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Gun control: President Obama’s biggest loss

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Never before had President Barack Obama put the moral force and political muscle of his presidency behind an issue quite this big — and lost quite this badly. The president, shaken to the core by the massacre of 26 innocents at Sandy Hook Elementary School, broke his own informal “Obama Rule” — of never leaning into an issue without a clear path to victory — first by pushing for a massive gun control package no one expected to pass, and then sticking through it even as he retrenched to a relatively modest bipartisan bill mandating national background checks on gun purchases. Continue Reading Text Size - + reset Obama: 'Shameful day in Washington' Why Obama, Congress can't do all Latest on POLITICO Playbook: TIME 100 Rove to Sebelius: 'Nice try' Clinton lauds Boston 'volunteerism' High hopes for energy bill Shuster's road to big money 'Medical mecca' Boston was ready It was a bitter defeat for a president accustomed to winning, a second-term downer that may — or may not — foreshadow the slow decline suffered by so many of his predecessors. Obama seems to have the public behind him, but it illustrated his less-than-Johnsonian powers of personal persuasion, the possible shortcomings of his decision to wait a month after the killings to present a plan and above all the limits of his go-to “outside” strategy of taking his case directly to the American people. (Also on POLITICO: Obama laments "shameful day") More than anything, it was an emotional blow to Obama, who was as irritated at the four members of his own party as he was at the 90 percent of Republicans who defeated the bill. One administration official told POLITICO the White House was especially disappointed with Sen. Heidi Heitkamp (D-N.D), the only dissenting Democrat not up for re-election next year, who refused to go along with the bill even after White House chief of staff Denis McDonough visited her office to make Obama’s case on Tuesday. (Also on POLITICO: Gun bill hits brick wall in Senate) Still, officials believed Heitkamp would have flipped if they had gotten closer to the 60 votes they needed. “The president was tremendously committed and emotionally engaged. I watched the president with these families. He was there for them and really felt it,” said Sen. Richard Blumenthal, a Connecticut Democrat who worked closely with the White House in the aftermath of the worst school shooting in the history of his state. (Also on POLITICO: Senate gun control roll call vote: Senators who bucked their party) “Background checks will happen,” he added, minutes after the vote. “This outcome is a delay, not a defeat.” Added Sen. Barbara Boxer (D-Calif.): “I never saw a president fight so hard, a vice president, never on any issue… It shows us the cowardice of the Senate.” In the end, however, moderates and conservatives in the upper chamber said they simply couldn’t deal with a flurry of progressive issues at once — from gay marriage to immigration to guns. The other three Democratic “no” votes — Max Baucus of Montana, Mark Pryor of Arkansas and Mark Begich of Alaska — were never really in play, sources familiar with the situation told POLITICO. Read more: http://www.politico.com/story/2013/04/gun-control-vote-obamas-biggest-loss-90244.html#ixzz2QoSQy6UN
by on Apr. 18, 2013 at 7:19 AM
Replies (31-40):
talia-mom
by Gold Member on Apr. 18, 2013 at 8:59 AM
3 moms liked this


Yet asking people for id to vote makes the left whine and scream and cry.

Quoting Donnah118:

I am not really seeing what the issue is. if you want to own a gun you submit to a mandatory extensive background check. What is the big deal here? Makes sense to me.



Billiejeens
by Gold Member on Apr. 18, 2013 at 9:02 AM
2 moms liked this

Today in the Senate, a funny thing happened.

We fought on principle, and we won on principle. You know why?

Because 3 U.S. Senators didn't listen to the "do something" caucus and the hand-wringers parading as leaders in Washington. Instead, Senators Cruz, Lee and Paul circulated a warning prior to the last recess saying they would (gasp) filibuster any legislation that would undermine our God-given, fundamental right to bear arms. It just so happens that this God-given right is enshrined in the Constitution.

We have a play book, ladies and gentleman: fight and win.

Thankfully these fresh faces in the Senate get it.

You know who else gets it? The Gun Owners of America. From the beginning, GOA was standing up tall to defend the Second Amendment on principle - not in a game of political gamesmanship and endorsements of Democrats. They were crystal clear the whole time and led other groups, some of whom get more attention and prominence in the debate, in their direction.

