Join the Meeting Place for Moms!
Talk to other moms, share advice, and have fun!

(minimum 6 characters)

Current Events & Hot Topics Current Events & Hot Topics

Catholic and Support Gay Marriage? No Communion for You!

Posted by   + Show Post



Catholic and Support Gay Marriage? No Communion for You!

The leader of the Detroit Archdiocese has said that if Catholic congregants support same-sex marriage they should be denied Communion, and he’s not alone in that thinking.

The Archbishop of Detroit Allen Vigneron on Sunday told the Detroit Free Press that he agrees with a senior Catholic lawyer that those who support same-sex marriage should be denied Communion. Vigneron reportedly told the Free Press:

“For a Catholic to receive holy Communion and still deny the revelation Christ entrusted to the church is to try to say two contradictory things at once: ‘I believe the church offers the saving truth of Jesus, and I reject what the church teaches.’ In effect, they would contradict themselves. This sort of behavior would result in publicly renouncing one’s integrity and logically bring shame for a double-dealing that is not unlike perjury.”

For a number of years now, senior Catholic figures have threatened public officials, like Rep. Nancy Pelosi, with a denial of Communion over issues like pro-choice reforms, and now increasingly, this is applied to the issue of same-sex marriage.

Vigneron’s comments chase those of Edward Peters, a lawyer and adviser to the Vatican who teaches Catholic canon law at Sacred Heart Major Seminary in Detroit and who, in a blog post last month, wrote:

“The Catholic Church teaches, through its ordinary magisterium and with infallible certainty, that marriage exists only between one man and one woman [...] Catholics who promote “same-sex marriage” act contrary to Canon 209 § 1 and should not approach for holy Communion per Canon 916. Depending on the facts of the case, they also risk having holy Communion withheld from them under Canon 915, being rebuked under Canon 1339 § 2, and/or being sanctioned under Canon 1369 for gravely injuring good morals.”

Peters goes on to say those engaging in a same-sex marriage or those who have helped facilitate a same-sex marriage could also be barred from Communion.

Whether as damage control or an empty attempt to answer criticism, the diocese’s spokesperson, Joe Kohn, issued the following statement on Monday:

The archbishop’s focal point here is not “gay marriage”; it is a Catholic’s reception of Holy Communion. If a Catholic publicly opposes the church on a serious matter of the church’s teaching, any serious matter — for example, whether it be a rejection of the divinity of Christ, racist beliefs, support for abortion or support for redefining marriage — that would contradict the public affirmation they would make of the church’s beliefs by receiving Communion.

As the archbishop states, the pastors of the church are ready to assist Catholics to help them understand and avoid this conflict.

Vigneron called Catholics supporting same-sex marriage tantamount to perjury. You don’t get to throw around words like that and then pretend, as Kohn does above, that there’s no argument to be fought.

Now an initial reaction to this might be that the position, while odious, is perfectly within the realm of religious freedom of expression and that the church can define its own rules however it sees fit. Fine. Move on. Except that while in some circumstances that is true, there’s a problem here, isn’t there?

Increasingly, a majority of Catholic congregants support, if not same-sex marriage in the religious sense, marriage equality in the secular and legal sense. A recent poll says that support has now surpassed the majority mark at 54%. When asked about this, they often cite their religious beliefs. An example would be the aforementioned Nancy Pelosi, who has said her faith and her self-avowed relationship with God compels her to oppose discrimination.

So what of a religious right to express that aspect of one’s faith by supporting same-sex marriage?

Well, it seems the Catholic church is dealing with this by defining those people out of being Catholic and denying them Holy Communion, a key pillar for Catholic identity.

Technically the church can do whatever it wants in that regard, but one thing is certain. With positions like this, the church could shed support in swathes and elegantly marginalize itself in only a matter of decades because what the church thinks it means to be Catholic really doesn’t seem to be what its congregants think Catholicism is, and this is a possibly fatal disconnect.

In the short term at least, it makes the church’s staunch cries about how we must protect religious rights and rally against marriage equality sound even more hollow.

