Join the Meeting Place for Moms!
Talk to other moms, share advice, and have fun!

(minimum 6 characters)

Current Events & Hot Topics Current Events & Hot Topics

 

Poll

Question: Should welfare recipients be banned from putting money in the collection plate at church?

Options:

Yes

No

Other


Only group members can vote in this poll.

Total Votes: 96

View Results

 All of these posts about banning welfare recipients from spending money on X, Y, Z got me thinking.  Should welfare recipients be banned from putting money in the collection plate at church?  After all, if they can't afford to support themselves, should they really be taking the money from the government just to give some away?

Whether or not it could be enforced isn't the point.  This is a philosophical question.

by on Jan. 28, 2013 at 10:59 AM
Replies (41-50):
wickedfiress
by Kellie on Jan. 30, 2013 at 3:14 AM
My help doesn't come with specific instructions. Here's your money, I hope you use it wisely.
Posted on the NEW CafeMom Mobile
mmtosam06
by Bronze Member on Jan. 30, 2013 at 5:00 AM
Ill come back to this later
Posted on the NEW CafeMom Mobile
acrogodess
by Silver Member on Jan. 30, 2013 at 5:05 AM
The catholic churches I attended growing up certainly did so. The first collection was for the church and the second collection was supposed to be for charity work.

Quoting jean_marie1987:

You should read my reply to a PP...



It's sad that monetary tithing is so "important" in church. Some churches even collect twice (or more) in one service.




Quoting stormcris:

This made me laugh. I can say in certain churches the amount of your righteousness seems to be based entirely on where or not you tithe and how much. They would feel this sort of ban to be an attack on Christianity.

Posted on CafeMom Mobile
toomanypoodles
by Ruby Member on Jan. 30, 2013 at 6:04 AM

 

Why Tithe?

Tithing reflects a grateful heart that wants to give back to God a portion of what He has given us; in reality, what is already His. Tithing is our opportunity to show God that He is first in our lives. James 1:17 says that "every good and perfect gift is from above ...," so we have an opportunity to tangibly show God He is the "owner" of our finances by giving back to Him the first of what He gives us.

There are three reasons why we should tithe.

1) Tithing reflects our heart.

What is the most important thing to you? Jesus said in Matthew 6:21 that "where your treasure is, there your heart will be also." We can see the reality of that in the world today and the exaltation of the financially successful, and more personally you can see that by looking at your own checkbook.

Malachi 3:10
"Bring all the tithes into the storehouse, that there may be food in My house, and try Me now in this," says the Lord of hosts, "If I will not open for you the windows of heaven and pour out for you such blessing that there will not be room enough to receive it."

2) Tithing is biblical.

Long before tithing was a practice of the Israelite people, Cain and Abel, the second generation of the human race, brought an offering to the Lord. The Lord blessed Abel's offering, but rejected Cain's. Abel brought the "firstborn of his flock," while Cain brought "some of the fruits of the soil" as an offering. God wants to be first. The following scriptures show how tithing is biblical.

Genesis 14:18-20
Then Melchizedek king of Salem brought out bread and wine; he was the priest of God Most High. And he blessed him and said: "Blessed be Abram of God Most High, Possessor of heaven and earth; and blessed be God Most High, who has delivered your enemies into your hand." And he gave him a tithe of all.

Genesis 28:22
"And this stone which I have set as a pillar shall be God's house, and of all that you give me I will surely give a tenth to you."

Leviticus 27:30
And all the tithe of the land, whether of the seed of the land or of the fruit of the tree, is the Lord's. It is holy to the Lord.

Deuteronomy 26:1-2
And it shall be, when you come into the land which the Lord your God is giving you as an inheritance, and you possess it and dwell in it, that you shall take some of the first of all the produce of the ground, which you shall bring from your land that the Lord your God is giving you, and put it in a basket and go to the place where the Lord your God chooses to make His name abide.

3) Tithing is a benefit.

God's kingdom is built on multiplication, not division. God uses the tithe as an investment where everyone involved gets a return on the investment. Obviously, the church and the kingdom are blessed, and yet God's nature is to also bless the giver. This principle is highlighted in the passage below.

2 Chronicles 31:4-10
Moreover he commanded the people who dwelt in Jerusalem to contribute support for the priests and the Levites, that they might devote themselves to the Law of the Lord.

