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Romney called Tesla a "loser" Tesla is posting profits, expects to pay back the loan 5 years ahead of schedule, and won Motor Trend's Car of the Year.

Six months after Mitt Romney called the Department of Energy’s loan to electric auto company Tesla Motor Co. a “loser,” Tesla has announced it will post its first ever profit in the Q1 2013 and expects to pay back its Department of Energy loan 5 years ahead of schedule, by the end of 2017. Meanwhile, Tesla’s Model S was unanimously voted Motor Trend’s Car of the Year in November 2012.
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Wasn’t there some other contest that happened in November of 2012? I feel  like there was.
 .
If we’re going to talk about picking losers, though, let’s talk about picking Tesla as your “gotcha” zinger during the presidential debates. If you’re going to call someone a “loser,” maybe don’t choose Tesla, which has nearly every demographic in the entire United States rooting for it. Let’s review:
  1. Environmentalists: Don’t like 10,000 barrels of crude oil running down the streets of your cul-de-sac? An electric car may be for you.
  2. Car fans: Sadly, the rumor that Tesla would be racing in Nascar was just an April Fool’s joke, but its Roadster model has already won a four-car drag race against a Lotus Exige, a Porsche GT3, and a Porsche Carrera GT (video below). Surely the Nascar Dad demo can get behind that.
  3. Geeks: Tesla’s Chairman and CEO is Elon Musk, who is also the founder of PayPal and the CEO and chief designer of the Space Exploration Technologies Corporation (SpaceX). In case that’s not enough geek cred for you, Musk is even fluent in the Geek dialect, telling the press after Mitt Romney’s “loser” comment and subsequent loss in the presidential election, “In retrospect, he was right about the object of that statement, but not the subject.” (Translation for those of you who do not speak awkwardese: “Who’s the loser now, motherfucker?”)
  4. People who like awesome things: See, e.g., photo above, video of drag race below.
Lesson: Do not bet against a geek. (Auto journalist Dan Neil already tried that back in 2009, betting Musk he could not build the Model S “within the technical specifications Mr. Musk laid out before the end of 2012.” Musk won, but he donated $1 million to charity anyway.)

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If they enforced bank regulations like they do park rules, we wouldn't be in this mess

by on Apr. 2, 2013 at 1:11 PM
Replies (21-30):
brookiecookie87
by Platinum Member on Apr. 2, 2013 at 3:54 PM


Are you suggesting there is a power shortage in the works? I haven't heard anything of the sort.

Or was this rhetoric you heard on Fox News with no support for it?

Quoting grandmab125:

 And where, oh where, is the electricity going to come from to charge those batteries?  Obama and his slimy EPA are continuing their quest to completely shut down all of our coal generating electric plants and coal mines all over the country.  Oh wait, they think it's going to come from solar panels and wind mills, don't they?

Quoting talia-mom:

Goodness what a stupid statement.

The electricity to  make this car work is probably created by these dirty ways you people hate so much.

Is that easier for you?


Quoting jaxTheMomm:

Which ones are dangerous, expensive, and hurt the environment?  Which ones can run a car?


Quoting talia-mom:

Almost 80% of this country is energized by coal, natural gas, and nuclear.

So which one of those is renewable?


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The Ninety-Nine Percent Moms   

If they enforced bank regulations like they do park rules, we wouldn't be in this mess

grandmab125
by Gold Member on Apr. 2, 2013 at 4:04 PM

 Wake up and smell the coffee.  The Tesla is not a car the average person can or will be able to afford...period.  It costs anywhere from $60,000 to $95,000.  Apparently, they expect to repay their loan because they were able to get the terms of the loan amended, and they sell lots of zero-emission vehicle credits to other companies.  They "say" they expect to turn their first profit this year....four years after they were given the loan.  SMH. 

 

Tesla Announces Plan to Repay Govt Loans Five Years Ahead of Schedule

This June 22, 2012 file photo shows a Tesla Model S outside the Tesla factory in Fremont, Calif. (AP Photo/Paul Sakuma, File).

