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Protesters gather outside LAPD Headquarters to protest departmental corruption, mishandling of Dorner case.

Protest outside LAPD headquarters

Dozens of protesters gathered outside the Los Angeles Police Department headquarters downtown Saturday afternoon, holding signs of support for Christopher Dorner, the fired police officer suspected of killing four people.

Those gathered said they were protesting police corruption and the way the massive manhunt for Dorner was conducted. Authorities said Dorner appears to have died from a self-inflected gunshot wound after a shootout with police in Big Bear on Tuesday, ending a deadly rampage that stretched across Southern California.

Protesters said they believed Dorner’s claims that he was unfairly fired from the department in 2009 – grievances described in a lengthy online manifesto that has been attributed to him. Dorner also claimed that he was the victim of racism.

Protesters also said they were appalled by police mistakenly shooting at passengers in two separate trucks in Torrance, wrongly believing Dorner might be in the vehicles. One woman was shot in the back and is still recovering.

The protesters emphasized that they did not condone the killings of which Dorner is accused.

Michael Nam, 30, stood at the corner of 1st and Main Streets with a sign, painted by his girlfriend, showing a tombstone and the words “RIP Habeas Corpus.” The tombstone was engulfed in flames.

Nam, of Lomita, said he was disturbed by the burning of a mountain cabin near Big Bear where Dorner barricaded himself with a high-powered sniper rifle, smoke bombs and a cache of ammo. The blaze started shortly after police fired "pyrotechnic" tear gas into the cabin; the canisters are known as "burners" because the intense heat they emit often causes a fire.

But authorities have maintained that the fire was not intentionally set. 

Dorner, whose charred body was found in the cabin, appears to have died of a single gunshot wound to the head, authorities said.

“How the police handled this -– they were the judge, the jury and the executioner,” Nam said. “As an American citizen, you have the right to a trial and due process by law.”

Nam, a former Marine and a current member of the Army National Guard, said he has combat experience from deployments in Iraq and Afghanistan.

He said he has been in situations in which a combatant has been barricaded and successfully waited until the person surrendered, eventually getting “tired and coming out on their own.”

Nam said it was “pretty obvious” police wanted Dorner dead. “What I saw was a complete disregard for the Bill of Rights,” Nam said.

San Bernardino County Sheriff John McMahon, during a news conference Friday, defended the tactics used by his agency in the shootout at the mountain cabin, which left one of his deputies dead and another seriously wounded.

“The bottom line is the deputy sheriffs of this department, and the law enforcement officers from the surrounding area, did an outstanding job,” he said. “They ran into the line of fire.”


Protesters on Saturday said they organized the event through a Facebook page called “I support Christopher Jordan Dorner.” The Facebook post announcing the protest tells attendees to “keep it PEACEFUL” and to bring recording equipment.

The Facebook page states: “This is not a page about supporting the killing of innocent people. It’s supporting fighting back against corrupt cops and bringing to light what they do.”

As the protesters stood Saturday, drivers passing by honked, waved and gave thumbs up. A handful of officers watched from police headquarters across the street.

Nam said he spoke to the officers before the protest began about what the protesters should do to keep the event peaceful. He said the officers were respectful.

The protesters marched around the block, circling an intersection near the department headquarters. They chanted, “LAPD, you are guilty.”

Signs expressed anger at police and support for Dorner.

“If you’re not enraged, you’re not paying attention,” one sign read.

“Why couldn’t we hear his side?”

“Clear his name! Christopher Dorner”

Liliana Alaniz, 40, came with her family -– her mother, sister, nieces and daughters -– from Long Beach to join the protest, which she said was her first.

“I really, really believe he was innocent in the firing case,” Alaniz said of Dorner.

Alaniz held a sign that read, “Trying to clear your name.”

Her daughter, Andrea Tovar, said Dorner “has his supporters.”

“Murder is never right, but neither is the law when it’s unjust,” said Tovar, 18. She said police need to know they “can’t get away with everything.”