As soon as the commandment was circulated, the children of Israel brought in abundance the first fruits of grain and wine, oil and honey, and of all the produce of the field; and they brought in abundantly the tithe of everything. And the children of Israel and Judah, who dwelt in the cities of Judah, brought the tithe of oxen and sheep; also the tithe of holy things which were consecrated to the Lord their God they laid in heaps.

In the third month they began laying them in heaps, and they finished in the seventh month. And when Hezekiah and the leaders came and saw the heaps, they blessed the Lord and His people Israel. Then Hezekiah questioned the priests and the Levites concerning the heaps. And Azariah the chief priest, from the house of Zadok, answered him and said, "Since the people began to bring the offerings into the house of the Lord, we have had enough to eat and have plenty left, for the Lord has blessed His people; and what is left is this great abundance."

Neuro
by on Jan. 30, 2013 at 6:27 AM

I don't think that welfare recipients should be banned from spending their money on X or Y, let alone Z. I have no issue with the current system of what food stamps can and can't purchase now.

That said, no, they shouldn't be banned from tithing and I don't agree that they should be pressured to pay it either.

Meadowchik
by Silver Member on Jan. 30, 2013 at 7:19 AM

Philosophically, when people start requiring the government to tend to their every need, they are also inviting government into every aspect of their life.

This is why, except in cases of complete disability, people getting assistance should be contributing to society in some way, preferably in agreed-upon terms.

But honestly, it is dangerous territory, because it does not take much for people to be abused by the system and the system's users.

Meadowchik
by Silver Member on Jan. 30, 2013 at 7:23 AM

 

Quoting wickedfiress:

My help doesn't come with specific instructions. Here's your money, I hope you use it wisely.

How about if you commit to help someone for extended time, would it then matter to you what they do with the money? If they ended up having more to live on than you, more discretionary income, would that be okay?  What if they did not pay their rent, or electric, and blew the money on gambling, would you bail them out?  Would you buy groceries for their kids?  Would you come back the next month and lay some ground rules, conditions for your help?

...It's easy to give a few bucks and forget about it, but when the investment is bigger, and means more, it usually starts to matter to the giver, as it should.

lwalker270
by Bronze Member on Jan. 30, 2013 at 7:27 AM


Quoting JoyfulinSD:

I have an issue with this. The church used to help the needy. Now, going to church is like a guiltfest. Half of the sermon is how desperate the church is now with needing updated, renovations, additions to the building, the pastors pay, sending kids to camp and everything else. When I was younger, the church used to go visitshut ins, help those in need in our community. Now we just sent $35,000 to Haiti to help them out. What about our members on PA?  welfare recipients should not contribute.  The church wants seperation of church and state, they shouldn't take from the state then either.

Thankfully, this does not describe my church.  It still helps the needy at home as well as abroad.  I have never known my pastor to do a sermon based on what the church needs financially.




The test of a first-rate intelligence is the ability to hold two opposed ideas in mind at the same time and still retain the ability to function.

~ F. Scott Fitzgerald



Meadowchik
by Silver Member on Jan. 30, 2013 at 7:30 AM

On another note, there is also a moral hazard on the giver.  What if the person is going to use the money to hurt someone, either themselves and someone else?  THEN does it matter what they do with it?  Of course, once it leaves our hands, controlling where the money goes can get complicated, but it is probably the moral thing to do to have a confident level of assurance that it is going to serve the intending purpose of helping.

Furthermore, since we're on the subject of giving and recieving, the giver also has the responsibility to not directly hurt with their gifts.  The reciever has a right to say, "no, stop, that's not helping" as well.

 

jean_marie1987
by Member on Jan. 30, 2013 at 8:15 AM
1 mom liked this

 Well, at least both collections are for something different (I suppose).

Quoting acrogodess:

The catholic churches I attended growing up certainly did so. The first collection was for the church and the second collection was supposed to be for charity work.

Quoting jean_marie1987:

You should read my reply to a PP...



It's sad that monetary tithing is so "important" in church. Some churches even collect twice (or more) in one service.




Quoting stormcris:

This made me laugh. I can say in certain churches the amount of your righteousness seems to be based entirely on where or not you tithe and how much. They would feel this sort of ban to be an attack on Christianity.

 

Add your quick reply below:
You must be a member to reply to this post.
Join the Meeting Place for Moms!
Talk to other moms, share advice, and have fun!

(minimum 6 characters)