they can.  If not, the Dems. are going to totally destroy this Country.  But, then again, they already have.  Good news though, I only have to put up with Obama just for another 4 yrs.  That it's over FINALLY!  Hopefully, Biden won't run & won't win.  Otherwise, it's like having another Obama.  Either way it doesn't matter anymore, because this Country is screwed! 






Join us on the 99% Moms group!
The Ninety-Nine Percent Moms   

If they enforced bank regulations like they do park rules, we wouldn't be in this mess

brookiecookie87
by Platinum Member on Jan. 26, 2013 at 12:31 PM




Then I believe you are living in denial.

I agree he didn't make things the best ever. Or even better they were before the downward spiral. But surely you can see how the spiral was going down and how he stopped it and then reversed it.

And opposite President Obama you had someone who pioneered sending jobs over seas. Mitt Romney is on record PRAISING a Chinese workshop. Even going as far as saying that the gates and guards were to keep people from sneaking in and working.

Which always leads me to remark if he wonders if the suicide nets are to stop dead people from flinging their corpses back up to life.

The GOP would not have solved the problem. You are just stuck in the mindset of the picture I posted.



Both Democrats and Republicans want to look good in the eyes of the country. They will both do their best to fix problems. However, they are both extremely heavily influenced by those in power and those with money.

So when it comes to jobs, and banks-Democrats and Republicans will do the same thing.

Quoting Naturewoman4:

I do blame both sides & I don't trust either side.  But, the point is, that Obama had 4 yrs. he has made it much worse.  He didn't fix anything imo.  He doesn't know how to create jobs or help businesses to succeed.  He hurts the same business.  He doesn't help get our jobs back to the U.S.  I honestly & sincerely don't believe he even cares about America.  The ONLY reason why he won re-election is because of the 'freebies' he hands out.

  I'm not saying that Reps. aren't corrupt either, just this Election I believe that Romney or any of the other GOP's would of helped this Country way more than Obama.  I believe Romney would of been the best for the job, with the Economy & Jobs.  Something that I thought  was the No. 1 priority to Americans.  Guess not.  Obama will have now 8 yrs., & I would bet everything I have, that he still will not help this Country.  Americans still won't be back to work.  Our debt will continue to go over the cliff.  Our crime will get worse & worse.  We haven't seen anything yet.  Sad


Quoting brookiecookie87:

If you are willing to blame Democrats and blame Republicans-You should be on my side of blaming both sides.

Both sides Gerrymander. The GOP are proposing this because it favors them. Democrats have proposed something similar in the past when it would favor them.

Both sides are responsible for the problems we are facing. Democrats didn't bring it this way on their own and neither did Republicans. And one side won't be able to fix it on their own either.

The picture below perfectly describes anyone who shouts, "Republicans would do better!" or "Democrats will fix what the republicans did!". Both sides are heavily influenced by money. Both sides will gladly undermine democracy if it means gains for their party.

Blaming Obama, or Bush won't solve anything. We need to focus on fixing the system. Otherwise we are driving on the freeway with 4 flat tires with half the people blaming the front tires and half the people blaming the back tires for the inevitable crash.

Quoting Naturewoman4:

I will go as far as to blame Bush.  He shouldn't of gotten us in the Iraq war.  He KNEW that the Real Estate crash was coming, yet did nothing.  Remember, I am neither a Dem. or Rep.  I vote for whomever I feel would best help this Country.  Obama wasn't that choice.  But, America spoke &  now we are stuck with him.  I believe the figures are 51% approval rating for Obama during the Elections.  To me, that is so pitiful & sad for a incumbent President.  It says about 1/2 of Americans didn't want Obama in there.  That's says A LOT.  

Anyway, it is what it is.  Thank God that after 4 yrs. Obama will be gone!!  Just hopefully Americans don't vote Biden in.  What a joke that would be.  But, IF another Dem. got in & followed what Obama did to win.  Well this Country will continue to be doomed.  Because, what is scary is if the next Dem. running for Pres., will follow in Obama's path.  Not caring about America, but just giving what 1/2 of Americans want.  That's "Freebies".  I truthfully don't care anymore.  Obama was voted in (I thought) to help this Country.  Imo he has done the opposite.  I believe the movie, Obama's 2016.  His plan for America, is to make us even with the rest of the World.  Therefore, destroying the Middle Class. 

 


Quoting brookiecookie87:

I never seen anyone so blinded by their bias that they would throw away any resemblance of a democracy their country has so their party will win.