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If they enforced bank regulations like they do park rules, we wouldn't be in this mess

by on Feb. 17, 2013 at 1:26 PM
Replies (31-36):
brookiecookie87
by Platinum Member on Feb. 18, 2013 at 9:51 AM

The two women were delivering News Papers. That means they were probably driving at most 5-10 mph and leaving their lights off so they don't wake people when they drive up their drive ways.

They never published where all the people on his list lived so there was no way for the two ladies to know. And the cops were on a stake out there (They were undercover) so there was no way for the two women to know that they were driving near the persons residence.

The Police attempted to kill someone three times (Luckily for everyone they were only successful on the last attempt when it was actually him). Which is the point a lot of people are making. Christopher Dorner could not turn himself in if he wanted. They shot at two different trucks that they thought were matches without even attempting to confirm who was inside until after they were done.

I agree that it was a tense, and difficult situation. But if there are Officers who feel so on nerve they cannot keep their hand away from the trigger-They should probably stay home that day. I don't think anyone would want a Police officer that on nerve out on the field that day. Let him collect himself. Maybe give better training to the Police Officers so they know what to do in a tense situation. Maybe be more strict with protocol and procedures so Police are not shooting at people blindly.

I think everyone on every side of the fence knew Christopher Dorner was going to die. But we only knew that because the Police were shooting at "matches". If the Police were attempting to arrest him everyone wouldn't have known that. They had him cornered in a cabin. The only exits being the windows and doors. There was no escape for him unless everyone agreed to close their eyes. They could have waited him out


Quoting Naturewoman4:

Brooke, there's no doubt what the cops did in shooting up that truck of those 2 innocent women was so sloppy & careless.  I still can't believe they would do that.  Those cops that did that, will/should be fired.  What I was wondering though, & this is not to excuse the cops, but why did the women in the truck have their headlights off driving in the direction of the police?  From what I heard, the cops were staking out the area, because someone on the LAPD lived on the street & was on the hit list of Dorner.  

Imo, the police did not intentionally go out & kill anyone.  But, Dorner did.  So, those two things IMO, are not the same.  I personally feel the police knew what Dorner's plan was from his manifesto.  Dorner was very good as a sniper.  I believe the police really felt that Dorner would probably end up killing more people.  Police & their family members.  TO ME, I think this was a very tense & difficult situation.  Yes, I wish somehow this would of turned out differently.  But, Dorner wanted to die.  There was nothing the police would of been able to do about that.  As sad as it all was, I think it turned out the only way it could of turned out.  Had it not of went that way I believe more would of died.   


Quoting brookiecookie87:



Quoting gdiamante:


Quoting brookiecookie87:

Your analogy is incorrect. It would be like one of the offensive line men saying, "Let's injure the quarterback", and then another one saying, "Yeah, let's injure him so he can't play anymore!"

Then he gets injured and the coach says, "It was an accident. The injury was not intentional".

Except in this situation we have it on tape that was live. It's nothing like a fan saying it. Because a fan has no direct influence over what happens in a game. The Police Officers do. Especially if multiple officers are saying it.

Especially when you can listen to the Police Scanners where they say they are going to deploy -7- burners.


Do you know why they are called burners?

I do. My point was that the very understandable attitude of the cops on the scene wasn't driving what was going on at the command post in another location, as the sun was going down.

What we got on tape live was only part of what was going on, not the full picture. Yep, they deployed the burners. And to be honest I was more worried that they'd start a major forest fire than anything else.

Yes, I believe Dorner was unfairly fired. And ya know what? I give him credit for not killing that couple in the cabin or the old man with a boat in San Diego.

But he loses all sympathy when he kills ANYONE. If getting his GOOD NAME was important, he chose the WRONG WAY to do it and would have been more successful by setting himself afire in front of the LAPD as a protest.

