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Who is being discriminated against exactly?

Posted by on Jun. 27, 2013 at 1:46 PM
  • 125 Replies
5 moms liked this

Here in Texas they are wanting to make it so that you have to show a photo ID to vote.  I have been hearing a lot of people complaining about this saying that it is discrimination and that it will disenfranchise voters...that it is a ploy of some kind to keep people from voting.

I don't get it.

How is proving that you are a citizen of this country discriminating?   You have to show ID for all sorts of things...cashing checks..taking a flight...why is it so horrible to show ID to vote.  Seems like voting is a process where everyone would want to make sure that only people entitled to vote are doing so.

If you don't have an ID and need to get one, I cant see how doing that is asking too much.  Elections are not a surprise last minute event.  We all know when they are going to happen and they are planned well in advance...so you should have plenty of time to get one.  If you have to arrange for travel or  take time off work, there is plenty of time to do that....unless you wait until the last moment, and that is still not the governments fault.

  If you are so poor that it is a burden to go and get an ID, I wonder how those same people managed to sign up for food stamps, medicare or public housing.  I am sure they didn't consider it a burden to go to those offices and wait in line and fill out forms.  This is not a referendum on PA.  I am merely pointing out that getting an ID is not any more burdensome that any other ways many people have to deal with the government.   Most people will find the time for what is important to them.  Voting is important.

I honestly cant see how showing ID and proving who you are when you vote is discriminatory to anyone other than people who have no business voting in the first place: people who are not citizens or those attempting voting fraud by voting multiple times or voting as a deceased person.  Yeah...that actually does happen.  I want every person who is a legal citizen of this country to be able to vote and take part in the political process.  It is one of our dearest rights.  But I just cannot see how checking ID is keeping someone from voting or discriminating against them.

So...can anyone help me to understand why there is such a fuss about a voter ID law?  Who exactly is being discriminated against?


by on Jun. 27, 2013 at 1:46 PM
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Replies (1-10):
jllcali
by LoyalAndCute on Jun. 27, 2013 at 1:56 PM
4 moms liked this
Showing a driver's license or state ID is not proof of citizenship. You do not need to be a citizen to obtain either. Making a law intended to prove eligibility to vote by requiring either of those is pointless and a waste of taxpayer's money. I am not surprised Texas would make this pointless legislation to appease those who want something done, even though it is useless.

Do YOU have a passport?

Do YOU carry around your birth certificate to prove citizenship?
ruth85
by Member on Jun. 27, 2013 at 2:01 PM
Yes I have a passport. No I dont carry my birth certificate around because it has not been asked of me. I see what you are saying about ID not proving citizenship. That is a very good point. But I still dont see how asking for an ID to vote prevents someone from voting or discriminates against someone. Do you think it does? In what way?
Quoting jllcali:

Showing a driver's license or state ID is not proof of citizenship. You do not need to be a citizen to obtain either. Making a law intended to prove eligibility to vote by requiring either of those is pointless and a waste of taxpayer's money. I am not surprised Texas would make this pointless legislation to appease those who want something done, even though it is useless.

Do YOU have a passport?

Do YOU carry around your birth certificate to prove citizenship?

jllcali
by LoyalAndCute on Jun. 27, 2013 at 2:13 PM
I think it's a waste to knowingly pass legislation that won't actually accomplish what it's stated purpose is.

Getting a passport is kind of a pain in the ass and expensive, requiring people show one to vote would only make it that much worse. That would make it discriminatory against the working class that don't have the luxury of taking off work to deal with passport crap that can only be done at specific times. The passport office would be severely overwhelmed trying to cope with the millions of people who would need to get a passport just to vote.


Quoting ruth85:

Yes I have a passport. No I dont carry my birth certificate around because it has not been asked of me.

I see what you are saying about ID not proving citizenship. That is a very good point. But I still dont see how asking for an ID to vote prevents someone from voting or discriminates against someone. Do you think it does? In what way?







Quoting jllcali:

Showing a driver's license or state ID is not proof of citizenship. You do not need to be a citizen to obtain either. Making a law intended to prove eligibility to vote by requiring either of those is pointless and a waste of taxpayer's money. I am not surprised Texas would make this pointless legislation to appease those who want something done, even though it is useless.



Do YOU have a passport?



Do YOU carry around your birth certificate to prove citizenship?


ruth85
by Member on Jun. 27, 2013 at 2:22 PM
1 mom liked this

I see what you are saying...but it is my understanding that they just want people to show a photo ID...either a drivers license or a photo ID card....not have a passport.

Getting a photo ID card is pretty straightforward and doesnt involve the same things as a passport at all...the worst part is just standing in line at the office.  And...while I can see it would be inconvenient to someone to have to do that, it is also inconvenient to stand in line at a polling place and people do that...it is inconvenient to wait outside Walmart on black friday to get a good deal on a tv...but people do that.  There are all sorts of government processes that are inconvenient...but we dont abolish those.

If the real argument is that requiring a photo ID wouldnt DO anything...that there would still be illegal aliens voting...I can see making that argument.  It is a very valid point.  But what I am hearing in the media is the discrimination/disenfranchisement.  And I dont see that...which is why I made the post...I wanted to see if someone else had another perspective I hadn't considered.  


Quoting jllcali:

I think it's a waste to knowingly pass legislation that won't actually accomplish what it's stated purpose is.

Getting a passport is kind of a pain in the ass and expensive, requiring people show one to vote would only make it that much worse. That would make it discriminatory against the working class that don't have the luxury of taking off work to deal with passport crap that can only be done at specific times. The passport office would be severely overwhelmed trying to cope with the millions of people who would need to get a passport just to vote.