Actually I am wrong. You are showing the thinking that the GOP members have. They will gladly gerrymander their parties way into Office. And if it was up to them (and you apparently) they would gladly destroy the democracy we have so they can win despite who the country actually votes for.

Because with the new system democracy would be gone. The popular vote would in no way determine who is President. It doesn't now but at least it is pretty darn close.

And I hate to break it to you. But our country has been screwed for awhile. Do you remember when Bush was leaving Office? (I am not blaming Bush either. It's a fundamental problem we are having with Capitalism).

Right now all the money is held at the very tip top of our country. The middle class is disappearing and that is the problem.

Capitalism needs a strong, big, middle class to function smoothly and properly (You could almost think of the middle class as the lubrication that keeps the system moving). The middle class should be able to split a little off for poverty and a few for wealth. But the middle class is so non-existent that 250k is considered middle class and that is in the top 3% of our country. It's backwards.

It doesn't matter who is in Office this system will persist.


Quoting Naturewoman4:

At this point, I sure hope they win anyway they can.  If not, the Dems. are going to totally destroy this Country.  But, then again, they already have.  Good news though, I only have to put up with Obama just for another 4 yrs.  That it's over FINALLY!  Hopefully, Biden won't run & won't win.  Otherwise, it's like having another Obama.  Either way it doesn't matter anymore, because this Country is screwed! 











Join us on the 99% Moms group!
The Ninety-Nine Percent Moms   

If they enforced bank regulations like they do park rules, we wouldn't be in this mess

Naturewoman4
by Platinum Member on Jan. 26, 2013 at 12:44 PM

You certainly do have the right to your opinion.  Even though I completely disagree.  There's how many of people on unemployment, PA, Soc. Sec. Disability...Millions...I believe those 'Millions' don't want to lose those 'freebies'.  Therefore voting for Obama.  That's great you have friends that aren't on PA & voted for Obama for other reasons. 

 I don't get those reasons, but at least it wasn't because of those 'freebies'.  But, Brooke, I would safely say that about 1/2 of Americans, DO believe Obama won because of those 'freebies'.  That is just facts, not just MY opinion Brooke.   


Quoting brookiecookie87:

Then I can confident tell you that you are wrong about why people voted for President Obama.

I have a lot of Democrat friends and a lot of liberal friends. None of them voted for President Obama for "freebies".

I know lots of people who voted for President Obama because they felt that Mitt Romney was out of touch with the majority of America and only out for the top 1%.

I know lots of people who voted for President Obama because Mitt Romney made a lot of claims but out right refused to clarify/explain claims or how they would work.

I know lots of people who voted for President Obama because Mitt Romney seemed completely okay with lying during his campaign and making a lie part of his campaign (The You didn't Build it speech and the Jeep moving American Jobs to China).

I know lots of people who voted for President Obama because they felt Mitt Romney would continue to encourage the Republican behavior and limiting the rights of Women.

I know lots of people who voted for President Obama because they felt he was the better choice.

I know lots of people who voted for President Obama because he wasn't Mitt Romney.

I am actually pretty positive that if the GOP pushed out someone besides Mitt Romney they would have had a pretty high chance of winning.

But I don't know anyone that voted for President Obama because of, "Freeibies". This is something Republicans/Conservatives say to explain why they lost.


 

Quoting Naturewoman4:

The only reason why I say this, is because the majority of voters voted Obama in for those "freebies".  They don't care about what happens to America.  As long as the check keeps coming in.  I live in Calif. a large pop. of Hispanics.  With the huge number of Electoral Votes Calif. gets, & the large numbers of people here that just want those 'freebies', the Calif. also have the largest number of illegals.  Which I'm sure a lot of them have 'legal' Hispanics here. 

 Illegals here get benefits.  Costing us millions of dollars in tax money.  Do people here care?  Nope.  I'm just glad that Obama is not a dictator.  Although, I'm sure he & 1/2 of this Country wishes he was.  I really don't want a Dem. or Rep. to be in the White House.  I'd like to see a 3rd party.  But, for now & god knows how many yrs. to come.  Americans want those 'freebies'.  A lot don't want to work for them.  Our Country has become a laughing stock to the World.   

 

Quoting trippyhippy:

So you are fine with cheating a large percentage of the population out of their vote as long as it makes your guy win? So you only care about democracy, the constitution and rights if it makes things go your way? Good to know. This discredits almost every argument you have ever made or will ever make on this site. Quite the patriot aren't you?


Quoting Naturewoman4:

At this point, I sure hope they win anyway they can.  If not, the Dems. are going to totally destroy this Country.  But, then again, they already have.  Good news though, I only have to put up with Obama just for another 4 yrs.  That it's over FINALLY!  Hopefully, Biden won't run & won't win.  Otherwise, it's like having another Obama.  Either way it doesn't matter anymore, because this Country is screwed! 