 

Related Reading:

Students Suspended From Catholic School For Pro-Choice Activism

Catholic Church Dumps Another Charity For LGBT Support

Catholic Hospital Denies Gay Man HIV Medicine



Read more: http://www.care2.com/causes/catholic-and-support-gay-marriage-no-communion-for-you.html#ixzz2QGJAFKdc
by on Apr. 12, 2013 at 11:10 AM
Replies (31-40):
MidwestMama55
by on Apr. 12, 2013 at 12:07 PM
2 moms liked this

To be clear, I am appalled, and believe those priests should be not only removed from their positions but put in jail. I do not agree with cases where shielding was done (there were many cases where they priests were not protected, too).  I am making NO excuses for what these men have done.

But trashing the Catholic church is also appalling. The vast, vast majority of priests are wonderful human beings who have devoted their lives to serving others, including the poorest and weakest humans among us. What I strongly object to is those who are so blinded by their hate that they are willing to trash and hate the 99,998 good ones because of the horrific acts of 2.


Quoting pansyprincess:

 But why should it matter the number?  The church shielded and protected these priests and allowed them to remain in the church and receive the Eucharist.  As a Catholic, you should be appalled by this, not making excuses for it.

Do you believe a pedophile deserves communion, but a person that supports love doesn't?  Are you really that backwards?


Quoting MidwestMama55:

Sad that you are such a hater. A very, very, very tiny number of priests were involved in those horrible acts. There are more schoolteachers that molest children than Catholic priests. There are more Protestant ministers that molest children than Catholic priests. There are more parents that molest children than Catholic priests. But for those who hate religion, they just see what they want to see.


Quoting mehamil1:

Support marriage equality, don't get to eat Jesus. 

Molest children, get to eat Jesus. 

Yeah, makes perfect sense. 







IandLoveandYou
by Bronze Member on Apr. 12, 2013 at 12:10 PM
1 mom liked this
Why is that?

My parents support gay marriage they are catholic and very active in their church(es).

Why is it so important to you that they do not continue to receive the Eucharist?


Quoting jehosoba84:

 I dearly hope no Catholics have been receiving the Eucharist while supporting these views.

Posted on CafeMom Mobile
MidwestMama55
by on Apr. 12, 2013 at 12:10 PM
4 moms liked this

Untrue.  Having premarital sex is considered a sin in the Catholic church. But one can repent, endeavor to sin no more, ad be forgiven. Gay marriage is different as the participants are not remorseful, and continue to sin by living in that state daily.


Quoting futureshock:


Quoting MidwestMama55:

Makes sense to me.  If you support gay marriage, you are not a Catholic and should not be receiving Holy Communion. Find a "Joe Bob's" church to be a part of.

Also, if you had a child out of wedlock you are not a Catholic, if you had premarital sex, etc., etc., etc., etc.



MidwestMama55
by on Apr. 12, 2013 at 12:11 PM
2 moms liked this

No one, including me, is saying that the cover up was ok.


Quoting futureshock:


Quoting MidwestMama55:

Sad that you are such a hater. A very, very, very tiny number of priests were involved in those horrible acts. There are more schoolteachers that molest children than Catholic priests. There are more Protestant ministers that molest children than Catholic priests. There are more parents that molest children than Catholic priests. But for those who hate religion, they just see what they want to see.


Quoting mehamil1:

Support marriage equality, don't get to eat Jesus. 

Molest children, get to eat Jesus. 

Yeah, makes perfect sense. 



The HUGE DIFFERENCE was the COVER UP which occurred at the HIGHEST LEVELS of the Church.



coolmommy2x
by Gold Member on Apr. 12, 2013 at 12:11 PM
How would the priest know what a congregant supports? Obviously a blog is public, if the person receiving Communion was wearing a pro-gay shirt I could understand.

I'm being serious. Our pastor doesn't know what we support.
Posted on CafeMom Mobile
mehamil1
by Platinum Member on Apr. 12, 2013 at 12:12 PM
1 mom liked this

They tried to kill the guy who first translated it from Latin into English. 

The springing up of the Protestant shin dig can be traced back directly to the Bible finally being translated into the language understood by the common people. People were like, wait a minute. This doesn't say what those assholes at the pulpit are saying...and then shit hit the fan and more people than ever were being murdered by the church. Control the information people get, and you control the people. Old as hell tactic. 

