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"There is a special place in HELL for women.......

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who don't help other women". - Madeliene Albright (inspired by the spat between Tina Fey and Taylor Swift)....Thought?
by on Mar. 6, 2013 at 11:16 AM
Replies (141-150):
SuperJo
by Member on Mar. 9, 2013 at 8:44 PM
2 moms liked this
Every woman on CafeMom is going to Hell, then...
Posted on the NEW CafeMom Mobile
malibucj
by Member on Mar. 9, 2013 at 8:48 PM

If there were a helll........

I'll stick with Karma

KamWorthy
by Silver Member on Mar. 9, 2013 at 8:53 PM
Atheist have it correct as far as what happens after death, and Hell. Aside from 1 or 2 little things.
Quoting malibucj:

If there were a helll........

I'll stick with Karma

malibucj
by Member on Mar. 9, 2013 at 8:55 PM

They could. I don't know. I personally look at death and after death as one of the great unknowns. 


Quoting KamWorthy:

Atheist have it correct as far as what happens after death, and Hell. Aside from 1 or 2 little things.
Quoting malibucj:

If there were a helll........

I'll stick with Karma


 

LindaClement
by Thatwoman on Mar. 9, 2013 at 8:56 PM
1 mom liked this

I nominate this for Best Reply of Saturday...

Quoting SuperJo:

Every woman on CafeMom is going to Hell, then...


KamWorthy
by Silver Member on Mar. 9, 2013 at 8:59 PM
It is a mystery, I love a good mystery.
Quoting malibucj:

They could. I don't know. I personally look at death and after death as one of the great unknowns. 


Quoting KamWorthy:

Atheist have it correct as far as what happens after death, and Hell. Aside from 1 or 2 little things.
Quoting malibucj:

If there were a helll........

I'll stick with Karma


 

malibucj
by Member on Mar. 9, 2013 at 9:07 PM
1 mom liked this

 I agree..... I have my own beliefs about it, but in reality no one knows for sure


Quoting KamWorthy:

It is a mystery, I love a good mystery.
Quoting malibucj:it.

They could. I don't know. I personally look at death and after death as one of the great unknowns. 

 

Quoting KamWorthy:

Atheist have it correct as far as what happens after death, and Hell. Aside from 1 or 2 little things.
Quoting malibucj:

If there were a helll........

I'll stick with Karma

 

 


 

stacymomof2
by Ruby Member on Mar. 9, 2013 at 10:16 PM

OK, well I think I understood your general position.  My point below is that you seem to think that specifically women who mentor other women and encourage other women to do so are purposefully making an enemy out of men by their encouragement.  Because that's what you said, and reinforced it by saying women who mentor or encourage others to mentor are "making excuses" by recognizing that there is such a thing as a "good ol' boys" club.

I am just trying to follow your logic that women supporting other women are making excuses.

Quoting KamWorthy:

We are discussing a comment made by M. Albright, correct? We are deciphering what she meant when she made said comment as a part of the speech she gave to a group of women athletes, correct? We are also discussing in what context Taylor Swift may have quoted Ms Albright, yes? It's very simple Stacy.....I don't believe there is a special place in hell for women who won't help women. I dont think hell cares. I do however feel, hypothetically of course, that if hell was biased when it came to sin, that there would be a special corner for people who thought themselves higher than everyone else, those who harmed or killed children, animals the elderly....etc....but to say that women will go to hell for not helping women, is nothing more that a statement of self-superiority and entitlement. So, no Stacy, though the easiest, most obvious comment, which you chose, was to say I must not like women, is incorrect. I don't favor women over men, nor do I favor children over women, or children over men, or women over children, or men over children, or men over women. Now that I've made it very elementary for you, what do you think I think? I'll tell you...I believe in equality. When it comes to support, help, assistance, mentoring, encouragement, etc....there is no gender, only a human being as far as I'm concerned.
Quoting stacymomof2:


No one said men were the enemy, why do you bring that up?  Do you see it as a zero sum game?  I think if you read my post you would see that I even said that "in many cases it isn't even intentional."  I thnk that your assumption that encouraging women to mentor and support each other is somehow an excuse is telling about your personal opinion of women, which seems to be negative.  You appear to think that women using the same advantages and skills a man would use is somehow threatening to men.  As a matter of fact it appears you are the one with a low opinion of men, assuming that they wouldn't succeed, all other things being equal.  That's kind of underestimating men, IMO.  They will be OK in a level playing field, at least the men I know would be.