 

 

 

 


 

brookiecookie87
by Platinum Member on Jan. 26, 2013 at 12:53 PM

It's not a matter of opinion though. You are wrong.

There are millions on unemployment, PA, Soc. Sec., Disability-Millions. I agree with this. But they are not all Democrats. They are not all liberals. They did not all vote for President Obama. Lots of people in those groups are Republicans, or Conservatives and even though they par take in these "freebies" they still voted for Mitt Romney because he represents their parties.

I imagine the only people that really believe that are the Republicans and since they make up nearly half the country that makes sense. But just because millions of people are wrong doesn't make what they believe right.

If you were right (Or if they were right) President Obama would have won by a MUCH higher number because that means lots of Republicans/Conservatives should have voted for President Obama.

But that didn't happen. It's just something Republicans/Conservatives say to explain why they lost. Because saying, "We lost because our candidate was out of touched, we were too extremely, and we pandered to the most extreme, then the less extreme and then the middle and no one really know where our candidate stood" is a bit long and makes them look bad. Blaming the opposite side is easier and doesn't make them look bad.


Quoting Naturewoman4:

You certainly do have the right to your opinion.  Even though I completely disagree.  There's how many of people on unemployment, PA, Soc. Sec. Disability...Millions...I believe those 'Millions' don't want to lose those 'freebies'.  Therefore voting for Obama.  That's great you have friends that aren't on PA & voted for Obama for other reasons. 

 I don't get those reasons, but at least it wasn't because of those 'freebies'.  But, Brooke, I would safely say that about 1/2 of Americans, DO believe Obama won because of those 'freebies'.  That is just facts, not just MY opinion Brooke.   


Quoting brookiecookie87:

Then I can confident tell you that you are wrong about why people voted for President Obama.

I have a lot of Democrat friends and a lot of liberal friends. None of them voted for President Obama for "freebies".

I know lots of people who voted for President Obama because they felt that Mitt Romney was out of touch with the majority of America and only out for the top 1%.

I know lots of people who voted for President Obama because Mitt Romney made a lot of claims but out right refused to clarify/explain claims or how they would work.

I know lots of people who voted for President Obama because Mitt Romney seemed completely okay with lying during his campaign and making a lie part of his campaign (The You didn't Build it speech and the Jeep moving American Jobs to China).

I know lots of people who voted for President Obama because they felt Mitt Romney would continue to encourage the Republican behavior and limiting the rights of Women.

I know lots of people who voted for President Obama because they felt he was the better choice.

I know lots of people who voted for President Obama because he wasn't Mitt Romney.

I am actually pretty positive that if the GOP pushed out someone besides Mitt Romney they would have had a pretty high chance of winning.

But I don't know anyone that voted for President Obama because of, "Freeibies". This is something Republicans/Conservatives say to explain why they lost.



Quoting Naturewoman4:

The only reason why I say this, is because the majority of voters voted Obama in for those "freebies".  They don't care about what happens to America.  As long as the check keeps coming in.  I live in Calif. a large pop. of Hispanics.  With the huge number of Electoral Votes Calif. gets, & the large numbers of people here that just want those 'freebies', the Calif. also have the largest number of illegals.  Which I'm sure a lot of them have 'legal' Hispanics here. 

 Illegals here get benefits.  Costing us millions of dollars in tax money.  Do people here care?  Nope.  I'm just glad that Obama is not a dictator.  Although, I'm sure he & 1/2 of this Country wishes he was.  I really don't want a Dem. or Rep. to be in the White House.  I'd like to see a 3rd party.  But, for now & god knows how many yrs. to come.  Americans want those 'freebies'.  A lot don't want to work for them.  Our Country has become a laughing stock to the World.   


Quoting trippyhippy:

So you are fine with cheating a large percentage of the population out of their vote as long as it makes your guy win? So you only care about democracy, the constitution and rights if it makes things go your way? Good to know. This discredits almost every argument you have ever made or will ever make on this site. Quite the patriot aren't you?


Quoting Naturewoman4:

At this point, I sure hope they win anyway they can.  If not, the Dems. are going to totally destroy this Country.  But, then again, they already have.  Good news though, I only have to put up with Obama just for another 4 yrs.  That it's over FINALLY!  Hopefully, Biden won't run & won't win.  Otherwise, it's like having another Obama.  Either way it doesn't matter anymore, because this Country is screwed! 










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