Oh-I wasn't implying Christopher Dorner was some hero who they should have let run free. He allegedly killed people and needed to be caught to be put on trial and face his punishment. I was just pointing out that they didn't even try to arrest him. And every action they did showed us they had no intention of arresting him.

From shooting at the two other trucks with innocent people inside to deploying -7- Burners to start the fire.

If Officers are heard saying they should burn him. And Police say on their scanners they are going to deploy 7 burners. And burners are known to start a fire (Only amplified by the fact that they used 7). It seems kind of silly to suggest they didn't intend for that fire to happen.

I would agree that he choose the wrong way to clear his name. But that doesn't mean the Police were right in attempting to kill him at every chance they got instead of arresting him.

And it doesn't change the fact that they highlighted the points he made in his manifesto. He said they don't care who they hurt if they "match" the description. Then they end up shooting at three people because they "matched" a description.

You said you lost all sympathy for Christopher Dorner when he killed someone. Are the Police (And their procedures) off the hook because they have bad aim and their 40+ shots didn't kill anyone? If the 71 year old lady they shot in the back during her newspaper delivery route dies will you also agree they were wrong?





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If they enforced bank regulations like they do park rules, we wouldn't be in this mess

gdiamante
by Silver Member on Feb. 18, 2013 at 11:19 PM


Quoting brookiecookie87:

I imagine it was a small gathering because of the speed they had it and the lack of advertising/spreading the word.

In this age of social media, it takes little time to put together a protest. And we're talking about a city that burned after the Rodney King verdicts. To me, that's the really surprising thing... I'd have expected a lot more action without organization, and we haven't seen it.

I have been following the case/articles/news about Christopher Dorner pretty closely and I didn't even hear about the Protest till after it happened.

He was in a cabin. If the Police can lose someone that is in a cabin when they have multiple agencies there, swat teams and armored vehicles from different areas. Darkness would not give him cover. He would have to open a door or a window to leave. The only way he would have "escaped" from there is if everyone agreed to close their eyes.

Having been in the area at night... I know it would have been possible for him to escape again. 

I don't think I ever met anyone that has suggested that it was a good thing he was dead so they don't have to go through a expensive trial. I think as someone else mentioned. It is probably more along the lines of most people understand that LAPD is corrupt and this wasn't a shock to them.

We agree there. Some more heads will roll at LAPD. But since the organization is more like a Hydra than anything else, we'll see things happen again. And again. And again. I don't think it will take anything less than a nuclear bomb to really eliminate the problem.

It does occur to me that since EVERYONE in SoCal knows LAPD is corrupt and at the very least the US Border Patrol will take on guys fired from other sources, Dorner HAD options upon separation from the Navy. Somehow he didn't know it. How in the world did that happen?

There are no real ways to go about this. Try to bring light on a situation to change it. Or give up and let it be. The more people put the light on them and the corruption the harder it is for them to get away with it. 


Naturewoman4
by Platinum Member on Feb. 18, 2013 at 11:56 PM

Ok, Brooke I understand what you are saying.  First, I didn't know that newspaper throwers drove up into people's driveways.  I threw papers once. I just stopped on the street in front of their driveway, & threw it onto their driveway.  I couldn't image not having my headlights on ever.  But, I know that isn't the point here.  Just an observation. 

I don't know why the police did what they did.  Obviously, a really crazy thing to do.  They should be fired & sued like crazy!  I heard the police saying how sorry they were & wanted to buy them a new truck.  Yeah, like that helps!  But, honestly Brooke I still feel that the Police really just wanted this guy.  Yes, if it was to kill him ok.  Because, let's be honest, Dorner was a really good shooter!! 

 He had a huge list of people he wanted to kill.  Not to mention all the other law enforcement along with way.  Sorry, Brooke but this man was REALLY dangerous!  Dangerous to not only law enforcement, but to EVERYONE!  The families of people in law enforcement.  I mean, who knows what Dorner would of done & the police just felt he was such a threat, that he could of done anything to get out of the situations he was in. 