 

Tesla Motors, which was awarded a $465 million loan from the U.S. government in 2009, announced last week its plan to pay back all its loans five years ahead of schedule, according to Bloomberg News.

 

"The carmaker said in its annual report yesterday that the department approved amended terms of the loan agreements that enable it to complete repayment by December 2017," the report notes.

 

"Starting in 2015, the Palo Alto, California-based company will make accelerated payments from excess free cash flow," the report adds.

 

"Any remaining balance that's there at the end of 2017 we'll pay off as a balloon payment," Tesla Chief Financial Officer Deepak Ahuja told Bloomberg in phone interview.

 

But is there more to this story? How does Tesla plan on repaying the feds so early? Simple: The company plans on becoming profitable in Q1 2013.

 

Yeah, in case you were unaware, this is the first time since its founding in 2003 by billionaire Elon Musk that the maker of battery-powered cars expects to turn a profit.

 

First time.

 

Tesla Announces Plan to Repay Govt Loans Five Years Ahead of Schedule

Tesla Motors workers assemble a Tesla Roadster at their showroom in Menlo Park, Calif. in this 2008 photo. The electric car manufacturer said that it hopes to raise $244 million when it goes public. (Paul Sakuma/AP/File)

 

But let's get back to that government repayment plan.

 

"The original terms required repayment of the loans by 2022, 10 years after the funds were drawn down. Tesla said on Sept. 25 that it was working with the Energy Department on a modified repayment schedule. Amended terms of the loan agreements were registered on Dec. 20 and March 1," Bloomberg reports.

 

 

The report offers some more background on the deal:

 

The funds, provided by the Advanced Technology Vehicle Manufacturing program to Tesla as well as Ford Motor Co. (F), Nissan Motor Co. and Fisker Automotive Inc., were approved in 2009.

 

Warrants Tesla issued to the Energy Department as part of the loan agreements vest in 2018 if the loans aren't paid off. They would enable the government to buy more than 3 million Tesla shares at a discount.

 

"The value of those warrants is very substantial," Ahuja said. "The terms of the original loan had a very good incentive for us to pay off the loan early."
The loan amendment "formalizes that and avoids the vesting of that warrant," he said.

 

Under the agreement, funds for the early payments will be generated from cash above a $200 million threshold "over our reservations balance," Ahuja said.

 

But here's something else worth noting:

 

Tesla also said in the filing yesterday that sales of so- called Zero-Emission Vehicle credits from its electric cars jumped to $40.5 million last year from $2.7 million in 2011.

 

California's environmental rules require large automakers to sell a certain number of electric and plug-in vehicles in the state annually. Those that fall short can buy such credits from companies such as Tesla that generate more than they need.

 

Wait, wait - Tesla has made roughly $37 million since 2011 from selling credits? Who have they been selling these credits to?

 

"Ahuja declined to identify which companies bought Tesla credits, and the carmaker didn't disclose details in its annual report," Bloomberg notes.

 

Huh.

 

"Tesla reported sales last year of 2,650 Model S sedans, which sell for about $60,000 to more than $100,000, before a $7,500 U.S. tax credit," the report adds.

 

 

brookiecookie87
by Platinum Member on Apr. 2, 2013 at 4:11 PM


You do understand anything new is this way, right?

Think back 15 years. How much were computers then? How much was a smart phone? How much was a little stick of memory?

All things that are brand new start off more expensive.

How long did it take Amazon to become profitable? I think it was around 5 years wasn't it? maybe a little longer.

As the saying goes. How many conservatives does it take to change a light bulb?

Zero. They fear change even if it makes the world a brighter place.

Quoting grandmab125:

 Wake up and smell the coffee.  The Tesla is not a car the average person can or will be able to afford...period.  It costs anywhere from $60,000 to $95,000.  Apparently, they expect to repay their loan because they were able to get the terms of the loan amended, and they sell lots of zero-emission vehicle credits to other companies.  They "say" they expect to turn their first profit this year....four years after they were given the loan.  SMH. 