Quoting KamWorthy:

There are many attributes that women are known for using to their advantage as well. Men are not the enemy, and when we can get that through our hair do's, we will find that we are all really on the same side, with the exception a few idiots from both genders. The good ol boys club is not as large as it used to be, we need to stop using them as an excuse for any and all that we may experience due to our own personal choices, character, inadeqacies etc...
Quoting stacymomof2:

I don't think you can ignore the real meaning of this quote by assuming that Albright was excusing disgusting criminal acts.  I see people aren't familiar with what Albright stood for and her support of women's success in positions of leadership.  I assume that also they are somehow not aware that part of the problem with women getting leadership positions is because of the "good ol' boys" club that they are excluded from.  I would say that in many cases it isn't even intentional, but I think anyone with a logical mind could see that more women in power will beget more women in power.  Instead of women assuming there is only one spot for a woman and fighting for that one spot, they need to be able to expand their influence so there are many potential positions.  

Call it mentoring, cronyism, or whatever, the fact is in business men use it to their advantage and women should be able to as well.

Quoting KamWorthy:

I was thinking the exact same thing when I first heard the quote originate by staunch liberal Madeleine Albright.
Quoting TheLadyAmalthea:

I would say there is a special place in hell for child rapists and child abusers... not women who don't help other women. That's a bit much...





KamWorthy
by Silver Member on Mar. 9, 2013 at 10:19 PM
Anyone who could walk away and not advocate for someone who is in need, is compassion challenged, and limited as a human being.
Quoting stacymomof2:

OK, well I think I understood your general position.  My point below is that you seem to think that specifically women who mentor other women and encourage other women to do so are purposefully making an enemy out of men by their encouragement.  Because that's what you said, and reinforced it by saying women who mentor or encourage others to mentor are "making excuses" by recognizing that there is such a thing as a "good ol' boys" club.

I am just trying to follow your logic that women supporting other women are making excuses.

Quoting KamWorthy:

We are discussing a comment made by M. Albright, correct? We are deciphering what she meant when she made said comment as a part of the speech she gave to a group of women athletes, correct? We are also discussing in what context Taylor Swift may have quoted Ms Albright, yes? It's very simple Stacy.....I don't believe there is a special place in hell for women who won't help women. I dont think hell cares. I do however feel, hypothetically of course, that if hell was biased when it came to sin, that there would be a special corner for people who thought themselves higher than everyone else, those who harmed or killed children, animals the elderly....etc....but to say that women will go to hell for not helping women, is nothing more that a statement of self-superiority and entitlement. So, no Stacy, though the easiest, most obvious comment, which you chose, was to say I must not like women, is incorrect. I don't favor women over men, nor do I favor children over women, or children over men, or women over children, or men over children, or men over women. Now that I've made it very elementary for you, what do you think I think? I'll tell you...I believe in equality. When it comes to support, help, assistance, mentoring, encouragement, etc....there is no gender, only a human being as far as I'm concerned.
Quoting stacymomof2:


No one said men were the enemy, why do you bring that up?  Do you see it as a zero sum game?  I think if you read my post you would see that I even said that "in many cases it isn't even intentional."  I thnk that your assumption that encouraging women to mentor and support each other is somehow an excuse is telling about your personal opinion of women, which seems to be negative.  You appear to think that women using the same advantages and skills a man would use is somehow threatening to men.  As a matter of fact it appears you are the one with a low opinion of men, assuming that they wouldn't succeed, all other things being equal.  That's kind of underestimating men, IMO.  They will be OK in a level playing field, at least the men I know would be.

