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For those who feel church charities should/could replace welfare

Posted by on Aug. 27, 2013 at 12:22 AM
  • 177 Replies
1 mom liked this

How would that work, exactly? 

Would one need to be a member?

If not, what would be the eligibility criteria specifically (other than generic "need")?

what services/help would be provided and to who? ( other than the generic "whatever they need")

how would the church reach out to those in need? Would the needy need to come beg?

if so, would there be a standard for eligibility and services that all church charities would be forced to meet or would the needy person need to go begging at multiple churches to find a "fit" during their time of need?

could the church turn down someone asking for help if the church does not approve of them for any reason? Like a gay married couple in need? 

Im not wanting a bash post... I am just wondering how this would work exactly....

Not Without Panties

by on Aug. 27, 2013 at 12:22 AM
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Replies (1-10):
BethanyJ
by Member on Aug. 27, 2013 at 1:22 AM
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I think that churches replacing welfare/public assistance programs would be close to unconstitutional due to the separation of church and state mandates.  NO church should ever be in charge of deciding who they will and will not extend charity to.  There is far too much bias in organized religion and far too much "blame the victim for their circumstances" mentality.  I find that people who are heavily involved in organized religion tend to be very closed minded and frankly, ignorant; they are sometimes racist and sexist as well.  

With that said, I think public assistance should be streamlined and made more effective to encourage people to become independent of welfare.  That is NOT, however, a job for religion.  EVER!

glitterteaz
by Ruby Member on Aug. 27, 2013 at 1:36 AM
1 mom liked this

those programs exist now and they often are well intended but how exactly do you make a meal of hamburger helper and a can of tomatoes and dried pintos.  What I mean is it is all disjointed. You need hamburger, milk and margerine for the hamburger helper most the time they do not give you meals they give you the cheapest part of the meal and you just do not have the other ingredients. Often time the food is out of date and questionable to feed to children. Or they are just disgusting and sit cause they can not eat it or wont. It would be smarter to let the people select from items like so many per section so people get what they will actually use.  And yes, the needy do come to seek the help and do appreciate it but often the foods offered are crap from others pantries that the purchaser did not like or use themselves. 

turtle68
by Mahinaarangi on Aug. 27, 2013 at 1:54 AM

If charities had to house, clothe and feed the needy then they wouldnt be able to build more churches.

clothing and nick nacks are easily donated and given.  churches are like warehouses for things like that.

Food is usually out of date or end of line stuff donations...it cant be housed for long without costly storage.  More money out of the charity / church.

Here to access charities (food bank and discount at secondhand stores) you need to have a welfare card.  If there was no welfare then they would have to take it at face value that you need it.  discounts would no longer be available...so up goes the cost.

Frankly you would have to be able to beg....and then meet the criteria the church would of set out, but it would be up to the person servicing you or interviewing you for membership.  Not a great outcome for those who are needy but cant "show" it enough.

churches have long been places that help their own first.  I know when I was growing up you could attend Catholic church and have all your kids in the school for the cost of one child.  You could access their charitable food pantry bags and clothes just by being a member.

A church is a private organization...if they were to give out charity from their own pocket, then I see no reason why they cant make you conform to what they want from you in return.

If I was hungry cold and homeless.....I'd be the first to convert to religion.  How else do you think they got where they are now?  It would not surprise me if they want it to go where they are seen as the saviours.


muslimah
by on Aug. 27, 2013 at 2:02 AM
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 The Muslim community has always had this. It is usually through I.S.N.A. (Islamic Association of North America)

Every year each able Muslim is required to pay 2.5 % of their years earnings and savings.

Those who are in need of financial help whether it be an on going monthly check or a one time payment go to the imam and request a request a hearing. They then have a hearing before the bored where you state your case of hard ship. It is then voted on between the bored members and a decision is made.

Coming to a decision of the monthly amount depends on house hold expenses and size of family.

But I know of some sneaky people who have tried to take advantage. They go get well fare from the state and then go it from the mosque but they get caught because the mosque keeps track of every penny that goes out and to where it goes along with social security numbers and they report to the state that they are sending the a monthly check but some people are too stupid to realize that the mosque reports it and they get caught for cheating.

weirdkids
by Member on Aug. 27, 2013 at 2:20 AM

catholic charities seems to be more open to all walks of life. at least from my exeriance. a close friend of mine went through some rough times due to a bad choice in a roommate. she went through every avenue. her power was about to get shut off because the roommate said he was paying the bill and as it turns out he didnt pay it for almost 6 mo. she couldnt afford to pay it by the time she found out and was already behind on other bills trying to play catch up thanks to roommate. she had 3 small kids and one of them was under a year. she went and applied everywhere for assistance and the only people that would help were Catholic Cherities. i went with her for her appointment. it was interesting but not once overwhelming. the priest was very sweet. asked where our faith lied and we were honest with him. we told him we were pagan. unlike some christian denominations there was no "you are going to hell unless you give your heart to jesus, come get saved with us" (long story) hekinda got that interested look and started asking questions. we sat there an hour past the appointment time just chatting and comparing practices.

now one of the first places she tried was a baptist church. they were aweful. (** i mean no offence to anyone, it was just OUR experiance with the one particular church**) it started out normal. income check verifications, all that fun stuff. questions on what the money was for and what had happened to get that way etc. then it started. first was "well why doesnt your church help you?"so she told the woman that she and her family were pagan. the woman looked like her heart stopped. then the shit hit the fan. that woman went off on her for everything from going to hell for worshiping false gods to that she was going to hell for having children out of wedlock and they would go there too and it just got worse from there. at one point she even said that my friends children should be taken from her by families in the church so they could be saved from her wicked ways. my friend left hysterical. i was so in shock. i could not believe that someone who calls themselves christian could behave in such a manner. needless to say, they denied her the help.