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If they enforced bank regulations like they do park rules, we wouldn't be in this mess

talia-mom
by Gold Member on Apr. 2, 2013 at 4:20 PM
Subsidize the rich as long as you agree.

At least I am genuine in thinking no one should get taxpayer money without them earning it


Quoting brookiecookie87:

So you are saying, "The electricity to make this car work is probably created by these dirty ways" So stop trying to fight it and just continue to give in to what they want already?

You do realize you are making a false ultimatum again, right? The only two options are not, "Completely dismantle them, or continue to let that have full control".

Perhaps if people see the electric car become a success it will make more people interested in going green and perhaps make a shift in how we produce our energy and lead us to invest more into alternative energy sources.


Quoting talia-mom:

Goodness what a stupid statement.

The electricity to  make this car work is probably created by these dirty ways you people hate so much.

Is that easier for you?



Quoting jaxTheMomm:

Which ones are dangerous, expensive, and hurt the environment?  Which ones can run a car?



Quoting talia-mom:

Almost 80% of this country is energized by coal, natural gas, and nuclear.

So which one of those is renewable?



Quoting jaxTheMomm:

It's quite simple.  Tesla's "corporate welfare" is an investment in our future, and it will pay off.  They are innovating the industry, and the tax credit is nothing more than an incentive.

Eventually their vehicles will be more affordable for more people, and it's renewable energy.  So don't worry, I think they will stand on their own very soon.  Their stock has already doubled.


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furbabymum
by Gold Member on Apr. 2, 2013 at 4:21 PM

 Eh. I don't see this as ever being available to the masses. I know when we were looking at buying cars we looked into getting a hybrid. Funny how they were all on backorder and you had to get on a waiting list plus pay 10x more for it. You'll never see those savings at the pump because you way over paid for your car. They just aren't affordable to the average person.

brookiecookie87
by Platinum Member on Apr. 2, 2013 at 4:24 PM


Everytime something new to an industry comes out it is like this.

Think of the first computers. The first smart phones. The first of anything really.

The price will go down. Especially if they end up profitable.

Quoting furbabymum:

 Eh. I don't see this as ever being available to the masses. I know when we were looking at buying cars we looked into getting a hybrid. Funny how they were all on backorder and you had to get on a waiting list plus pay 10x more for it. You'll never see those savings at the pump because you way over paid for your car. They just aren't affordable to the average person.



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The Ninety-Nine Percent Moms   

If they enforced bank regulations like they do park rules, we wouldn't be in this mess

brookiecookie87
by Platinum Member on Apr. 2, 2013 at 4:25 PM


Are you talking about conservatives that agree that the Oil company which is established, extremely profitable, and destructive should get subsidized.

But a car powered by an alternative source which is just starting out, new, and needs help to be established doesn't deserve the same kinds of subsidies?


Quoting talia-mom:

Subsidize the rich as long as you agree.

At least I am genuine in thinking no one should get taxpayer money without them earning it


Quoting brookiecookie87:

So you are saying, "The electricity to make this car work is probably created by these dirty ways" So stop trying to fight it and just continue to give in to what they want already?

You do realize you are making a false ultimatum again, right? The only two options are not, "Completely dismantle them, or continue to let that have full control".

Perhaps if people see the electric car become a success it will make more people interested in going green and perhaps make a shift in how we produce our energy and lead us to invest more into alternative energy sources.


Quoting talia-mom:

Goodness what a stupid statement.

The electricity to  make this car work is probably created by these dirty ways you people hate so much.

Is that easier for you?



Quoting jaxTheMomm:

Which ones are dangerous, expensive, and hurt the environment?  Which ones can run a car?



Quoting talia-mom:

Almost 80% of this country is energized by coal, natural gas, and nuclear.

So which one of those is renewable?



Quoting jaxTheMomm:

It's quite simple.  Tesla's "corporate welfare" is an investment in our future, and it will pay off.  They are innovating the industry, and the tax credit is nothing more than an incentive.