Quoting ruth85:

Yes I have a passport. No I dont carry my birth certificate around because it has not been asked of me.

I see what you are saying about ID not proving citizenship. That is a very good point. But I still dont see how asking for an ID to vote prevents someone from voting or discriminates against someone. Do you think it does? In what way?







Quoting jllcali:

Showing a driver's license or state ID is not proof of citizenship. You do not need to be a citizen to obtain either. Making a law intended to prove eligibility to vote by requiring either of those is pointless and a waste of taxpayer's money. I am not surprised Texas would make this pointless legislation to appease those who want something done, even though it is useless.



Do YOU have a passport?



Do YOU carry around your birth certificate to prove citizenship?




GLWerth
by Gina on Jun. 27, 2013 at 2:30 PM
8 moms liked this

A lot of people don't drive and thus don't have a driver's license.

A state ID is usually only available at a DMV office. Most DMV offices are only accessible by car. Generally, they are outside of town and not serviced by bus routes.

A passport is expensive and time-consuming to get.

Students often do not have a state ID of the state they are going to school in, but rather, use their driver's license from their home state. Most states that have these bills specifically say that student ID's are not allowed.

And finally, voting is a right and a responsibility. We should not set up barriers to voting for partisan purposes. This is exactly what is happening and it is the purpose of these laws, to keep eligible voters who will probably not vote for Republicans, from voting.

Also, I'd add that when one registers to vote, in most states, you need to show identification. Once you are registered, you should be able to vote. Period.

And don't bring in the in-person vote fraud canard. It doesn't happen in large numbers. It barely EVER happens. Certainly, it is not common enough to knowingly disenfranchise voters.

snookyfritz
by Gold Member on Jun. 27, 2013 at 2:33 PM

It's not warranted.  Voter fraud is rare and some people are poor and live rurally.

tnmomofive
by Bronze Member on Jun. 27, 2013 at 2:39 PM

IDK about other states but here to get a photo ID you have to present your BC.

MamiJaAyla
by Member on Jun. 27, 2013 at 2:40 PM
1 mom liked this

my understanding of the rule and people's issue with it was not that they were requiring id to vote (quite a few states do) but that they were requiring that people show their birth certifacte and/or other proof of citizenship etc. to REGISTER to vote.

Thereby ... nullifying anybodies ability to have a voting drive etc. cause who walks around with their b.c. in their pocket. 

I could be wrong b/c there were so many stories on the news yesterday but I think this was the issue with the law that Texas had passed it was an extra requirement ABOVE the federal one and the court said nope, voting is a federal thing and the feds set the rules of what you needed to do to register.

Has NOTHING to do with showing Id to vote, its with having to show b.c. etc. to REGISTER.

jllcali
by LoyalAndCute on Jun. 27, 2013 at 2:41 PM
A passport is a way to show ID that proves citizenship. A driver license or state ID does not prove citizenship or eligibility to vote. A law that purports to require proof of citizenship or eligibility to vote, yet states one must show a DL or state ID to vote does not actually do a damn thing to prove citizenship or eligibility to vote.

Requiring a passport to vote would prove citizenship, but not eligibility to vote. The passport process would be a financial and logistical hindrance to many people. It would be disenfranchising many many people from the voting process.


Quoting ruth85:

I see what you are saying...but it is my understanding that they just want people to show a photo ID...either a drivers license or a photo ID card....not have a passport.

Getting a photo ID card is pretty straightforward and doesnt involve the same things as a passport at all...the worst part is just standing in line at the office.  And...while I can see it would be inconvenient to someone to have to do that, it is also inconvenient to stand in line at a polling place and people do that...it is inconvenient to wait outside Walmart on black friday to get a good deal on a tv...but people do that.  There are all sorts of government processes that are inconvenient...but we dont abolish those.

If the real argument is that requiring a photo ID wouldnt DO anything...that there would still be illegal aliens voting...I can see making that argument.  It is a very valid point.  But what I am hearing in the media is the discrimination/disenfranchisement.  And I dont see that...which is why I made the post...I wanted to see if someone else had another perspective I hadn't considered.  



Quoting jllcali:

I think it's a waste to knowingly pass legislation that won't actually accomplish what it's stated purpose is.



Getting a passport is kind of a pain in the ass and expensive, requiring people show one to vote would only make it that much worse. That would make it discriminatory against the working class that don't have the luxury of taking off work to deal with passport crap that can only be done at specific times. The passport office would be severely overwhelmed trying to cope with the millions of people who would need to get a passport just to vote.




Quoting ruth85:

Yes I have a passport. No I dont carry my birth certificate around because it has not been asked of me.



I see what you are saying about ID not proving citizenship. That is a very good point. But I still dont see how asking for an ID to vote prevents someone from voting or discriminates against someone. Do you think it does? In what way?














Quoting jllcali:

Showing a driver's license or state ID is not proof of citizenship. You do not need to be a citizen to obtain either. Making a law intended to prove eligibility to vote by requiring either of those is pointless and a waste of taxpayer's money. I am not surprised Texas would make this pointless legislation to appease those who want something done, even though it is useless.





Do YOU have a passport?





Do YOU carry around your birth certificate to prove citizenship?






tnmomofive
by Bronze Member on Jun. 27, 2013 at 2:43 PM
3 moms liked this

A id does in my state ..you cannot get a regular photo id without presenting your bc or proof of citzenship at the dmv.So if one has a gov issued id they have proven themselves to be citz already.

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