LauraKW
by "Dude!" on Aug. 27, 2013 at 3:56 AM
Very interesting, I had no idea about any of that. Thank you for sharing.

Quoting muslimah:

 The Muslim community has always had this. It is usually through I.S.N.A. (Islamic Association of North America)


Every year each able Muslim is required to pay 2.5 % of their years earnings and savings.


Those who are in need of financial help whether it be an on going monthly check or a one time payment go to the imam and request a request a hearing. They then have a hearing before the bored where you state your case of hard ship. It is then voted on between the bored members and a decision is made.


Coming to a decision of the monthly amount depends on house hold expenses and size of family.


But I know of some sneaky people who have tried to take advantage. They go get well fare from the state and then go it from the mosque but they get caught because the mosque keeps track of every penny that goes out and to where it goes along with social security numbers and they report to the state that they are sending the a monthly check but some people are too stupid to realize that the mosque reports it and they get caught for cheating.

candlegal
by Judy on Aug. 27, 2013 at 6:31 AM
3 moms liked this

I would bet that it was the St. Vincent de Paul Society.  Most Catholic Churches have one and they will help anyone in the neighborhood.   You don't have to be Catholic.  They will help with your bills and give you food to feed your family.

Quoting weirdkids:

catholic charities seems to be more open to all walks of life. at least from my exeriance. a close friend of mine went through some rough times due to a bad choice in a roommate. she went through every avenue. her power was about to get shut off because the roommate said he was paying the bill and as it turns out he didnt pay it for almost 6 mo. she couldnt afford to pay it by the time she found out and was already behind on other bills trying to play catch up thanks to roommate. she had 3 small kids and one of them was under a year. she went and applied everywhere for assistance and the only people that would help were Catholic Cherities. i went with her for her appointment. it was interesting but not once overwhelming. the priest was very sweet. asked where our faith lied and we were honest with him. we told him we were pagan. unlike some christian denominations there was no "you are going to hell unless you give your heart to jesus, come get saved with us" (long story) hekinda got that interested look and started asking questions. we sat there an hour past the appointment time just chatting and comparing practices.

now one of the first places she tried was a baptist church. they were aweful. (** i mean no offence to anyone, it was just OUR experiance with the one particular church**) it started out normal. income check verifications, all that fun stuff. questions on what the money was for and what had happened to get that way etc. then it started. first was "well why doesnt your church help you?"so she told the woman that she and her family were pagan. the woman looked like her heart stopped. then the shit hit the fan. that woman went off on her for everything from going to hell for worshiping false gods to that she was going to hell for having children out of wedlock and they would go there too and it just got worse from there. at one point she even said that my friends children should be taken from her by families in the church so they could be saved from her wicked ways. my friend left hysterical. i was so in shock. i could not believe that someone who calls themselves christian could behave in such a manner. needless to say, they denied her the help.



billsfan1104
by Jules on Aug. 27, 2013 at 6:48 AM
2 moms liked this
Our church and all the churches in our town, gives to everyone. They do not ask if they are gay or single or anything. That is not the point of charity. The point of Charity is to help EVERYONE in need.
turtle68
by Mahinaarangi on Aug. 27, 2013 at 6:49 AM

did you have to show id and or financial status to the catholic church?  

Quoting weirdkids:

catholic charities seems to be more open to all walks of life. at least from my exeriance. a close friend of mine went through some rough times due to a bad choice in a roommate. she went through every avenue. her power was about to get shut off because the roommate said he was paying the bill and as it turns out he didnt pay it for almost 6 mo. she couldnt afford to pay it by the time she found out and was already behind on other bills trying to play catch up thanks to roommate. she had 3 small kids and one of them was under a year. she went and applied everywhere for assistance and the only people that would help were Catholic Cherities. i went with her for her appointment. it was interesting but not once overwhelming. the priest was very sweet. asked where our faith lied and we were honest with him. we told him we were pagan. unlike some christian denominations there was no "you are going to hell unless you give your heart to jesus, come get saved with us" (long story) hekinda got that interested look and started asking questions. we sat there an hour past the appointment time just chatting and comparing practices.

now one of the first places she tried was a baptist church. they were aweful. (** i mean no offence to anyone, it was just OUR experiance with the one particular church**) it started out normal. income check verifications, all that fun stuff. questions on what the money was for and what had happened to get that way etc. then it started. first was "well why doesnt your church help you?"so she told the woman that she and her family were pagan. the woman looked like her heart stopped. then the shit hit the fan. that woman went off on her for everything from going to hell for worshiping false gods to that she was going to hell for having children out of wedlock and they would go there too and it just got worse from there. at one point she even said that my friends children should be taken from her by families in the church so they could be saved from her wicked ways. my friend left hysterical. i was so in shock. i could not believe that someone who calls themselves christian could behave in such a manner. needless to say, they denied her the help.



NWP
by guerrilla girl on Aug. 27, 2013 at 7:15 AM
Ok how does that process work exactly? Can you cover the points asked in the op? Also do people need to come beg?

Quoting billsfan1104:

Our church and all the churches in our town, gives to everyone. They do not ask if they are gay or single or anything. That is not the point of charity. The point of Charity is to help EVERYONE in need.
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