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I'm Coming Out. . .As Pro-Vaccine

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(Like the author, I generally have refrained from the vax topic in my social media circles, largely because I know we're all just trying to do the right thing as parents.  But I really like what this author had to say.)
 
 

I know. Some mom coming out in favor of vaccines shouldn't be breaking news. There's nothing edgy about siding with most parents, nearly all the world's governments and the vast majority of medical researchers and practitioners. But more of us need to do it.

When I see debates about vaccines online -- and as someone who writes about parenting culture I see a lot -- I used to pat myself on the back for not getting mixed up in the fray. I mean, what's it to me what other people do with their kids? I'm secure in my own choices. Besides, even if I wanted to change the minds of anti-vaccine advocates, how could I?

I have two reasons for rethinking my silence: Jack and Clio. I came to know both children through their mothers' blogs and have been following along with their diagnosis and treatment for leukemia. Their illnesses prevent them from receiving live vaccines such as the MMR (measles, mumps and rubella) shot. Some kids get diagnosed before they have a chance to receive all of their vaccines, but even kids who were vaccinated, as Jack and Clio were, remain vulnerable to contagious diseases because of their compromised immune systems. The idea that they could be exposed to a vaccine-preventable disease while they are enduring treatment is troubling.

You might be thinking, "No worries, because those kids are protected by herd immunity." Well, so many parents are foregoing vaccines now, quite often in progressive communities like the ones in which Jack and Clio live, that herd immunity is threatened. In California, where I live, there is a database of vaccine rates listed by school. There are pockets where the vaccine rates are dipping below 50 percent. For herd immunity to be effective, vaccination rates need to be at least in the ballpark of 80 percent.

There seems to be two main types of parents who are skipping routine immunization for their healthy children: the ultra-crunchy and the ultra-conservative (plus a third group that I'll address later). The two camps of "ultras" might not seem to have a lot in common, but they're buying their doomsday rations from the same catalog, if you catch my drift. Both groups often have intense distrust of modern medicine and the government. (And not for nothing, as it often feels like the United States government is actively searching for ways to intensify the paranoia of its citizens. I mean, WTH with that NSA stuff?)

However, while there is nothing more "natural" than large numbers of children dying in a Malthusian cesspool of unchecked contagious disease, I'm going to go out on a limb and say that we should avoid that. This shouldn't be a controversial opinion. The increasing success of the anti-vaccine movement is endangering not only immune-compromised children such as Jack and Clio, but also infants too young to be vaccinated. To say nothing of the unvaccinated children themselves.

Some members of both camps of ultras subscribe to the idea that there is a "coordinated media blackout" to conceal the dangers of vaccines because "the exact same people who own the world's drug companies also own America's news outlets," as one recently viral article put it. Even if that were true, our alleged oligarchy doesn't own science and history. Science has repeatedly disproven a link between vaccines and autism. History has shown that vaccine-preventable diseases flourish where there is no herd immunity.

Being informed parents who research the recommendations of their pediatricians is one thing. Doctors aren't infallible. However, anti-vaccine advocates are asking parents to disavowing nearly the entire medical establishment and for much the same reason that cults cut off their followers from their families: If someone is to be convinced of something that cannot be supported legitimately, then legitimate sources must be discredited -- however clumsily.

Mayim Bialik, the sitcom actress and parenting activist, is part of the crunchy camp of vaccine deniers. As the spokesperson for the Holistic Moms Network, she's quite forthcoming with her opinions about co-sleeping and breastfeeding. However, she has mostly refused to comment on vaccines other than to say that she doesn't vaccinate her children. A wise choice, since if she were effective at convincing enough people not to vaccinate, herd immunity will be further compromised and her own unvaccinated darlings will be endangered.

This is the problem with not vaccinating: It's safe only as long as the majority does vaccinate. Enter the conservative camps of ultras. Recently, Eagle Mountain International Church in Newark, Texas, a megachurch where the pastor was critical of vaccines, suffered a measles outbreak so severe that the pastor reversed his stance and sent his followers post haste to the doctor to get some shots before the megachurch suffered an even more mega epidemic.

The ideas of anti-vaccine advocates have been allowed to spread because vaccinating parents tend to not be radicalized enough to bother with arguing with them. However, this tendency for vaccinating parents to stay out of the discussion is what's causing vaccination to lose its bandwagon appeal. Anti-vaxers are loud. The rest of us need to be loud too, because there's nothing crunchy about a resurgence of polio.

So I'm writing here not to the anti-vaccine activists, but to other people like me. People who vaccinated their children but avoid saying too much about it because it seems like it's hopeless or none of our business. Even if it feels like we'll never change the mind of anti-vaccine advocates -- and we might not -- we can do our best to head off new recruits to their movement. Vaccines are different from every other parenting issue in that the choices that parents make affect everyone else as well. Vaccines are everyone's business.

Remember that third camp of anti-vaccine advocates that I mentioned? Many of them are parents of children with autism who badly want an explanation for why their child is atypical. Science doesn't know why, except that the link between autism and vaccines has been repeatedly disproven. All parents -- myself included -- want to believe we can protect our children from everything, but we can't. We just friggin' can't.

Take Jack and Clio. Their parents did everything to keep their children safe and healthy, and yet their kids are battling leukemia. It's so unfair. But one thing that the rest of us can control is that Jack and Clio shouldn't have to encounter measles while treating their cancer because we -- the collective public -- can maintain herd immunity for them, for other immune-compromised people and infants too young to be vaccinated.

Anti-vaccine advocates are fond of telling people to "do the research." I have. I side with science. And I side with Jack and Clio.

For more by JJ Keith, click here.

 
 
by on Sep. 25, 2013 at 4:48 PM
Replies (91-100):
lga1965
by on Sep. 27, 2013 at 8:32 AM

 18 years of a vaccine isn't good enough for you? And where did you get your MD degree?

Quoting D-Town:

I do vaccinate. I said I don't do vaccines that have no long term studies or are just guessing games. You took issue with varicella. Even to include a link that proved my point about no long term studies and that it was a guessing game as why I should get it.

Quoting lga1965:

 I AM up to date. I said I get boosters. My kids do too.