 Then, what?  Say somehow he did get out of that cabin.  Set off a smoke bomb, then run out shooting, all while running through the smoke. What if he got out?  What if he ended up shooting even more people?  Then what?  One never knows Brooke, what could of happen.  How many more people could of been killed?  I think there wasn't a lot of protesters honestly because, I believe people excepted him to die.  I also, believe that most people don't feel what Dorner did, was right.  So, why march in his behalf?  I agree, the LAPD like all other Police Dept. are corrupt.  But, to me, what happen to Dorner...& LAPD corruption is separate issues IMO. 

 

 

Quoting brookiecookie87:

The two women were delivering News Papers. That means they were probably driving at most 5-10 mph and leaving their lights off so they don't wake people when they drive up their drive ways.

They never published where all the people on his list lived so there was no way for the two ladies to know. And the cops were on a stake out there (They were undercover) so there was no way for the two women to know that they were driving near the persons residence.

The Police attempted to kill someone three times (Luckily for everyone they were only successful on the last attempt when it was actually him). Which is the point a lot of people are making. Christopher Dorner could not turn himself in if he wanted. They shot at two different trucks that they thought were matches without even attempting to confirm who was inside until after they were done.

I agree that it was a tense, and difficult situation. But if there are Officers who feel so on nerve they cannot keep their hand away from the trigger-They should probably stay home that day. I don't think anyone would want a Police officer that on nerve out on the field that day. Let him collect himself. Maybe give better training to the Police Officers so they know what to do in a tense situation. Maybe be more strict with protocol and procedures so Police are not shooting at people blindly.

I think everyone on every side of the fence knew Christopher Dorner was going to die. But we only knew that because the Police were shooting at "matches". If the Police were attempting to arrest him everyone wouldn't have known that. They had him cornered in a cabin. The only exits being the windows and doors. There was no escape for him unless everyone agreed to close their eyes. They could have waited him out

 

Quoting Naturewoman4:

Brooke, there's no doubt what the cops did in shooting up that truck of those 2 innocent women was so sloppy & careless.  I still can't believe they would do that.  Those cops that did that, will/should be fired.  What I was wondering though, & this is not to excuse the cops, but why did the women in the truck have their headlights off driving in the direction of the police?  From what I heard, the cops were staking out the area, because someone on the LAPD lived on the street & was on the hit list of Dorner.  

Imo, the police did not intentionally go out & kill anyone.  But, Dorner did.  So, those two things IMO, are not the same.  I personally feel the police knew what Dorner's plan was from his manifesto.  Dorner was very good as a sniper.  I believe the police really felt that Dorner would probably end up killing more people.  Police & their family members.  TO ME, I think this was a very tense & difficult situation.  Yes, I wish somehow this would of turned out differently.  But, Dorner wanted to die.  There was nothing the police would of been able to do about that.  As sad as it all was, I think it turned out the only way it could of turned out.  Had it not of went that way I believe more would of died.   

 

Quoting brookiecookie87:

 

 

Quoting gdiamante:

 

Quoting brookiecookie87:

Your analogy is incorrect. It would be like one of the offensive line men saying, "Let's injure the quarterback", and then another one saying, "Yeah, let's injure him so he can't play anymore!"

Then he gets injured and the coach says, "It was an accident. The injury was not intentional".

Except in this situation we have it on tape that was live. It's nothing like a fan saying it. Because a fan has no direct influence over what happens in a game. The Police Officers do. Especially if multiple officers are saying it.

Especially when you can listen to the Police Scanners where they say they are going to deploy -7- burners.


Do you know why they are called burners?

I do. My point was that the very understandable attitude of the cops on the scene wasn't driving what was going on at the command post in another location, as the sun was going down.

What we got on tape live was only part of what was going on, not the full picture. Yep, they deployed the burners. And to be honest I was more worried that they'd start a major forest fire than anything else.

Yes, I believe Dorner was unfairly fired. And ya know what? I give him credit for not killing that couple in the cabin or the old man with a boat in San Diego.

