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S/O Richard Dawkins' attack on Islamic Creationism is long overdue

Posted by on Jul. 13, 2013 at 8:17 AM
  • 35 Replies

In the thread it was suggested that the US was the only nation allowing Intelligent Design type teachings to be taught as science.  



Now that Richard Dawkins has said it, perhaps chattering Islingtonians will take note: Muslim parents are importing crude Creationism into our schools on an unprecedented scale.


Richard Dawkins believes the Government needs to do more

"Teachers are bending over backwards to respect home prejudices that children have been brought up with," says Dawkins. "The Government could do more, but it doesn't want to because it is fanatical about multiculturalism and the need to respect the different traditions from which these children come."


I've drawn attention to this fact in my book Counterknowledge, but it's like banging your head against a brick wall: liberal folk – and that includes quite a few Cameron Tories – aren't interested in fighting Creationism unless it's promulgated by cheesy US-style Christian evangelicals.


More than 90 per cent of Muslims worldwide, according to impeccable research, reject the science of evolution out of hand. Indeed, Islamic Creationists in Turkey are funding a huge campaign to important bogus "altases of Creation" into European schools.


Here's an extract from Counterknowledge dealing with the BAV, fanatical anti-Darwinists from Turkey:


"No one is quite sure why this movement should have sprung up in Turkey, officially a secular state, and no one has publicly identified the source of the BAV's very substantial funds. BAV has organised Creationist conferences in over 100 Turkish cities and towns; by 2006 it had opened more than 80 'museums' of Creationism in restaurants, shopping malls and city halls across the country, featuring portraits of Charles Darwin framed in dripping blood.


"According to a Reuters report in 2006, Turkish Creationism 'has an influence US Creationists could only dream of': pious Muslims in the government have managed to cut back the time allotted for the discussion of evolution in biology classes, reducing it to the status of a contested 19th-century theory; in a survey of public acceptance of evolution in 34 countries, Turkey – which is pushing hard to join the EU – came last."


Don't get me wrong: Christian Creationism is bogus science and deplorable. But Islamic Creationism is bogus science that it's "culturally inappropriate" to criticise. Which is more dangerous, do you think? 


by on Jul. 13, 2013 at 8:17 AM
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Replies (1-10):
Sekirei
by Nari Trickster on Jul. 13, 2013 at 9:00 AM

Both... both extremist views are dangerous, only, culturally inappropriate is completely different from  religiously inappropriate. Culturally inappropriate is meaning only the area that sort of thinking sits in. It does not mean the religion itself does not allow it. 

However, even when questioned politely (I used to... ) some people from both groups get pissy

romalove
by Roma on Jul. 13, 2013 at 9:25 AM
4 moms liked this

I gotta say, 123hellokitty, your obsession with Islam is disturbing.

Having said that, what I can tell from this article is that this isn't happening in America.

In America, I want NO creationism or ID taught in a public school science class because it is not science and does not belong.  I don't care what religious belief it stems from.


LoveMyBoyK
by Ruby Member on Jul. 13, 2013 at 9:34 AM
6 moms liked this
Ok. But other countries are not our concern. This country is. And quite frankly, shame on Christians who are outraged that Turkish Muslims are inserting creation in public schools as they, in the same breath, insist their own should share public school science classes across the US.
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stacymomof2
by Ruby Member on Jul. 13, 2013 at 9:47 AM
2 moms liked this

Big Dawkins fan, are you?

So you agree that it is ridiculous to teach creationism in schools?

MommyMitchy247
by Member on Jul. 13, 2013 at 9:51 AM

I grew up in a household that was VERY loose on Religion.

When I think back on it, its actually quite silly.

My parents are Persian, and they are like total Stereotypical LA Persians.

They drink like nobody's business, they party with friends every weekend, they smoke hookah by our pool, and they will wear black everywhere if you will let them. My mom STILL, to this day, wears little black dresses to parties.

Yet they both pray 5 times a day and Fast during Ramadan. 

They NEVER pushed the religion on me or my siblings. Ever.

My parents taught my siblings and I about the theories of many old Persian philosophers, alchemists and scientists.

In fact, when our teacher in school taught us about Intelligent Design instead of Evolution, my dad came down to the school to file a formal complaint.

I don't think I would call that Extremism or Bigotry at all.


mehamil1
by Platinum Member on Jul. 13, 2013 at 9:59 AM

I have followed Dawkins for a few years now. He's critical of ALL religions and has been critical of Islam for years. So I don't know what this whole "overdue" thing is. 

He's a brilliant scientist but he says some disturbing things about religion. 

Neal DeGrasse Tyson keeps it to "just keep it out of my science class" - that's all I've ever heard/read him state about religion. 

When I first heard about Dawkins being a "pitbull" I was expecting some blustering guy. Instead he's short and soft spoken. It's his writing style that is abrasive. 

mehamil1
by Platinum Member on Jul. 13, 2013 at 10:08 AM

I've come across a lot of Muslims like that. Mostly Bosnian Muslims. 

Quoting MommyMitchy247:

I grew up in a household that was VERY loose on Religion.

When I think back on it, its actually quite silly.

My parents are Persian, and they are like total Stereotypical LA Persians.

They drink like nobody's business, they party with friends every weekend, they smoke hookah by our pool, and they will wear black everywhere if you will let them. My mom STILL, to this day, wears little black dresses to parties.

Yet they both pray 5 times a day and Fast during Ramadan. 

They NEVER pushed the religion on me or my siblings. Ever.

My parents taught my siblings and I about the theories of many old Persian philosophers, alchemists and scientists.

In fact, when our teacher in school taught us about Intelligent Design instead of Evolution, my dad came down to the school to file a formal complaint.

I don't think I would call that Extremism or Bigotry at all.

Ms.Chrln
by on Jul. 13, 2013 at 10:12 AM
I'm not anti-religion, but one thing I do like about Dawkins is he doesn't pick on just one. I agree with him on somethings. I do not think any creationism should be taught in schools.
momtoscott
by Platinum Member on Jul. 13, 2013 at 11:53 AM
2 moms liked this

So ... he opposes Muslim creationism as well as Christian creationism being substituted for science in science class, and this is something to criticize? I find your view of Dawkins as a stand-in for every atheist weird.  Atheists don't have a chief cat-herder.    

Your continuing vilification of Muslims, while crying Christian persecution in multiple posts on this board, is disturbing and in bad taste.    

Clairwil
by Ruby Member on Jul. 13, 2013 at 12:12 PM
Quoting 12hellokitty:

Now that Richard Dawkins has said it,

A quote from your link:


"The Government – particularly under Tony Blair – thinks it is wonderful to have children brought up with their traditional religions. I call it brainwashing," he added.

"It seems as though teachers are terribly frightened of being thought racist. It's almost impossible to say anything against Islam in this country, because [if you do] you are accused of being racist or Islamophobic."

Prof Dawkins had recently finished a TV programme in which he went into a classroom of 15-year-olds at a secondary school in London.

"I was shocked by how some put up barriers to understanding," he said "I showed them the evidence, and they just said, 'This is what it says in my holy book.' And so I asked, 'If your holy book says one thing, but the evidence says something else, you then go with your holy book?' And they said, 'Yes.' And I said, 'Why?' And they said, 'It's the way we've been brought up'."

Prof Dawkins said the failure in classrooms meant religious fanatics had a chance to get hold.

"Because we are all brought up to respect faith, it leaves open a gap through which fanatics can charge," he said.

"I think we have all been brought up to give too much respect to religion, as opposed to any other kind of opinion."

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