We were based in Germany in 1980-82 when there was en epidemic of Mad Cow disease in England and because they sold beef to commissaries in Germany and we bought meat from them, we can't give blood. EVERYONE who was in Germany and shopped at the commissary theoretically has Mad Cow disease in their body even though we haven't actually had the disease,and we can't donate blood. Did you know that? LOL.


I don't understand why you are so sure that nobody gets boosters?And why you don't understand that we are so thankful for vaccines ?  You will regret this someday of someone in your family gets one of those diseases. There are signs polio might return too but then crunchy Moms think only people in slums with no sanitation get polio. LOL. SO far from the truth. In the 50's, before the polio vaccine, some of our friends in our wealthy suburb in MN got polio, one in an iron lung because of paralyzed diaphragm muscles , a few who still need crutches, and there was an epidemic even though we were all exceptionally clean and well fed.


It would be nice if you all had MD degrees so you would have a little credibility but you don't .


Good luck. That is all I have to say.


Quoting D-Town:

But the problem is if you get the vaccine in kindergarten, come graduation you are no longer immune. You contracted the disease naturally so your immunity is lifelong. The vaccines aren't. Follow a few links from the CDC link you posted you'll find they are reporting an increase in adults contracting varicella. So chickenpox is now slowly becoming an adult disease instead of a childhood one because most adults don't get their boosters.


Part of being responsible in telling people to get vaccines is to give them 100% of the information needs to make informed decisions. Not telling people they need boosters for the rest of their lives is irresponsible. Not telling them that the immunity wears off is irresponsible.


Are you able to give blood? If you say yes you're irresponsible about your vaccines. You are not up to date yourself. If you are up to date then you can't give blood. If you aren't up to date then why should anyone listen to someone who doesn't take their own advice.



Quoting lga1965:


 



Quoting romalove:






Quoting D-Town:



 That vaccine hasn't been out for 20 years yet.



 



None of the vaccines we give our kids provides lifelong immunity. Including Varicella. The problem with varicella is that, because there haven't been any long term studies, no one can agree on how long the vaccine provides immunity. For most of the diseases we're vaccinated against, adults have a better chance of coping and surviving contracting a disease. Right now, most whooping cough cases are adults (who were vaccinated as children) who don't even realize they have it.



 



Varicella is unique among most childhood disease we are vaccinated against because it is actually worse to get it as an adult than it is as a child. Complications are increased when contracted as an adult than with children. Since the vaccine has not even been out long enough for anyone to have reached adulthood, there is nothing to say what will happen to those vaccinated when they become adults. Since no vaccine thus far (for any disease) has been able to provide lifelong immunity, it is highly unlikely that varicella will.



 



So essentially, without long term studies (meaning that those vaccinated need to reach adulthood) getting vaccinated for varicella may be more dangerous than actually contracting the disease.



Quoting lga1965:



 



Quoting D-Town:

We selectively vaccinate. We don't do vaccines that have not had any (published) long term studies. We don't do vaccines that are just "guesses" either. That means no varicella. No gardisil. And no flu shots. Everything else we've done.


 http://www.cdc.gov/vaccines/vpd-vac/varicella/





Varicella (chickenpox) is a highly contagious disease that is very uncomfortable and sometimes serious. The chickenpox vaccine is the best protection against chickenpox. The vaccine is made from weakened varicella virus that produces an immune response in your body that protects you against chickenpox. The chickenpox vaccine was licensed for use in the United States in 1995. Since then, the vaccine has become widely used. Thanks to the chickenpox vaccine, the number of people who get chickenpox each year as well as hospitalizations and deaths from chickenpox have gone down dramatically in the United States.



http://pediatrics.aappublications.org/content/early/2013/03/27/peds.2012-3303.abstract



BACKGROUND:Varicella vaccine was licensed in the United States in 1995 for individuals ≥12 months of age. A second dose was recommended in the United States in June 2006. Varicella incidence and vaccine effectiveness were assessed in a 14-year prospective study conducted at Kaiser Permanente Northern California.





METHODS:A total of 7585 children vaccinated with varicella vaccine in their second year of life in 1995 were followed up prospectively for breakthrough varicella and herpes zoster (HZ) through 2009. A total of 2826 of these children received a second dose in 2006–2009. Incidences of varicella and HZ were estimated and compared with prevaccine era rates.





RESULTS:In this cohort of vaccinated children, the average incidence of varicella was 15.9 per 1000 person-years, nine- to tenfold lower than in the prevaccine era. Vaccine effectiveness at the end of the study period was 90%, with no indication of waning over time. Most cases of varicella were mild and occurred early after vaccination. No child developed varicella after a second dose. HZ cases were mild, and rates were lower in the cohort of vaccinated children than in unvaccinated children during the prevaccine era (relative risk: 0.61 [95% confidence interval: 0.43–0.89]).





CONCLUSIONS:This study confirmed that varicella vaccine is effective at preventing chicken pox, with no waning noted over a 14-year period. One dose provided excellent protection against moderate to severe disease, and most cases occurred shortly after the cohort was vaccinated. The study data also suggest that varicella vaccination may reduce the risks of HZ in vaccinated children.



 



 



What I made bigger.



Same thing for mumps.  It can leave you sterile, especially men.



 Yes, I got mumps when I was 34 , caught it from other kids and my kids and I was so sick . ( This was before the vaccine )My kids got over it well...I was a wreck for weeks. My aunt had chicken pox in her 50's and had to be hospitalized.



I got Shingles in 1995 because I had chicken pox as a kid in 1949. A grade school friend had chicken pox and ended up with brain damage.



Adults have a rough time if they get childhood diseases.



I have had boosters. My kids too.Doctors ask and keep records of all of your past immunizations. If you have a family Doctor or see any Doctor on a regular basis , you do get boosters. (UNLESS, you have some kind of irrational fear of them.)



I wonder where all the misinformation comes from?



I am so pro vaccinating.


 

 

stringtheory
by Gold Member on Sep. 27, 2013 at 8:38 AM
Where did you hear you can't give blood if you're up to date on boosters? I'm active duty military, which is extremely adamant about vaccines being up to date and regularly donated blood until I got pregnant. Alot of military members donate blood and I can bet most are up to date on vaccines.