Quoting KamWorthy:

There are many attributes that women are known for using to their advantage as well. Men are not the enemy, and when we can get that through our hair do's, we will find that we are all really on the same side, with the exception a few idiots from both genders. The good ol boys club is not as large as it used to be, we need to stop using them as an excuse for any and all that we may experience due to our own personal choices, character, inadeqacies etc...
Quoting stacymomof2:

I don't think you can ignore the real meaning of this quote by assuming that Albright was excusing disgusting criminal acts.  I see people aren't familiar with what Albright stood for and her support of women's success in positions of leadership.  I assume that also they are somehow not aware that part of the problem with women getting leadership positions is because of the "good ol' boys" club that they are excluded from.  I would say that in many cases it isn't even intentional, but I think anyone with a logical mind could see that more women in power will beget more women in power.  Instead of women assuming there is only one spot for a woman and fighting for that one spot, they need to be able to expand their influence so there are many potential positions.  

Call it mentoring, cronyism, or whatever, the fact is in business men use it to their advantage and women should be able to as well.

Quoting KamWorthy:

I was thinking the exact same thing when I first heard the quote originate by staunch liberal Madeleine Albright.
Quoting TheLadyAmalthea:

I would say there is a special place in hell for child rapists and child abusers... not women who don't help other women. That's a bit much...





stacymomof2
by Ruby Member on Mar. 10, 2013 at 12:30 AM
1 mom liked this

*Edited to cut the quote tree*

Except that isn't what we are talking about, is it?

It's not about compassion for the needy.  It's about advocating for women in leadership positions by mentoring, supporting.  Putting another woman forward for a challenging position when you are in a position to hire or recommend.  

It looks as though a straight answer to my specific question is not forthcoming.  It is obvious you diagree with Albright's quote, you have explained why and I understand what you are saying.  I just vehemently disagree with your conclusions.  This sidebar about helping needy people is apparently meant to disguise the fact that you do not wish to acknowledge your previous statements, or defend them if challenged.  It's not a convincing ploy, so I think it is fair for me to conclude you have no real argument about why you feel women supporting other women makes men the enemy.

Quoting KamWorthy:

Anyone who could walk away and not advocate for someone who is in need, is compassion challenged, and limited as a human being.
Quoting stacymomof2:

OK, well I think I understood your general position.  My point below is that you seem to think that specifically women who mentor other women and encourage other women to do so are purposefully making an enemy out of men by their encouragement.  Because that's what you said, and reinforced it by saying women who mentor or encourage others to mentor are "making excuses" by recognizing that there is such a thing as a "good ol' boys" club.

I am just trying to follow your logic that women supporting other women are making excuses.

Quoting KamWorthy:

We are discussing a comment made by M. Albright, correct? We are deciphering what she meant when she made said comment as a part of the speech she gave to a group of women athletes, correct? We are also discussing in what context Taylor Swift may have quoted Ms Albright, yes? It's very simple Stacy.....I don't believe there is a special place in hell for women who won't help women. I dont think hell cares. I do however feel, hypothetically of course, that if hell was biased when it came to sin, that there would be a special corner for people who thought themselves higher than everyone else, those who harmed or killed children, animals the elderly....etc....but to say that women will go to hell for not helping women, is nothing more that a statement of self-superiority and entitlement. So, no Stacy, though the easiest, most obvious comment, which you chose, was to say I must not like women, is incorrect. I don't favor women over men, nor do I favor children over women, or children over men, or women over children, or men over children, or men over women. Now that I've made it very elementary for you, what do you think I think? I'll tell you...I believe in equality. When it comes to support, help, assistance, mentoring, encouragement, etc....there is no gender, only a human being as far as I'm concerned.



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