Eventually their vehicles will be more affordable for more people, and it's renewable energy.  So don't worry, I think they will stand on their own very soon.  Their stock has already doubled.




Join us on the 99% Moms group!
The Ninety-Nine Percent Moms   

If they enforced bank regulations like they do park rules, we wouldn't be in this mess

talia-mom
by Gold Member on Apr. 2, 2013 at 4:29 PM

I am talking about me.

People buying a Telsa don't deserve tax credits anymore than any other purchase deserves them.   They need to make it on their own and not because the government chooses to allow this one to be rewarded.

Whine about oil companies all you want.

I am not the one justifying corporate welfare and then whining about it in other posts.

After looking it up, almost 90% of the this country is energized by coal, natural gas, oil, and nuclear.   It isn't working on a different source.   The electricity to run it is almost always going to be dirty.

But yeah, hypopcrites justify corporate welfare as long as they agree with the company.


Quoting brookiecookie87:


Are you talking about conservatives that agree that the Oil company which is established, extremely profitable, and destructive should get subsidized.

But a car powered by an alternative source which is just starting out, new, and needs help to be established doesn't deserve the same kinds of subsidies?


Quoting talia-mom:

Subsidize the rich as long as you agree.

At least I am genuine in thinking no one should get taxpayer money without them earning it


Quoting brookiecookie87:

So you are saying, "The electricity to make this car work is probably created by these dirty ways" So stop trying to fight it and just continue to give in to what they want already?

You do realize you are making a false ultimatum again, right? The only two options are not, "Completely dismantle them, or continue to let that have full control".

Perhaps if people see the electric car become a success it will make more people interested in going green and perhaps make a shift in how we produce our energy and lead us to invest more into alternative energy sources.


Quoting talia-mom:

Goodness what a stupid statement.

The electricity to  make this car work is probably created by these dirty ways you people hate so much.

Is that easier for you?



Quoting jaxTheMomm:

Which ones are dangerous, expensive, and hurt the environment?  Which ones can run a car?



Quoting talia-mom:

Almost 80% of this country is energized by coal, natural gas, and nuclear.

So which one of those is renewable?



Quoting jaxTheMomm:

It's quite simple.  Tesla's "corporate welfare" is an investment in our future, and it will pay off.  They are innovating the industry, and the tax credit is nothing more than an incentive.

Eventually their vehicles will be more affordable for more people, and it's renewable energy.  So don't worry, I think they will stand on their own very soon.  Their stock has already doubled.






brookiecookie87
by Platinum Member on Apr. 2, 2013 at 4:35 PM

You are the one being a hypocrite.

You believe the oil industry is right in being subsized. But you disagree that a new alternative car deserves the same kind of treatement.

But considering you were defending the oil industry in the topic about the oil spill I don't think you care about facts, or making sense. Or if your argument makes you a hypocrite.

You will say anything to defend oil. Why? No idea. But you will.

Quoting talia-mom:

I am talking about me.

People buying a Telsa don't deserve tax credits anymore than any other purchase deserves them.   They need to make it on their own and not because the government chooses to allow this one to be rewarded.

Whine about oil companies all you want.

I am not the one justifying corporate welfare and then whining about it in other posts.

After looking it up, over 90% of the this country is energized by coal, natural gas, oil, and nuclear.   It isn't working on a different source.   The electricity to run it is almost always going to be dirty.

But yeah, hypopcrites justify corporate welfare as long as they agree with the company.


Quoting brookiecookie87:


Are you talking about conservatives that agree that the Oil company which is established, extremely profitable, and destructive should get subsidized.

But a car powered by an alternative source which is just starting out, new, and needs help to be established doesn't deserve the same kinds of subsidies?


Quoting talia-mom:

Subsidize the rich as long as you agree.

At least I am genuine in thinking no one should get taxpayer money without them earning it


Quoting brookiecookie87:

So you are saying, "The electricity to make this car work is probably created by these dirty ways" So stop trying to fight it and just continue to give in to what they want already?