Quoting D-Town:

But the problem is if you get the vaccine in kindergarten, come graduation you are no longer immune. You contracted the disease naturally so your immunity is lifelong. The vaccines aren't. Follow a few links from the CDC link you posted you'll find they are reporting an increase in adults contracting varicella. So chickenpox is now slowly becoming an adult disease instead of a childhood one because most adults don't get their boosters.





Part of being responsible in telling people to get vaccines is to give them 100% of the information needs to make informed decisions. Not telling people they need boosters for the rest of their lives is irresponsible. Not telling them that the immunity wears off is irresponsible.





Are you able to give blood? If you say yes you're irresponsible about your vaccines. You are not up to date yourself. If you are up to date then you can't give blood. If you aren't up to date then why should anyone listen to someone who doesn't take their own advice.




Quoting lga1965:

 



Quoting romalove:






Quoting D-Town:



 That vaccine hasn't been out for 20 years yet.



 



None of the vaccines we give our kids provides lifelong immunity. Including Varicella. The problem with varicella is that, because there haven't been any long term studies, no one can agree on how long the vaccine provides immunity. For most of the diseases we're vaccinated against, adults have a better chance of coping and surviving contracting a disease. Right now, most whooping cough cases are adults (who were vaccinated as children) who don't even realize they have it.



 



Varicella is unique among most childhood disease we are vaccinated against because it is actually worse to get it as an adult than it is as a child. Complications are increased when contracted as an adult than with children. Since the vaccine has not even been out long enough for anyone to have reached adulthood, there is nothing to say what will happen to those vaccinated when they become adults. Since no vaccine thus far (for any disease) has been able to provide lifelong immunity, it is highly unlikely that varicella will.



 



So essentially, without long term studies (meaning that those vaccinated need to reach adulthood) getting vaccinated for varicella may be more dangerous than actually contracting the disease.



Quoting lga1965:



 



Quoting D-Town:

We selectively vaccinate. We don't do vaccines that have not had any (published) long term studies. We don't do vaccines that are just "guesses" either. That means no varicella. No gardisil. And no flu shots. Everything else we've done.


 http://www.cdc.gov/vaccines/vpd-vac/varicella/





Varicella (chickenpox) is a highly contagious disease that is very uncomfortable and sometimes serious. The chickenpox vaccine is the best protection against chickenpox. The vaccine is made from weakened varicella virus that produces an immune response in your body that protects you against chickenpox. The chickenpox vaccine was licensed for use in the United States in 1995. Since then, the vaccine has become widely used. Thanks to the chickenpox vaccine, the number of people who get chickenpox each year as well as hospitalizations and deaths from chickenpox have gone down dramatically in the United States.



http://pediatrics.aappublications.org/content/early/2013/03/27/peds.2012-3303.abstract



BACKGROUND: Varicella vaccine was licensed in the United States in 1995 for individuals ≥12 months of age. A second dose was recommended in the United States in June 2006. Varicella incidence and vaccine effectiveness were assessed in a 14-year prospective study conducted at Kaiser Permanente Northern California.





METHODS: A total of 7585 children vaccinated with varicella vaccine in their second year of life in 1995 were followed up prospectively for breakthrough varicella and herpes zoster (HZ) through 2009. A total of 2826 of these children received a second dose in 2006–2009. Incidences of varicella and HZ were estimated and compared with prevaccine era rates.





RESULTS: In this cohort of vaccinated children, the average incidence of varicella was 15.9 per 1000 person-years, nine- to tenfold lower than in the prevaccine era. Vaccine effectiveness at the end of the study period was 90%, with no indication of waning over time. Most cases of varicella were mild and occurred early after vaccination. No child developed varicella after a second dose. HZ cases were mild, and rates were lower in the cohort of vaccinated children than in unvaccinated children during the prevaccine era (relative risk: 0.61 [95% confidence interval: 0.43–0.89]).





CONCLUSIONS: This study confirmed that varicella vaccine is effective at preventing chicken pox, with no waning noted over a 14-year period. One dose provided excellent protection against moderate to severe disease, and most cases occurred shortly after the cohort was vaccinated. The study data also suggest that varicella vaccination may reduce the risks of HZ in vaccinated children.



 



 



What I made bigger.



Same thing for mumps.  It can leave you sterile, especially men.



 Yes, I got mumps when I was 34 , caught it from other kids and my kids and I was so sick . ( This was before the vaccine )My kids got over it well...I was a wreck for weeks. My aunt had chicken pox in her 50's and had to be hospitalized.



I got Shingles in 1995 because I had chicken pox as a kid in 1949. A grade school friend had chicken pox and ended up with brain damage.



Adults have a rough time if they get childhood diseases.



I have had boosters. My kids too.Doctors ask and keep records of all of your past immunizations. If you have a family Doctor or see any Doctor on a regular basis , you do get boosters. (UNLESS, you have some kind of irrational fear of them.)



I wonder where all the misinformation comes from?



I am so pro vaccinating.

prenatalRN
by Member on Sep. 27, 2013 at 8:47 AM
I think vaccines are the single greatest invention of humanity. They really are amazing. No more small pox and soon to be no more Polio. but I also believe no one should be forced to vaccinate either. The health care community needs to do a better job to reassure the public and to be louder than the false claims of the anti vaxers.
TruthSeeker.
by Milami on Sep. 27, 2013 at 9:07 AM
You are correct about the 4th group. I vaccinated faithfully until my son had a reaction. I am still very much Pro vaccine I'm just not Pro vaccine for my children.

Quoting DestinyHLewis:

Agh! I've seen this all over my FB and friends I've had since Jr. High are now arguing. I've stayed out of it, and will continue to do so there. It's not worth it. 

The one thing this author forgot to mention was children who had adverse reactions and that is why their parents choose to no longer expose them to harmful vaccines. It's not just the 3 groups she mentioned. 

meriana
by Platinum Member on Sep. 27, 2013 at 9:20 AM
1 mom liked this

 


Quoting TruthSeeker.:

I don't think people realize how many serious adverse reactions there are every year from vaccines including death.