Heritage Action for America also gets a lot of credit for moral clarity and fearlessness at the very beginning of the debate. Their willingness to stand with Senators Cruz, Lee, and Paul at the very beginning helped tremendously.

Today, in Britain, Lady Thatcher's devotion to public service and dedication to liberty was celebrated... not that anyone in the Obama administration noticed. The Prime Minister was tenacious and knew how to fight. She would often say "First you win the argument, then you win the vote." Not particularly difficult to say - but sure seems difficult for most politicians to carry out.

But kudos to Senators Cruz, Lee and Paul for being willing to provide leadership where there has been none.

Now - on to Immigration.

 
 
Donnah118
by on Apr. 18, 2013 at 9:02 AM
1 mom liked this

They can have mine. To be honest, I have never been asked.

Quoting talia-mom:


Yet asking people for id to vote makes the left whine and scream and cry.

Quoting Donnah118:

I am not really seeing what the issue is. if you want to own a gun you submit to a mandatory extensive background check. What is the big deal here? Makes sense to me.




lizzielouaf
by Gold Member on Apr. 18, 2013 at 9:07 AM
I find sick humor in the people calling Obama a petulant child for his reaction are in this thread pulling the nah nah nee boo boo reaction to the law's defeat.
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meriana
by Platinum Member on Apr. 18, 2013 at 9:08 AM
There should be background checks at the gun shows and for internet purchases of weapons. As far as a ban on certain types of weapons, we had such a ban for something like 10 years, it expired, and nobody went around taking people's guns away during that time. I agree more needs to be done concerning mental health but the fact still remains that one cannot force people into treatment who don't believe they need it. Kind of like an alcoholic, unless they admit they are an alcoholic and need help, all the treatment in the world does no good. Just as an alcoholic who does not see him/herself as an alcoholic, there are those who are mentally ill who do not see themselves as mentally ill and in need of help.
lga1965
by on Apr. 18, 2013 at 9:08 AM
I insist on appropriate and civilzed discussion here. Obviously you and a few others do not understand that concept.

Quoting candlegal:

Are you serious?  Call 1 800 Wah Wah and grow up

Quoting lga1965:

Religious sect ? I'm not religious .

I'm not pushing my views at all but clearly YOU are ...on me...in an inappropriate,harsh manner when you tell me to go away.




Quoting Billiejeens:




Sawry, I forget your capability for discourse sometimes, my bad.



Rephrased - you are in the 4% (that is very small the whole would be 100%) of people that are for additional gun control. You are like a small religious sect trying to push your views onto the rest of us.



While you are welcome and even encouraged to stay and participate in the discussion, I am asking you to not continually push your religious sect views on us.



Quoting lga1965:

So you are saying that if my opinion is different from yours that I have to go away ?
Isn't this a Forum where everyone is allowed to have their own opinions ?
Is it appropriate for you to tell me I have to go away .....and I didn't even address my comment to you personally ?
It really is not fair, not socially acceptable .




Quoting Billiejeens:











Quoting lga1965:




 “This outcome is a delay, not a defeat.” Added Sen. Barbara Boxer (D-Calif.): “I never saw a president fight so hard, a vice president, never on any issue… It shows us the cowardice of the Senate.” In the end, however, moderates and conservatives in the upper chamber said they simply couldn’t deal with a flurry of progressive issues at once — from gay marriage to immigration to guns. The other three Democratic “no” votes — Max Baucus of Montana, Mark Pryor of Arkansas and Mark Begich of Alaska — were never really in play, sources familiar with the situation told POLITICO.




****************




This is true. It's not over yet. My state senators were with the President and I am proud of them. Those of us who care about people more than guns will continue to believe that gun control will become a reality.




4%, you are in the 4% of the country that thinks additional gun control is important - go away.












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LuvmyAiden
by Silver Member on Apr. 18, 2013 at 9:09 AM
3 moms liked this

He was clearly MORE upset about this loss than about any of the recent tragedies where people lost thier lives. That should speak volumes. More upset about his agenda being derailed than dead Americans. And I would love to hear how he feels that the progun side lied. Shedding light on the fine print that the libs don't want the public to see is NOT lying, it is a public service! I find it hilarious how he acts like a spoiled child instead of the leader of the free world. Pathetic. For many of us it was a HUGE victory. Our tireless efforts were heard and rewarded. We will not be quiet though. We know this is not over but enjoying the moment hs been great for sure.

talia-mom
by Gold Member on Apr. 18, 2013 at 9:10 AM
1 mom liked this

Yada Yada Yada and your constant attacks and insults towards some people are appropriate and civilized?