But he loses all sympathy when he kills ANYONE. If getting his GOOD NAME was important, he chose the WRONG WAY to do it and would have been more successful by setting himself afire in front of the LAPD as a protest.

Oh-I wasn't implying Christopher Dorner was some hero who they should have let run free. He allegedly killed people and needed to be caught to be put on trial and face his punishment. I was just pointing out that they didn't even try to arrest him. And every action they did showed us they had no intention of arresting him.

From shooting at the two other trucks with innocent people inside to deploying -7- Burners to start the fire.

If Officers are heard saying they should burn him. And Police say on their scanners they are going to deploy 7 burners. And burners are known to start a fire (Only amplified by the fact that they used 7). It seems kind of silly to suggest they didn't intend for that fire to happen.

I would agree that he choose the wrong way to clear his name. But that doesn't mean the Police were right in attempting to kill him at every chance they got instead of arresting him.

And it doesn't change the fact that they highlighted the points he made in his manifesto. He said they don't care who they hurt if they "match" the description. Then they end up shooting at three people because they "matched" a description.

You said you lost all sympathy for Christopher Dorner when he killed someone. Are the Police (And their procedures) off the hook because they have bad aim and their 40+ shots didn't kill anyone? If the 71 year old lady they shot in the back during her newspaper delivery route dies will you also agree they were wrong?

 

 

 

 

 

 

Naturewoman4
by Platinum Member on Feb. 19, 2013 at 12:12 AM

To protest after the killings of innocent people by Dorner, imo, is disrespectful towards those that were killed.  They were having the funerals for those that were killed.  I believe that Civil Rights Leaders & others that deal with Corruption, should bring this up.

  But, quite honestly I feel the fact we're not hearing much about this, might mean there's nothing to be said about this.  Otherwise, I would think there would be A LOT more attention in this manner. 

Lizard_Lina
by Silver Member on Feb. 19, 2013 at 12:17 AM
1 mom liked this
100% this


Quoting brookiecookie87:




Quoting gdiamante:


Quoting brookiecookie87:

Oh-I wasn't implying Christopher Dorner was some hero who they should have let run free. He allegedly killed people and needed to be caught to be put on trial and face his punishment. I was just pointing out that they didn't even try to arrest him. And every action they did showed us they had no intention of arresting him.

From shooting at the two other trucks with innocent people inside to deploying -7- Burners to start the fire.

If Officers are heard saying they should burn him. And Police say on their scanners they are going to deploy 7 burners. And burners are known to start a fire (Only amplified by the fact that they used 7). It seems kind of silly to suggest they didn't intend for that fire to happen.

I would agree that he choose the wrong way to clear his name. But that doesn't mean the Police were right in attempting to kill him at every chance they got instead of arresting him.


And it doesn't change the fact that they highlighted the points he made in his manifesto. He said they don't care who they hurt if they "match" the description. Then they end up shooting at three people because they "matched" a description.

You said you lost all sympathy for Christopher Dorner when he killed someone. Are the Police (And their procedures) off the hook because they have bad aim and their 40+ shots didn't kill anyone? If the 71 year old lady they shot in the back during her newspaper delivery route dies will you also agree they were wrong?

Hell no, they're not off the hook. We all KNOW there are bad cops and stupid cops. And the more scared and emotional you get, the more stupid you get.

But I don't buy any of the thinking that this was a setup... the time to set up Chris Dorner was when he was fired in 2009, not now. 

He was discharged HONORABLY from the Navy the Friday before all this started. I think he was completely unprepared for that and went off the deep end.

I don't believe he was "setup" either (If you are referring to the people who think he didn't kill anyone and they are just blaming him for those deaths). But I do believe in due process.

They should have at least attempted to arrest him instead of shooting at anything that looks like him. And then burning the cabin down that he was in.




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glitterteaz
by Ruby Member on Feb. 19, 2013 at 12:19 AM

good for them something has to give


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