Quoting meriana:

I always find it a bit funny when people talk about the anti-vax crowd being uninformed. Mostly because the majority of parents simply do whatever their Dr. tells them to do in that regard which makes them just as uninformed as they claim those who forego vaccination are. We're told the science supports vaccination, yet the science tends to ignore the reports of adverse reactions and that IMO is not good science. Personally I don't care whether a parent allows vaccination or not, it's their choice and should remain so. I did find the following interesting.


 


Here is the current body count in VAERs: Hepatitis B vaccine 50,275 reports –

979 deaths, DTaP vaccine (pertussis, diptheria, tetanus) 50,345 reports – 785 deaths, MMR vaccine 58,887 reports – 300 deaths, Gardasil vaccine 22,563 reports – 99 deaths

.


there have been 698 FDA Vaccine Adverse Event Reporting System (VAERS) reports related to MMR, MMRV (MMR plus varicella) and measles vaccines in 2011 including 4 deaths and 280 emergency room visits. 698 VAERS reports are almost six times more than the number of measles cases


http://www.whale.to/vaccines/vaers.html


Those numbers should be of concern, they should concern everyone, everyone should be asking WHY these things occur and demanding answers, because really even one child suffering a severe adverse reaction or death is just one child too many.

That's not really surprising though is it. I don't think many really even think about VAERS or if they do, they don't believe the information is legitimate. So often when someone relates a severe adverse reaction, what they say is labeled misinformation. If they question vaccines or have doubts concerning them, they are often labeled anti-vaccine, called fear mongers, told they don't understand science or asked if they have a medical degree. Unfortunatly all those who have reported a severe adverse reaction to VAERS, including death, DID trust the science and they allowed the injections because they were told and convinced it was in their child's best interests by someone WITH a medical degree.

Vaccines have been given a free pass. No matter what happens to a child, even if it happens very shortly after an injection, the vaccine is rarely looked at as a contributing cause, let alone the cause. When a death occurs and there is no obvious reason, it's labeled SIDS which is simply a blanket diagnosis for "we don't know", however they rarely if ever really look at whether or not the child recently received vaccinations, what they were for or how many were given. When the parents, all things being the same as they'd been every day of the child's life to that point, begin to question the vaccines given, they're told they're just looking for someone/thing to blame, the vaccines had nothing to do with it, if they speak out about what happened, they're told they are spreading misinformation and fear mongering, etc.

Science is supposed to look at everything from all sides, from all perspectives and include all possible outcomes. Yet where vaccines are concerned, VAERS reports are largely, if not completely ignored. There is very little if any research into why these adverse reactions occur. If science was doing it's job, they would be researching those things, they'd be trying to find out which vaccine is more likely to cause a severe reaction, under what circumstances, what biological makeup of a person is more likely to be intolerant of them, etc. right down to looking at the number given at once. Rather than ignoring severe adverse reactions, they'd be trying to find out why they occur and stop them, perhaps by making vaccines safer for everyone or maybe lowering the number given. When they claim that science, the evidence, etc. supports vaccines but they ignore any negative occurance, is that really good science? It is, after all, easy to say something is good, safe, etc. when the only data one is dealing with is all positive and the negative, such as VAERS reports are tossed out of the equation.

It's also very easy to say vaccines are safe, needed and everyone should allow vaccinations UNTIL it's your child that suffers that severe reaction or death. People do need to know that these things can and do happen. They need to question it and demand research be done to prevent it. That's the only way changes will be made which just may make vaccines a whole lot safer and far more effective for all.

 


 

D-Town
by Silver Member on Sep. 27, 2013 at 9:23 AM
No. It's not. And you didn't post a study that showed 18 years. It only covered 14. And even they couldn't tell with any certainty how often boosters should be administered and it point blank said that any long term benefits were just guesses. Which is my entire point.



Quoting lga1965:

 18 years of a vaccine isn't good enough for you? And where did you get your MD degree?


Quoting D-Town:

I do vaccinate. I said I don't do vaccines that have no long term studies or are just guessing games. You took issue with varicella. Even to include a link that proved my point about no long term studies and that it was a guessing game as why I should get it.


Quoting lga1965:


 I AM up to date. I said I get boosters. My kids do too.



We were based in Germany in 1980-82 when there was en epidemic of Mad Cow disease in England and because they sold beef to commissaries in Germany and we bought meat from them, we can't give blood. EVERYONE who was in Germany and shopped at the commissary theoretically has Mad Cow disease in their body even though we haven't actually had the disease,and we can't donate blood. Did you know that? LOL.



I don't understand why you are so sure that nobody gets boosters?And why you don't understand that we are so thankful for vaccines ?  You will regret this someday of someone in your family gets one of those diseases. There are signs polio might return too but then crunchy Moms think only people in slums with no sanitation get polio. LOL. SO far from the truth. In the 50's, before the polio vaccine, some of our friends in our wealthy suburb in MN got polio, one in an iron lung because of paralyzed diaphragm muscles , a few who still need crutches, and there was an epidemic even though we were all exceptionally clean and well fed.



It would be nice if you all had MD degrees so you would have a little credibility but you don't .



Good luck. That is all I have to say.



Quoting D-Town:

But the problem is if you get the vaccine in kindergarten, come graduation you are no longer immune. You contracted the disease naturally so your immunity is lifelong. The vaccines aren't. Follow a few links from the CDC link you posted you'll find they are reporting an increase in adults contracting varicella. So chickenpox is now slowly becoming an adult disease instead of a childhood one because most adults don't get their boosters.


Part of being responsible in telling people to get vaccines is to give them 100% of the information needs to make informed decisions. Not telling people they need boosters for the rest of their lives is irresponsible. Not telling them that the immunity wears off is irresponsible.


Are you able to give blood? If you say yes you're irresponsible about your vaccines. You are not up to date yourself. If you are up to date then you can't give blood. If you aren't up to date then why should anyone listen to someone who doesn't take their own advice.




Quoting lga1965:



 




Quoting romalove:








Quoting D-Town:




 That vaccine hasn't been out for 20 years yet.