Maybe you need vocabulary lessons as well as punctuation lessons.


Quoting lga1965:

I insist on appropriate and civilzed discussion here. Obviously you and a few others do not understand that concept.

Quoting candlegal:

Are you serious?  Call 1 800 Wah Wah and grow up

Quoting lga1965:

Religious sect ? I'm not religious .

I'm not pushing my views at all but clearly YOU are ...on me...in an inappropriate,harsh manner when you tell me to go away.




Quoting Billiejeens:




Sawry, I forget your capability for discourse sometimes, my bad.



Rephrased - you are in the 4% (that is very small the whole would be 100%) of people that are for additional gun control. You are like a small religious sect trying to push your views onto the rest of us.



While you are welcome and even encouraged to stay and participate in the discussion, I am asking you to not continually push your religious sect views on us.



Quoting lga1965:

So you are saying that if my opinion is different from yours that I have to go away ?
Isn't this a Forum where everyone is allowed to have their own opinions ?
Is it appropriate for you to tell me I have to go away .....and I didn't even address my comment to you personally ?
It really is not fair, not socially acceptable .




Quoting Billiejeens:











Quoting lga1965:




 “This outcome is a delay, not a defeat.” Added Sen. Barbara Boxer (D-Calif.): “I never saw a president fight so hard, a vice president, never on any issue… It shows us the cowardice of the Senate.” In the end, however, moderates and conservatives in the upper chamber said they simply couldn’t deal with a flurry of progressive issues at once — from gay marriage to immigration to guns. The other three Democratic “no” votes — Max Baucus of Montana, Mark Pryor of Arkansas and Mark Begich of Alaska — were never really in play, sources familiar with the situation told POLITICO.




****************




This is true. It's not over yet. My state senators were with the President and I am proud of them. Those of us who care about people more than guns will continue to believe that gun control will become a reality.




4%, you are in the 4% of the country that thinks additional gun control is important - go away.














LuvmyAiden
by Silver Member on Apr. 18, 2013 at 9:20 AM
2 moms liked this
THIS statement is why the gun lobby is improtant and why folks like me who spread truth are important. There ARE background checks at gun shows and on the internet. An internet sale MUST be shipped to an FFL dealer and a check must be done BEFORE you can pick up your gun that was shipped to that dealer. The law is clear there. You CANNOT ship a gun to an address that is not a licensed dealer. PERIOD! EVERY ffl dealer MUST run a check on EVERY sale, gun shows or in their store. The ONLY sales that happen without a check are those done privately between folks without an ffl. And those who do the selling can be held liable if they sell to someone who hurts someone so there is deterrent there. Laws that would make it illegal to leave a gun to someone in your will are ridiculous and that is what ceasing private transfer will do. The issue with this particular bill was that it clearly leads to registration. Universal background checks are essentially registration in the first place. The last awb did NOT work by the way so while it didn't lead to large scale confiscation it also failed to do anything good or lower crime and the expiration actually saw crime continue to decline. What it did was affect an industry that puts a huge amount of money into our economy. Not a win win for anyone in this country by any measure.
Quoting meriana:

There should be background checks at the gun shows and for internet purchases of weapons. As far as a ban on certain types of weapons, we had such a ban for something like 10 years, it expired, and nobody went around taking people's guns away during that time. I agree more needs to be done concerning mental health but the fact still remains that one cannot force people into treatment who don't believe they need it. Kind of like an alcoholic, unless they admit they are an alcoholic and need help, all the treatment in the world does no good. Just as an alcoholic who does not see him/herself as an alcoholic, there are those who are mentally ill who do not see themselves as mentally ill and in need of help.

kaylamom2004
by Bronze Member on Apr. 18, 2013 at 9:26 AM
1 mom liked this

Exactly! It's not the LAW-ABIDING CITIZENS that are causing the problems! 


Quoting Britty1987:

 

Exactly!  How many laws did the Newtown shooter break?  I don't think one more would've made a difference in his choice. 

Quoting kaylamom2004:

Gun control is NOT the issue.

If they want to fix the problem, concentrate on mental health!

 

 


 

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