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Venezuela considers banning baby bottle feeding

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Venezuela considers banning baby bottle feeding

The Venezuela congress is to discuss legislation next week that would prohibit bottle feeding of infants in an attempt to encourage breast feeding and reduce the use of baby formula.

A new mother bottlefeeding her baby
A new mother bottlefeeding her baby Photo: Alamy

Odalis Monzon, from Venezuela's ruling Socialist party, said the proposal would "prohibit all types of baby bottles" as a way to improve children's health.

"We want to increase the love (between mother and child) because this has been lost as a result of these transnational companies selling formula," Ms Monzon said.

She said the Law for the Promotion and Support for Breast-Feeding, passed in 2007, did not establish any sanctions for using formula. However, she did not say what the sanctions might be if the proposed change to prohibit bottle feeding is passed by Congress, where the Socialist Party has a majority.

She said, however, that exceptions would be allowed, such as in the case of the death of a mother, or for women with limited breast milk production, as determined by the health ministry.

Such legislation would likely raise the ire of opposition sympathisers who say the government of the late President Hugo Chavez excessively extended the reach of the state into the lives of private citizens.

"People are free to feed their children as they see fit," said Ingrid Rivero, a 27-year-old mother in Caracas. "My daughter stopped breast feeding after seven months. What can I do? Force her?"

Chavez ally Nicolas Maduro, who was elected in April after his mentor's death from cancer, has vowed to extend his predecessor's 14-year self-styled revolution that enjoyed strong support among the country's poor.

by on Jun. 17, 2013 at 7:57 AM
Replies (81-85):
Mommabearbergh
by Gold Member on Jun. 18, 2013 at 9:21 PM
I live in mass and you quoted me why?Nothing about my post comes across as a breastfeeding nazi.


Quoting DropZoneMom:

Don't know where you live, but when I was pregnant with my kids, breastfeeding was SHOVED down my throat as the ONLY way to feed kids.   When I had almost ZERO production, the "lactation consultant" told me I was a horrible mother & must have done something to cause it (despite the fact that I was pumping then feeding EVERY TWO HOURS AROUND THE CLOCK to try & stimulate production).

I fucking HATE the breastfeeding NAZIS.



Quoting Mommabearbergh:

Well I don't think there should be a ban but breast feeding should be promoted more. People should be made aware of what's in formula and make a informed decision because not everyone reads the back of the formula cans. I also think if they are going to do something so drastic they need to figure out a way where men won't sexual a women's breast if she has to nurse in publuc





Aestas
by Gold Member on Jun. 18, 2013 at 9:41 PM


Quoting Healthystart30:

Quoting Aestas:




I BF and then FF my daughter when she was little, and my son got some formula couple of times as well. I honestly don't judge women that FF, that would be pretty hypocritical of me. I just think it would be best to educate women instead of banning formula. Some formulas are better then others for example. Here in the US we should educate mothers about what to look for in formula. Some have HFCS and GMO's, refined sugar, and the list goes on. That way we could pressure for better formula for babies.
And every drop of Bm counts, especially in the beginning for immune support. If we set women on the path that they have to Bf for a year or else, it's not very helpful. And yes good support system is the best, especilly for new mothers.
I should have made my answer more detailed at the beginning and not thrown out a one sentence reply, that came of so bitchy.

Nah, you didn't come off bitchy. I was just sharing my thoughts. I agree with the above, though.

Lizardannie1966
by on Jun. 18, 2013 at 10:16 PM
1 mom liked this

And I totally agree with you here, too. :)

I don't believe that people who support bans on an individual's choice realize that once we do this, it can very easily open doors for other "freedom to choose" bans, as well.

Where does it end? When do we stop allowing government and society to rule on personal choices like this?

What happen to the respect of choice?

Quoting Aestas:

I agree that it's never a good idea to legislate women's choices with regards to their own bodies. It sets a dangerous precedent and could very easily lead to other legislation you don't agree with, even if you agree with this particular idea.

Quoting Lizardannie1966:

It really isn't necessary to generalize, particularly when it comes to labeling a country as "backward." People tend to get defensive as would anyone from any country were their country labeled as such.

No, formula was not invented for use in emergencies. There was a time in society when bottle feeding with formula or milk was far more acceptable to those silly rule makers in society who often feels it is their place to say "yay" or "nay" on private choices an individual makes.

It was not only the rich women choosing not to breast-feed. I believe you're forgetting several decades in the last century when formula/milk bottle feeding became more the norm. My own Mom and HER mom were part of those decades.

How could you have been "forced" into doing something you didn't want to? I am not following and I am curious.

I don't believe anyone would try to change your opinion but being that this is a debate group, they might argue it.