 




None of the vaccines we give our kids provides lifelong immunity. Including Varicella. The problem with varicella is that, because there haven't been any long term studies, no one can agree on how long the vaccine provides immunity. For most of the diseases we're vaccinated against, adults have a better chance of coping and surviving contracting a disease. Right now, most whooping cough cases are adults (who were vaccinated as children) who don't even realize they have it.




 




Varicella is unique among most childhood disease we are vaccinated against because it is actually worse to get it as an adult than it is as a child. Complications are increased when contracted as an adult than with children. Since the vaccine has not even been out long enough for anyone to have reached adulthood, there is nothing to say what will happen to those vaccinated when they become adults. Since no vaccine thus far (for any disease) has been able to provide lifelong immunity, it is highly unlikely that varicella will.




 




So essentially, without long term studies (meaning that those vaccinated need to reach adulthood) getting vaccinated for varicella may be more dangerous than actually contracting the disease.




Quoting lga1965:




 




Quoting D-Town:

We selectively vaccinate. We don't do vaccines that have not had any (published) long term studies. We don't do vaccines that are just "guesses" either. That means no varicella. No gardisil. And no flu shots. Everything else we've done.



 http://www.cdc.gov/vaccines/vpd-vac/varicella/







Varicella (chickenpox) is a highly contagious disease that is very uncomfortable and sometimes serious. The chickenpox vaccine is the best protection against chickenpox. The vaccine is made from weakened varicella virus that produces an immune response in your body that protects you against chickenpox. The chickenpox vaccine was licensed for use in the United States in 1995. Since then, the vaccine has become widely used. Thanks to the chickenpox vaccine, the number of people who get chickenpox each year as well as hospitalizations and deaths from chickenpox have gone down dramatically in the United States.




http://pediatrics.aappublications.org/content/early/2013/03/27/peds.2012-3303.abstract




BACKGROUND:Varicella vaccine was licensed in the United States in 1995 for individuals ≥12 months of age. A second dose was recommended in the United States in June 2006. Varicella incidence and vaccine effectiveness were assessed in a 14-year prospective study conducted at Kaiser Permanente Northern California.







METHODS:A total of 7585 children vaccinated with varicella vaccine in their second year of life in 1995 were followed up prospectively for breakthrough varicella and herpes zoster (HZ) through 2009. A total of 2826 of these children received a second dose in 2006–2009. Incidences of varicella and HZ were estimated and compared with prevaccine era rates.







RESULTS:In this cohort of vaccinated children, the average incidence of varicella was 15.9 per 1000 person-years, nine- to tenfold lower than in the prevaccine era. Vaccine effectiveness at the end of the study period was 90%, with no indication of waning over time. Most cases of varicella were mild and occurred early after vaccination. No child developed varicella after a second dose. HZ cases were mild, and rates were lower in the cohort of vaccinated children than in unvaccinated children during the prevaccine era (relative risk: 0.61 [95% confidence interval: 0.43–0.89]).







CONCLUSIONS:This study confirmed that varicella vaccine is effective at preventing chicken pox, with no waning noted over a 14-year period. One dose provided excellent protection against moderate to severe disease, and most cases occurred shortly after the cohort was vaccinated. The study data also suggest that varicella vaccination may reduce the risks of HZ in vaccinated children.




 




 




What I made bigger.




Same thing for mumps.  It can leave you sterile, especially men.




 Yes, I got mumps when I was 34 , caught it from other kids and my kids and I was so sick . ( This was before the vaccine )My kids got over it well...I was a wreck for weeks. My aunt had chicken pox in her 50's and had to be hospitalized.




I got Shingles in 1995 because I had chicken pox as a kid in 1949. A grade school friend had chicken pox and ended up with brain damage.




Adults have a rough time if they get childhood diseases.




I have had boosters. My kids too.Doctors ask and keep records of all of your past immunizations. If you have a family Doctor or see any Doctor on a regular basis , you do get boosters. (UNLESS, you have some kind of irrational fear of them.)




I wonder where all the misinformation comes from?




I am so pro vaccinating.



 


 

D-Town
by Silver Member on Sep. 27, 2013 at 9:25 AM
If you are up to date on your hep B vaccine they will not use your blood. They cannot determine if the hep came from exposure or vaccination. If they actually took your blood while you were up to date you wasted it. It will not be used.

Quoting stringtheory:

Where did you hear you can't give blood if you're up to date on boosters? I'm active duty military, which is extremely adamant about vaccines being up to date and regularly donated blood until I got pregnant. Alot of military members donate blood and I can bet most are up to date on vaccines.



Quoting D-Town:

But the problem is if you get the vaccine in kindergarten, come graduation you are no longer immune. You contracted the disease naturally so your immunity is lifelong. The vaccines aren't. Follow a few links from the CDC link you posted you'll find they are reporting an increase in adults contracting varicella. So chickenpox is now slowly becoming an adult disease instead of a childhood one because most adults don't get their boosters.








Part of being responsible in telling people to get vaccines is to give them 100% of the information needs to make informed decisions. Not telling people they need boosters for the rest of their lives is irresponsible. Not telling them that the immunity wears off is irresponsible.








Are you able to give blood? If you say yes you're irresponsible about your vaccines. You are not up to date yourself. If you are up to date then you can't give blood. If you aren't up to date then why should anyone listen to someone who doesn't take their own advice.






Quoting lga1965:

 




Quoting romalove:








Quoting D-Town:




 That vaccine hasn't been out for 20 years yet.




 




None of the vaccines we give our kids provides lifelong immunity. Including Varicella. The problem with varicella is that, because there haven't been any long term studies, no one can agree on how long the vaccine provides immunity. For most of the diseases we're vaccinated against, adults have a better chance of coping and surviving contracting a disease. Right now, most whooping cough cases are adults (who were vaccinated as children) who don't even realize they have it.




 




Varicella is unique among most childhood disease we are vaccinated against because it is actually worse to get it as an adult than it is as a child. Complications are increased when contracted as an adult than with children. Since the vaccine has not even been out long enough for anyone to have reached adulthood, there is nothing to say what will happen to those vaccinated when they become adults. Since no vaccine thus far (for any disease) has been able to provide lifelong immunity, it is highly unlikely that varicella will.