You do realize you are making a false ultimatum again, right? The only two options are not, "Completely dismantle them, or continue to let that have full control".

Perhaps if people see the electric car become a success it will make more people interested in going green and perhaps make a shift in how we produce our energy and lead us to invest more into alternative energy sources.


Quoting talia-mom:

Goodness what a stupid statement.

The electricity to  make this car work is probably created by these dirty ways you people hate so much.

Is that easier for you?



Quoting jaxTheMomm:

Which ones are dangerous, expensive, and hurt the environment?  Which ones can run a car?



Quoting talia-mom:

Almost 80% of this country is energized by coal, natural gas, and nuclear.

So which one of those is renewable?



Quoting jaxTheMomm:

It's quite simple.  Tesla's "corporate welfare" is an investment in our future, and it will pay off.  They are innovating the industry, and the tax credit is nothing more than an incentive.

Eventually their vehicles will be more affordable for more people, and it's renewable energy.  So don't worry, I think they will stand on their own very soon.  Their stock has already doubled.








Join us on the 99% Moms group!
The Ninety-Nine Percent Moms   

If they enforced bank regulations like they do park rules, we wouldn't be in this mess

talia-mom
by Gold Member on Apr. 2, 2013 at 4:36 PM

Wow,   you just make shit up.  I have justified the oil companies being subsidized?   Pull up the post now.   Do it and show me that I said that.

I don't defend oil.   I just argue with people that think we can just stop using it.


Quoting brookiecookie87:

You are the one being a hypocrite.

You believe the oil industry is right in being subsized. But you disagree that a new alternative car deserves the same kind of treatement.

But considering you were defending the oil industry in the topic about the oil spill I don't think you care about facts, or making sense. Or if your argument makes you a hypocrite.

You will say anything to defend oil. Why? No idea. But you will.

Quoting talia-mom:

I am talking about me.

People buying a Telsa don't deserve tax credits anymore than any other purchase deserves them.   They need to make it on their own and not because the government chooses to allow this one to be rewarded.

Whine about oil companies all you want.

I am not the one justifying corporate welfare and then whining about it in other posts.

After looking it up, over 90% of the this country is energized by coal, natural gas, oil, and nuclear.   It isn't working on a different source.   The electricity to run it is almost always going to be dirty.

But yeah, hypopcrites justify corporate welfare as long as they agree with the company.


Quoting brookiecookie87:


Are you talking about conservatives that agree that the Oil company which is established, extremely profitable, and destructive should get subsidized.

But a car powered by an alternative source which is just starting out, new, and needs help to be established doesn't deserve the same kinds of subsidies?


Quoting talia-mom:

Subsidize the rich as long as you agree.

At least I am genuine in thinking no one should get taxpayer money without them earning it


Quoting brookiecookie87:

So you are saying, "The electricity to make this car work is probably created by these dirty ways" So stop trying to fight it and just continue to give in to what they want already?

You do realize you are making a false ultimatum again, right? The only two options are not, "Completely dismantle them, or continue to let that have full control".

Perhaps if people see the electric car become a success it will make more people interested in going green and perhaps make a shift in how we produce our energy and lead us to invest more into alternative energy sources.


Quoting talia-mom:

Goodness what a stupid statement.

The electricity to  make this car work is probably created by these dirty ways you people hate so much.

Is that easier for you?



Quoting jaxTheMomm:

Which ones are dangerous, expensive, and hurt the environment?  Which ones can run a car?



Quoting talia-mom:

Almost 80% of this country is energized by coal, natural gas, and nuclear.

So which one of those is renewable?



Quoting jaxTheMomm:

It's quite simple.  Tesla's "corporate welfare" is an investment in our future, and it will pay off.  They are innovating the industry, and the tax credit is nothing more than an incentive.

Eventually their vehicles will be more affordable for more people, and it's renewable energy.  So don't worry, I think they will stand on their own very soon.  Their stock has already doubled.










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