The bottom-line--putting a ban on personal choices such as this should be something any one of us should not wish to see happen. We keep applauding bans like this (and because they support our personal opinions about something that is ultimately none of our business), we may find that other bans will follow, some of which might impact our own private choices.



SewingMamaLele
by Leanne on Jun. 19, 2013 at 12:55 PM

Well, that's a new one!   I haven't heard that particular term yet, but good to know.   The only info I could find on it was in regards to determining risk factors for it.    Which... would be to help identify those mothers who are at risk and get them specialized help right away.   That's great, it's exactly what we should be doing.

Yes, those studies suggest what a researcher thinks will happen based upon current rates.   Exact science?   No... good visualization tool?  Yes.   Hearing "slight decreased risk" and seeing 5000 cases per year could potentially be prevented have much different impacts.  

I was saying that the bottle culture caused women to be shunned.   If not for the 50+ years of chronic bottle use, nursing would have come along at the same rate as everything else in society.   It hasn't been a major part of society, so many people still have antiquated views.   We've come along in leeps and bounds in the last 10-15 years or so, IMO.   The more time and exposure, the more acceptance there will be.

I'm sorry to hear you had such a rough time.   Is your son doing better?

Taking someone who has preconcieved notions about breastfeeding and forcing them to do it against their will could cause issues, yes.   You are correct.   I was saying that biologically, being "forced" to nurse our young as nature designed should not cause issues since women have been "forced" to nurse for thousands of years.  The issues are a social contruct.   Laws won't change that attitude overnight, but hopefully with time society can change the misinformation and remove the stigma.

I agree that options should not be removed.  We need to fix the way the medical communtiy manages nursing relationships.   That will make the biggest impact on breastfeeding rates.  JIMO!

Quoting stormcris:

It's SIBB (suboptimal infant breastfeeding behavior)not sids and is responsible for 1 million deaths per year. The breastfeeding side uses this to denote why people should EBF for x amount of time ect. People take the results and do all sorts of things with it. (subnote: It is recommended breastfeeding mothers be evaluated at 72 and 96 hours to help with this now but it is not implemented really) It is also the most common used case with many of the problems you mentioned. It is also used for the bottle side for the same reasons. Split it in half and we can both share it. (exasperated sigh)

Theoretically stave off? It suggests what a lab thinks will happen. The improvement in peer reviewed studies show it is only at 1.5-2 years of breastfeeding and only because the menstrual cycles are decreased. Information should not be discounted, however, and it is nevertheless something to consider. The direct cause in higher breast cancer cases cannot be directly linked to any one thing so we should take in that this might help and weight it against all the other factors. With things such as cancer, you sort of have a score card. Oh on this note ladies, please note that your husband or father can develop breast cancer and should be looking for lumps as well. Had to make that a bit bigger just in hopes it helps someone.

Having to hide is not about people thinking you should just shove in a bottle. In fact, many people who will tell you to cover up would be also bash you for using a bottle. Despite this not being sexual, people treat all breast related things as sexual.  If they did away with all bottles tomorrow people would still expect women to cover up, because they are not comfortable with the human body. Much of the 'you should cover up' comes from other women. However, it really doesn't matter to me what caused it or when; it needs to be fixed. This goes for the lack of dicussion about sex, pregnancy, and all other factors that we have this vow of silence that still lingers.

My son was immune deficient and had a lot of issues with his digestive tract, GERD, bowel issues and so forth. He was born allergic basically. But, no, I would not produce milk because my daughter was first and breastfeeding was the selected method of feeding and I did not even produce colostrum. This may have been a SIBB issue caused by emergency C-section (her heart kept stopping from a very long labor).

You can not agree as you want about it causing a rift but if a person is abhorrent to breastfeeding, forcing them to do so will cause a rift. The child will pick up on these negative emotions and that is one set of issues. There are many thousands of stories/posts across the web about mothers resenting their children due to breastfeeding and that is another set of issues. I think this is another area where we need to make it ok to be able to say I just cannot take this or I hate this. 

I think breastfeeding is great I just think we should not have our options removed. However, when it comes to the idea that we need new formula and better options for formula, better information about breastfeeding, more comfort with breastfeeding; I definitely think that should be as well.

Quoting SewingMamaLele:

I assume SIBB was supposed to be SIDS?   It's not the only cause of infant death that is increased when baby is not breastfed.   Acute infection is also a major risk factor.   In one study it was estimated that about 900 US infants could be saved if breastfeeding rates were at 90%.   Clearly, that's just a general estimation... but it brings the statistics to life.    None of this is meant to shame women, but I am just not one to ignore or hide facts to prevent hurt feelings.   It's important to know the risks to A. Make an informed decision and B. Try to reduce the risks as much as possible.   None of us make the "best" decision 100% of the time, there are many reasons we make different decisions and that's OK!    But knowing the risks and being aware of how to better protect against them is good for everyone!