 




So essentially, without long term studies (meaning that those vaccinated need to reach adulthood) getting vaccinated for varicella may be more dangerous than actually contracting the disease.




Quoting lga1965:




 




Quoting D-Town:

We selectively vaccinate. We don't do vaccines that have not had any (published) long term studies. We don't do vaccines that are just "guesses" either. That means no varicella. No gardisil. And no flu shots. Everything else we've done.



 http://www.cdc.gov/vaccines/vpd-vac/varicella/







Varicella (chickenpox) is a highly contagious disease that is very uncomfortable and sometimes serious. The chickenpox vaccine is the best protection against chickenpox. The vaccine is made from weakened varicella virus that produces an immune response in your body that protects you against chickenpox. The chickenpox vaccine was licensed for use in the United States in 1995. Since then, the vaccine has become widely used. Thanks to the chickenpox vaccine, the number of people who get chickenpox each year as well as hospitalizations and deaths from chickenpox have gone down dramatically in the United States.




http://pediatrics.aappublications.org/content/early/2013/03/27/peds.2012-3303.abstract




BACKGROUND: Varicella vaccine was licensed in the United States in 1995 for individuals ≥12 months of age. A second dose was recommended in the United States in June 2006. Varicella incidence and vaccine effectiveness were assessed in a 14-year prospective study conducted at Kaiser Permanente Northern California.







METHODS: A total of 7585 children vaccinated with varicella vaccine in their second year of life in 1995 were followed up prospectively for breakthrough varicella and herpes zoster (HZ) through 2009. A total of 2826 of these children received a second dose in 2006–2009. Incidences of varicella and HZ were estimated and compared with prevaccine era rates.







RESULTS: In this cohort of vaccinated children, the average incidence of varicella was 15.9 per 1000 person-years, nine- to tenfold lower than in the prevaccine era. Vaccine effectiveness at the end of the study period was 90%, with no indication of waning over time. Most cases of varicella were mild and occurred early after vaccination. No child developed varicella after a second dose. HZ cases were mild, and rates were lower in the cohort of vaccinated children than in unvaccinated children during the prevaccine era (relative risk: 0.61 [95% confidence interval: 0.43–0.89]).







CONCLUSIONS: This study confirmed that varicella vaccine is effective at preventing chicken pox, with no waning noted over a 14-year period. One dose provided excellent protection against moderate to severe disease, and most cases occurred shortly after the cohort was vaccinated. The study data also suggest that varicella vaccination may reduce the risks of HZ in vaccinated children.




 




 




What I made bigger.




Same thing for mumps.  It can leave you sterile, especially men.




 Yes, I got mumps when I was 34 , caught it from other kids and my kids and I was so sick . ( This was before the vaccine )My kids got over it well...I was a wreck for weeks. My aunt had chicken pox in her 50's and had to be hospitalized.




I got Shingles in 1995 because I had chicken pox as a kid in 1949. A grade school friend had chicken pox and ended up with brain damage.




Adults have a rough time if they get childhood diseases.




I have had boosters. My kids too.Doctors ask and keep records of all of your past immunizations. If you have a family Doctor or see any Doctor on a regular basis , you do get boosters. (UNLESS, you have some kind of irrational fear of them.)




I wonder where all the misinformation comes from?




I am so pro vaccinating.

stringtheory
by Gold Member on Sep. 27, 2013 at 9:36 AM
This is not true.
1) they have to notify you if you test positive for Hep B
2) there is a second antigen they test for if you test positive for the surface antigen that DOES differentiate between the virus and the vaccine.

I can assure you I and many of my shipmates are up to date, and our unit was notified that a blood donation drive done at our unit was utilized after the Boston marathon bombing - in other words, a group of military members with a high likelihood of being up to date was part of the blood bank used for transfusions for the victims. Maybe some blood banks dismiss due to limited testing capabilities, but like I said, notification would still be required.


Quoting D-Town:

If you are up to date on your hep B vaccine they will not use your blood. They cannot determine if the hep came from exposure or vaccination. If they actually took your blood while you were up to date you wasted it. It will not be used.



Quoting stringtheory:

Where did you hear you can't give blood if you're up to date on boosters? I'm active duty military, which is extremely adamant about vaccines being up to date and regularly donated blood until I got pregnant. Alot of military members donate blood and I can bet most are up to date on vaccines.





Quoting D-Town:

But the problem is if you get the vaccine in kindergarten, come graduation you are no longer immune. You contracted the disease naturally so your immunity is lifelong. The vaccines aren't. Follow a few links from the CDC link you posted you'll find they are reporting an increase in adults contracting varicella. So chickenpox is now slowly becoming an adult disease instead of a childhood one because most adults don't get their boosters.











Part of being responsible in telling people to get vaccines is to give them 100% of the information needs to make informed decisions. Not telling people they need boosters for the rest of their lives is irresponsible. Not telling them that the immunity wears off is irresponsible.











Are you able to give blood? If you say yes you're irresponsible about your vaccines. You are not up to date yourself. If you are up to date then you can't give blood. If you aren't up to date then why should anyone listen to someone who doesn't take their own advice.








Quoting lga1965:

 





Quoting romalove:










Quoting D-Town:





 That vaccine hasn't been out for 20 years yet.





 





None of the vaccines we give our kids provides lifelong immunity. Including Varicella. The problem with varicella is that, because there haven't been any long term studies, no one can agree on how long the vaccine provides immunity. For most of the diseases we're vaccinated against, adults have a better chance of coping and surviving contracting a disease. Right now, most whooping cough cases are adults (who were vaccinated as children) who don't even realize they have it.





 





Varicella is unique among most childhood disease we are vaccinated against because it is actually worse to get it as an adult than it is as a child. Complications are increased when contracted as an adult than with children. Since the vaccine has not even been out long enough for anyone to have reached adulthood, there is nothing to say what will happen to those vaccinated when they become adults. Since no vaccine thus far (for any disease) has been able to provide lifelong immunity, it is highly unlikely that varicella will.