Quoting futureshock:
Quoting 12hellokitty:
Quoting SuperChicken:

The Catholic Church has always demanded 100% obedience and discouraged individuals from thinking for themselves.  How many centuries did it take for them to allow the Bible to be printed in a language other than Latin, so that only the priests could actually read what was in the Bible and therefore no one would know if they were lying?  

You may want to read about the history of the printing press.

You may want to read about the history of the Catholic church and how many people they KILLED for trying to allow people to read the bible for themselves

mehamil1
by Platinum Member on Apr. 12, 2013 at 12:14 PM

Not nice when people assume right? Say stuff you didn't say. Really frustrating right? I feel ya. 

Quoting MidwestMama55:

No one, including me, is saying that the cover up was ok. 

Quoting futureshock:
Quoting MidwestMama55:

Sad that you are such a hater. A very, very, very tiny number of priests were involved in those horrible acts. There are more schoolteachers that molest children than Catholic priests. There are more Protestant ministers that molest children than Catholic priests. There are more parents that molest children than Catholic priests. But for those who hate religion, they just see what they want to see.

Quoting mehamil1:

Support marriage equality, don't get to eat Jesus. 

Molest children, get to eat Jesus. 

Yeah, makes perfect sense. 

The HUGE DIFFERENCE was the COVER UP which occurred at the HIGHEST LEVELS of the Church.

Billiejeens
by Gold Member on Apr. 12, 2013 at 12:16 PM

 

This is why you seem "loonish" to me.

Do you understand what a religion is?

Quoting LucyMom08:

 So now they aren't even trying to hide the fact that they think you should have no personal opinions...wow...

 

 

mehamil1
by Platinum Member on Apr. 12, 2013 at 12:17 PM
1 mom liked this

You are focusing only on those who diddled the kids and not the backbone of the church that allowed it to happen and continue. They are just as guilty in my opinion. They knew about it and allowed it to continue. That reached to the highest levels of the church. They knowingly kept those priests around, knowing they were screwing with children. That makes them just as guilty and their numbers are far higher than you are saying. 

Quoting MidwestMama55:

To be clear, I am appalled, and believe those priests should be not only removed from their positions but put in jail. I do not agree with cases where shielding was done (there were many cases where they priests were not protected, too).  I am making NO excuses for what these men have done.

But trashing the Catholic church is also appalling. The vast, vast majority of priests are wonderful human beings who have devoted their lives to serving others, including the poorest and weakest humans among us. What I strongly object to is those who are so blinded by their hate that they are willing to trash and hate the 99,998 good ones because of the horrific acts of 2. 

Quoting pansyprincess:

 But why should it matter the number?  The church shielded and protected these priests and allowed them to remain in the church and receive the Eucharist.  As a Catholic, you should be appalled by this, not making excuses for it.

Do you believe a pedophile deserves communion, but a person that supports love doesn't?  Are you really that backwards?

Quoting MidwestMama55:

Sad that you are such a hater. A very, very, very tiny number of priests were involved in those horrible acts. There are more schoolteachers that molest children than Catholic priests. There are more Protestant ministers that molest children than Catholic priests. There are more parents that molest children than Catholic priests. But for those who hate religion, they just see what they want to see.

Quoting mehamil1:

Support marriage equality, don't get to eat Jesus. 

Molest children, get to eat Jesus. 

Yeah, makes perfect sense.

chloedee
by Bronze Member on Apr. 12, 2013 at 12:18 PM
3 moms liked this

So do divorced people who have remarried. Are they, and anyone who supported their weddings by attending, being denied Communion?

Quoting MidwestMama55:

Untrue.  Having premarital sex is considered a sin in the Catholic church. But one can repent, endeavor to sin no more, ad be forgiven. Gay marriage is different as the participants are not remorseful, and continue to sin by living in that state daily.


Quoting futureshock:


Quoting MidwestMama55:

Makes sense to me.  If you support gay marriage, you are not a Catholic and should not be receiving Holy Communion. Find a "Joe Bob's" church to be a part of.

Also, if you had a child out of wedlock you are not a Catholic, if you had premarital sex, etc., etc., etc., etc.





Add your quick reply below:
You must be a member to reply to this post.
Join the Meeting Place for Moms!
Talk to other moms, share advice, and have fun!

(minimum 6 characters)