For cancer (and other mom related health issues), a study just came out this month stating:

If new moms adhered to the recommended guidelines that urge them to breast-feed each child they give birth to for at least one year, they could theoretically stave off up to 5,000 cases of breast cancer, about 54,000 cases of hypertension and nearly 14,000 heart attacks annually.

Brings light to what a "slightly decreased risk" actually looks like in real numbers.  Again, information is king (queen?) here... if we don't share and spread this information, how are mothers supposed to make informed decisions for themselves?  
 
With both of these, we're talking statistical risk.   Chances are that not breastfeeding will not lead to your childs death, or you developing cancer, etc... but that doesn't mean we should discount this info or NOT work towards higher breastfeeding rates.



Even during times when breastfeeding was not discussed in polite society, I can assure you that it WAS discussed between mothers, aunts, sisters and midwives.  Women who had done it and been through it shared their knowledge from one generation to another.  The disconnect occured when most women stopped breastfeeding and had no experience or knowledge to offer their daughters/granddaughters, etc....  (although, it may not have been as under wraps as we think. http://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/article-2340465/Bizarre-pictures-reveal-unlikely-trend-photographs-breastfeeding-mothers-Victorian-era-America.html).

Being shunned or expected to hide in public has more to do with people feeling like mom should "just put it in a bottle".   Our society has come so far when it comes to being open about our bodies, etc... but breastfeeding lags behind because it was not prevelant until the last 20 years or so.   More exposure=more acceptance.

Chances are (unless he had some metobolic disorder?), your son would not have been allergic to your milk, it would have been something in your diet.   How that has happened is another topic entirely, so I won't go there... but, not getting engorged after birth also doesn't mean anything.   For some women, they make milk after birth no matter what.  For others, they need nipple stimulation to stimulate production.   Chances are you would have produced milk just fine if you had needed/wanted to.  


Like we already discussed, I don't agree with this law because I don't agree with governments abusing their power.   BUT, I also don't agree that having to nurse would cause a rift between mother and child (outside of mom having emotional issues, Possibly severe D-MER, etc...)  For thousands of years women were forced to breastfeed if they wanted their infant to survive.   In all of that time, breastfeeding was never known to be the cause of a mother rejecting her child in any sort of mass frequency.   Breastfeeding was designed to bring mother and baby closer together.  Sometimes it did, sometimes it was a chore just like any other... sometimes I'm sure some women hated it just like any other chore.   That's OK.   You don't have to love it to do it... I don't love cleaning toilets, but they gotta get done somehow!  :)  

Basically, It was not some awful punishment that nature forced us to nurse our young.   A lot of the issues that people have with nursing are purely societal.  

ETA:  I also wanted to add that I think that there are many perfectly valid reasons mothers choose not to breastfeed.   Be it emotional, physical with her or baby, etc... I think that it is FABULOUS that we have alternatives available and hope they continue to improve upon them.   I personally focus more on helping moms meet their own personal goals (which, many moms do not), and hope that as time passes and society changes, more and more mothers will want to nurse their babies and they will have the support system around them that our ancestors enjoyed that will help them to be successful and meet their own goals.
Quoting stormcris:

I saw where you said you didn't agree with this law. I am about to lay out a lot of stuff and it really is just more of me being chatty than particularly directed :) I am just elaborating on some stuff you said and some other stuff, not really going against what you said because this coin really does have two sides and I can see both.

SIBB has caused a lot of infant deaths and some over zealous breast feeders shame women. However, the hide requirement was people with the need to control via morals. It started well before bottles were ever invented.  

I just really think it should be the woman's option and people should back off in all cases.

Breastfeeding only slightly lowers cancer if continued for 1.5 to 2 years and only if it lowers the total number of menstrual periods. So technically those who have more children would do even better. Yet, I am not going to promote that people should have more kids.

The generational and knowledge support system broke back when we transitioned to a society that refuses to talk about anything related to the sex organs. But there is hope for this last if we make a trend toward a more progressive point of view that sex and bodies should be discussed. I mean really, how sad is it that a 10 year old died because he did not feel safe telling his parents about a lump on his testicles. But, I digress.

As you can probably tell I bottle fed my kids. My son would have most likely been allergic to my milk in some form had I ever had any. But, my milk never came in and I ever experienced that swelling or needed my boobs bound. That will cause some jealousy apparently from some women which is weird in itself.

If people want to breastfeed then do so. I can see where forcing women to breastfeed could cause a rift in the relationship between mother and child and that could be a whole new set of problems.