 





So essentially, without long term studies (meaning that those vaccinated need to reach adulthood) getting vaccinated for varicella may be more dangerous than actually contracting the disease.





Quoting lga1965:





 





Quoting D-Town:

We selectively vaccinate. We don't do vaccines that have not had any (published) long term studies. We don't do vaccines that are just "guesses" either. That means no varicella. No gardisil. And no flu shots. Everything else we've done.




 http://www.cdc.gov/vaccines/vpd-vac/varicella/









Varicella (chickenpox) is a highly contagious disease that is very uncomfortable and sometimes serious. The chickenpox vaccine is the best protection against chickenpox. The vaccine is made from weakened varicella virus that produces an immune response in your body that protects you against chickenpox. The chickenpox vaccine was licensed for use in the United States in 1995. Since then, the vaccine has become widely used. Thanks to the chickenpox vaccine, the number of people who get chickenpox each year as well as hospitalizations and deaths from chickenpox have gone down dramatically in the United States.





http://pediatrics.aappublications.org/content/early/2013/03/27/peds.2012-3303.abstract





BACKGROUND: Varicella vaccine was licensed in the United States in 1995 for individuals ≥12 months of age. A second dose was recommended in the United States in June 2006. Varicella incidence and vaccine effectiveness were assessed in a 14-year prospective study conducted at Kaiser Permanente Northern California.









METHODS: A total of 7585 children vaccinated with varicella vaccine in their second year of life in 1995 were followed up prospectively for breakthrough varicella and herpes zoster (HZ) through 2009. A total of 2826 of these children received a second dose in 2006–2009. Incidences of varicella and HZ were estimated and compared with prevaccine era rates.









RESULTS: In this cohort of vaccinated children, the average incidence of varicella was 15.9 per 1000 person-years, nine- to tenfold lower than in the prevaccine era. Vaccine effectiveness at the end of the study period was 90%, with no indication of waning over time. Most cases of varicella were mild and occurred early after vaccination. No child developed varicella after a second dose. HZ cases were mild, and rates were lower in the cohort of vaccinated children than in unvaccinated children during the prevaccine era (relative risk: 0.61 [95% confidence interval: 0.43–0.89]).









CONCLUSIONS: This study confirmed that varicella vaccine is effective at preventing chicken pox, with no waning noted over a 14-year period. One dose provided excellent protection against moderate to severe disease, and most cases occurred shortly after the cohort was vaccinated. The study data also suggest that varicella vaccination may reduce the risks of HZ in vaccinated children.





 





 





What I made bigger.





Same thing for mumps.  It can leave you sterile, especially men.





 Yes, I got mumps when I was 34 , caught it from other kids and my kids and I was so sick . ( This was before the vaccine )My kids got over it well...I was a wreck for weeks. My aunt had chicken pox in her 50's and had to be hospitalized.





I got Shingles in 1995 because I had chicken pox as a kid in 1949. A grade school friend had chicken pox and ended up with brain damage.





Adults have a rough time if they get childhood diseases.





I have had boosters. My kids too.Doctors ask and keep records of all of your past immunizations. If you have a family Doctor or see any Doctor on a regular basis , you do get boosters. (UNLESS, you have some kind of irrational fear of them.)





I wonder where all the misinformation comes from?





I am so pro vaccinating.

lga1965
by on Sep. 27, 2013 at 9:47 AM
1 mom liked this

Doctors are in charge of boosters. The vaccine was distributed starting in 1995. That's 18 years.
As I said, good luck. I certainly hope there is not another chicken pox outbreak in your area. And even so,if your kids get it ,they will possibly get Shingles as adults. It's not good. I have experience with that too.
I think one big problem with this fear of vaccines is that moms are too young and out of touch. Do YOUR research and please stay away from Mercola and quacks.

Quoting D-Town:

No. It's not. And you didn't post a study that showed 18 years. It only covered 14. And even they couldn't tell with any certainty how often boosters should be administered and it point blank said that any long term benefits were just guesses. Which is my entire point.





Quoting lga1965:

 18 years of a vaccine isn't good enough for you? And where did you get your MD degree?



Quoting D-Town:

I do vaccinate. I said I don't do vaccines that have no long term studies or are just guessing games. You took issue with varicella. Even to include a link that proved my point about no long term studies and that it was a guessing game as why I should get it.



Quoting lga1965:



 I AM up to date. I said I get boosters. My kids do too.




We were based in Germany in 1980-82 when there was en epidemic of Mad Cow disease in England and because they sold beef to commissaries in Germany and we bought meat from them, we can't give blood. EVERYONE who was in Germany and shopped at the commissary theoretically has Mad Cow disease in their body even though we haven't actually had the disease,and we can't donate blood. Did you know that? LOL.




I don't understand why you are so sure that nobody gets boosters?And why you don't understand that we are so thankful for vaccines ?  You will regret this someday of someone in your family gets one of those diseases. There are signs polio might return too but then crunchy Moms think only people in slums with no sanitation get polio. LOL. SO far from the truth. In the 50's, before the polio vaccine, some of our friends in our wealthy suburb in MN got polio, one in an iron lung because of paralyzed diaphragm muscles , a few who still need crutches, and there was an epidemic even though we were all exceptionally clean and well fed.




It would be nice if you all had MD degrees so you would have a little credibility but you don't .




Good luck. That is all I have to say.




Quoting D-Town:

But the problem is if you get the vaccine in kindergarten, come graduation you are no longer immune. You contracted the disease naturally so your immunity is lifelong. The vaccines aren't. Follow a few links from the CDC link you posted you'll find they are reporting an increase in adults contracting varicella. So chickenpox is now slowly becoming an adult disease instead of a childhood one because most adults don't get their boosters.


Part of being responsible in telling people to get vaccines is to give them 100% of the information needs to make informed decisions. Not telling people they need boosters for the rest of their lives is irresponsible. Not telling them that the immunity wears off is irresponsible.


Are you able to give blood? If you say yes you're irresponsible about your vaccines. You are not up to date yourself. If you are up to date then you can't give blood. If you aren't up to date then why should anyone listen to someone who doesn't take their own advice.





Quoting lga1965:




 





Quoting romalove:










Quoting D-Town:





 That vaccine hasn't been out for 20 years yet.





 





None of the vaccines we give our kids provides lifelong immunity. Including Varicella. The problem with varicella is that, because there haven't been any long term studies, no one can agree on how long the vaccine provides immunity. For most of the diseases we're vaccinated against, adults have a better chance of coping and surviving contracting a disease. Right now, most whooping cough cases are adults (who were vaccinated as children) who don't even realize they have it.





 





Varicella is unique among most childhood disease we are vaccinated against because it is actually worse to get it as an adult than it is as a child. Complications are increased when contracted as an adult than with children. Since the vaccine has not even been out long enough for anyone to have reached adulthood, there is nothing to say what will happen to those vaccinated when they become adults. Since no vaccine thus far (for any disease) has been able to provide lifelong immunity, it is highly unlikely that varicella will.





 





So essentially, without long term studies (meaning that those vaccinated need to reach adulthood) getting vaccinated for varicella may be more dangerous than actually contracting the disease.





Quoting lga1965:





 





Quoting D-Town:

We selectively vaccinate. We don't do vaccines that have not had any (published) long term studies. We don't do vaccines that are just "guesses" either. That means no varicella. No gardisil. And no flu shots. Everything else we've done.




 http://www.cdc.gov/vaccines/vpd-vac/varicella/









Varicella (chickenpox) is a highly contagious disease that is very uncomfortable and sometimes serious. The chickenpox vaccine is the best protection against chickenpox. The vaccine is made from weakened varicella virus that produces an immune response in your body that protects you against chickenpox. The chickenpox vaccine was licensed for use in the United States in 1995. Since then, the vaccine has become widely used. Thanks to the chickenpox vaccine, the number of people who get chickenpox each year as well as hospitalizations and deaths from chickenpox have gone down dramatically in the United States.





http://pediatrics.aappublications.org/content/early/2013/03/27/peds.2012-3303.abstract





BACKGROUND:Varicella vaccine was licensed in the United States in 1995 for individuals ≥12 months of age. A second dose was recommended in the United States in June 2006. Varicella incidence and vaccine effectiveness were assessed in a 14-year prospective study conducted at Kaiser Permanente Northern California.









METHODS:A total of 7585 children vaccinated with varicella vaccine in their second year of life in 1995 were followed up prospectively for breakthrough varicella and herpes zoster (HZ) through 2009. A total of 2826 of these children received a second dose in 2006–2009. Incidences of varicella and HZ were estimated and compared with prevaccine era rates.









RESULTS:In this cohort of vaccinated children, the average incidence of varicella was 15.9 per 1000 person-years, nine- to tenfold lower than in the prevaccine era. Vaccine effectiveness at the end of the study period was 90%, with no indication of waning over time. Most cases of varicella were mild and occurred early after vaccination. No child developed varicella after a second dose. HZ cases were mild, and rates were lower in the cohort of vaccinated children than in unvaccinated children during the prevaccine era (relative risk: 0.61 [95% confidence interval: 0.43–0.89]).









CONCLUSIONS:This study confirmed that varicella vaccine is effective at preventing chicken pox, with no waning noted over a 14-year period. One dose provided excellent protection against moderate to severe disease, and most cases occurred shortly after the cohort was vaccinated. The study data also suggest that varicella vaccination may reduce the risks of HZ in vaccinated children.





 





 





What I made bigger.





Same thing for mumps.  It can leave you sterile, especially men.





 Yes, I got mumps when I was 34 , caught it from other kids and my kids and I was so sick . ( This was before the vaccine )My kids got over it well...I was a wreck for weeks. My aunt had chicken pox in her 50's and had to be hospitalized.





I got Shingles in 1995 because I had chicken pox as a kid in 1949. A grade school friend had chicken pox and ended up with brain damage.





Adults have a rough time if they get childhood diseases.





I have had boosters. My kids too.Doctors ask and keep records of all of your past immunizations. If you have a family Doctor or see any Doctor on a regular basis , you do get boosters. (UNLESS, you have some kind of irrational fear of them.)





I wonder where all the misinformation comes from?





I am so pro vaccinating.




 



 

SimplyEnchanted
by on Sep. 27, 2013 at 10:00 AM

There is no vaccine for scarlet or rheumatic fever. Rheumatic fever is a complication of strep. Scarlet fever is also a form of strep.  There is no vaccine for strep. My aunt died from heart problems due to rheumatic fever.


What are the causes of rheumatic fever?

Rheumatic fever may develop as a complication after a throat infection with Streptococcus pyogenes, or group A streptococcus (a bacterium). Strep throat, and less commonly scarlet fever are infections caused by Group A streptococcus infections. Group A streptococcus skin infections, as well as infections in other parts of the body may lead to rheumatic fever (much less common).

Quoting LindaClement:


Quoting SEEKEROFSHELLS:

 My neighbors child was a totally fine 4 yr old, got a shot, many years ago. He screamed all night, and they watched him fade away within a very short time. He is autistic. My neighbor has no reason to lie to me, his story. None. This happened maybe 16 or 18 years ago. I believe the shot had something to do with it, as well as a predisposition to autism.  There is also a government fund, where they have paid off a few parents, with children with autism from damage due to the shots isn't there? 

I'll check that and see you:

My grandmother lived through the polio epidemics. The years in a row when there were half the kids every September in class. Every year. For years.

100 kids... 50... 25... 12... 6.

My grandmother lived with post-polio and the heart damage from rheumatic fever, spent several years of her childhood recovering from 'the rest': scarlet fever, measles, mumps, german measles...

My eldest has the same overall look, and is nearly 9" taller than her grandmother was. The difference?

Not spending 1/2 her childhood suffering from or recovering from major (preventable) illnesses. 


Mama to six beautiful girls- Piper(12), Paris(10), Prue(8), Priya(5)&Kahlan(3), Arie (2 weeks old!) and two angel babies that were too precious for earth, Angel('09) and Evenstar('12)


A Simply Enchanted Life

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