Quoting SewingMamaLele:

Formula and the bottlefeeding culture has set women back more than i think most people understand. Its broken the generational knowledge and support system. Its made women doubt their own bodies... It's caused breast and ovarian cancer rates to increase, and more infant death (and subsequent parental heartache) than should happen in todays society. It's caused women to be shunned and expected to hide in order to simply nourish her child.

I don't agree with a law like what we are discussing, but just wanted to point out that bottles and formula have done plenty of damage to women.


Quoting stormcris:

Great set women back 100 years and belittle them. Are you going to do this by making formula prescription? How very sad. 





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stormcris
by Christy on Jun. 19, 2013 at 12:58 PM

Yes, my son is doing much better thank you for asking.

I can really get on board with the bottle and shunning a little better now. I failed to look at it from where would could be with the ideas of breastfeeding. 

I really like what you had to say here.

Quoting SewingMamaLele:

Well, that's a new one!   I haven't heard that particular term yet, but good to know.   The only info I could find on it was in regards to determining risk factors for it.    Which... would be to help identify those mothers who are at risk and get them specialized help right away.   That's great, it's exactly what we should be doing.

Yes, those studies suggest what a researcher thinks will happen based upon current rates.   Exact science?   No... good visualization tool?  Yes.   Hearing "slight decreased risk" and seeing 5000 cases per year could potentially be prevented have much different impacts.  

I was saying that the bottle culture caused women to be shunned.   If not for the 50+ years of chronic bottle use, nursing would have come along at the same rate as everything else in society.   It hasn't been a major part of society, so many people still have antiquated views.   We've come along in leeps and bounds in the last 10-15 years or so, IMO.   The more time and exposure, the more acceptance there will be.

I'm sorry to hear you had such a rough time.   Is your son doing better?

Taking someone who has preconcieved notions about breastfeeding and forcing them to do it against their will could cause issues, yes.   You are correct.   I was saying that biologically, being "forced" to nurse our young as nature designed should not cause issues since women have been "forced" to nurse for thousands of years.  The issues are a social contruct.   Laws won't change that attitude overnight, but hopefully with time society can change the misinformation and remove the stigma.

I agree that options should not be removed.  We need to fix the way the medical communtiy manages nursing relationships.   That will make the biggest impact on breastfeeding rates.  JIMO!

Quoting stormcris:

It's SIBB (suboptimal infant breastfeeding behavior)not sids and is responsible for 1 million deaths per year. The breastfeeding side uses this to denote why people should EBF for x amount of time ect. People take the results and do all sorts of things with it. (subnote: It is recommended breastfeeding mothers be evaluated at 72 and 96 hours to help with this now but it is not implemented really) It is also the most common used case with many of the problems you mentioned. It is also used for the bottle side for the same reasons. Split it in half and we can both share it. (exasperated sigh)

Theoretically stave off? It suggests what a lab thinks will happen. The improvement in peer reviewed studies show it is only at 1.5-2 years of breastfeeding and only because the menstrual cycles are decreased. Information should not be discounted, however, and it is nevertheless something to consider. The direct cause in higher breast cancer cases cannot be directly linked to any one thing so we should take in that this might help and weight it against all the other factors. With things such as cancer, you sort of have a score card. Oh on this note ladies, please note that your husband or father can develop breast cancer and should be looking for lumps as well. Had to make that a bit bigger just in hopes it helps someone.

Having to hide is not about people thinking you should just shove in a bottle. In fact, many people who will tell you to cover up would be also bash you for using a bottle. Despite this not being sexual, people treat all breast related things as sexual.  If they did away with all bottles tomorrow people would still expect women to cover up, because they are not comfortable with the human body. Much of the 'you should cover up' comes from other women. However, it really doesn't matter to me what caused it or when; it needs to be fixed. This goes for the lack of dicussion about sex, pregnancy, and all other factors that we have this vow of silence that still lingers.

My son was immune deficient and had a lot of issues with his digestive tract, GERD, bowel issues and so forth. He was born allergic basically. But, no, I would not produce milk because my daughter was first and breastfeeding was the selected method of feeding and I did not even produce colostrum. This may have been a SIBB issue caused by emergency C-section (her heart kept stopping from a very long labor).

You can not agree as you want about it causing a rift but if a person is abhorrent to breastfeeding, forcing them to do so will cause a rift. The child will pick up on these negative emotions and that is one set of issues. There are many thousands of stories/posts across the web about mothers resenting their children due to breastfeeding and that is another set of issues. I think this is another area where we need to make it ok to be able to say I just cannot take this or I hate this. 

I think breastfeeding is great I just think we should not have our options removed. However, when it comes to the idea that we need new formula and better options for formula, better information about breastfeeding, more comfort with breastfeeding; I definitely think that should be as well.


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