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Zmirak: Pope Francis Should Repent or Else Resign

Pope Francis arrived in Myanmar on Monday to a warm welcome from the country's small but enthusiastic Catholic population

In his 2018 wish list, John Zmirak, Senior Editor of The Stream and author of the new Politically Incorrect Guide to Catholicismwrites that he hopes Pope Francis “repents or else resigns” this year.

From The Stream:

Pope Francis has done more to divide Catholics than any pope in 150 years. He has clouded the Church’s teaching on marriage and sexuality. Francis has thrown out the clear, recent teaching of two of his immediate predecessors — which echoed Church practice and preaching for 2000 years. He has politicized the papacy, using its bully pulpit to further crudely crafted left-wing talking points on everything from the economy to immigration to climate science.

He has marginalized and punished his critics, to the point that a new book calls him the “Dictator Pope.” Now he’s defending his handpicked lieutenant, Cardinal Oscar Rodriguez Maradiaga. That Honduran leftist (and anti-Semite) is accused of massive corruption that benefited him personally, to the tune of $40,000 per month. Other favorites of Pope Francis include the disgraced Belgian Cardinal Wilfrid Daneels — who was caught on tape trying to silence a sex abuse victim — and LGBT advocate Fr. James Martin, SJ.

In the best case scenario, Pope Francis will see the error of his ways, and spend the rest of his pontificate undoing the damage he’s wrought. Failing that, he should imitate the example of Pope Benedict XVI and admit that he can no longer lead the Church. He should resign, and open a political institute based in Buenos Aires. Something tells me George Soros would fund it.

Read the rest here.


by on Jan. 1, 2018 at 9:40 PM
Replies (81-84):
billsfan1104
by Emerald Member on Jan. 3, 2018 at 2:15 PM
That’s a great way of putting it

Quoting Kmary:

Ok thats you how you feel.  But can you see how it's sort of a matter of philosophy?  Take this true story:

i've had the same best friend for close to 30 years.  She knows me better than anyone basically.  is like the sister I never had and i consider her an overall wonderful person.  But  when we were in our early twenties she briefly knowingly and unapologetically dated a married man.  I don't think infidelity is ok.  I did warn her that I thought it was wrong and risky, but then I just forgot about it.  I still accepted her.  I don't think I "accept" infidelity.  I think it's a terrible thing to be a part of.  But I love my friend and still accepted her.  Maybe other people would have cut her off and that's ther prerogative to do, but I didn't.  That's how I view the church's stance on not just homosexuality, but basically any and all sin.  And yes, I get it:  you don't think homosexuality is a sin to begin with (and truthfully I do not either).  But the church does.  And like EVERY other sin on the planet, they still accept those who commit that sin.  They are accepted.  

ou.Quoting Debmomto2teens: I don’t consider a church telling me that how I love someone is a sin and an abomination as acceptance.



Quoting Kmary: Eh now you’re playing with semantics. The Catholic Church won’t let me become a priest because I’m a woman. But I don’t think anyone would say the Church doesn’t “accept” me. This isn’t a procedure they’re changing, but they “accept” women. Same way they aren’t going to start marrying same sex couples or non Catholics. But they’re still “accepted.”

Quoting Debmomto2teens: Here .. maybe this will help.

ac·cept
əkˈsept/Submit
verb
gerund or present participle: accepting
1.
consent to receive (a thing offered).
"he accepted a pen as a present"
synonyms: receive, take, get, gain, obtain, acquire More
2.
believe or come to recognize (an opinion, explanation, etc.) as valid or correct.
"this tentative explanation came to be accepted by the group"
synonyms: believe, regard as true, give credence to, credit, trust; informalbuy, swallow
"he accepted Ellen's explanation"
recognized, acknowledged, established, traditional, orthodox, sanctioned;
usual, customary, habitual, common, current, normal, general, prevailing, accustomed, familiar, wonted, popular, well established, expected, routine, standard, stock
"newspaper ads from the 1700s show that, even in New England, the brokering of slaves was an accepted practice"


Quoting billsfan1104: The Catholic Church is accepting of everyone. Just because they don’t perform a ceremony that you want performed, doesn’t mean they are not accepting.
They won’t perform a santanic ritual on their alter either. Doesn’t mean they are not accepting.

Debmomto2teens
by Ruby Member on Jan. 3, 2018 at 2:22 PM
I wanted to add a comment. I think acceptance is a broad term. IMO, the Catholic Church just pays lip service to that word. They don’t live the meaning of the word acceptance. It is conditional. It harms those who are homosexual by telling them they cannot be a true catholic unless they remain chaste..

We will accept you but not really. It’s fake and disingenuous.

Again, this is my opinion. And one of the main reasons I left the church. I don’t need a middle man between me and God. There is so much hypocrisy in the church. I think the original teachings were bastardized by man.

That is what I observed as a Catholic for 45 years. We will accept you but here is how you need to act. However, they were above their own teachings. They allowed pedophilia. In the beginning, I thought “ok. Now that they know they will do something about it” only to find out they were still covering it up. It became one big ball of hypocrisy and lies.

So, I don’t accept the innocence of their version of acceptance.


Quoting Kmary:

Ok thats you how you feel.  But can you see how it's sort of a matter of philosophy?  Take this true story:

i've had the same best friend for close to 30 years.  She knows me better than anyone basically.  is like the sister I never had and i consider her an overall wonderful person.  But  when we were in our early twenties she briefly knowingly and unapologetically dated a married man.  I don't think infidelity is ok.  I did warn her that I thought it was wrong and risky, but then I just forgot about it.  I still accepted her.  I don't think I "accept" infidelity.  I think it's a terrible thing to be a part of.  But I love my friend and still accepted her.  Maybe other people would have cut her off and that's ther prerogative to do, but I didn't.  That's how I view the church's stance on not just homosexuality, but basically any and all sin.  And yes, I get it:  you don't think homosexuality is a sin to begin with (and truthfully I do not either).  But the church does.  And like EVERY other sin on the planet, they still accept those who commit that sin.  They are accepted.  

ou.Quoting Debmomto2teens: I don’t consider a church telling me that how I love someone is a sin and an abomination as acceptance.



Quoting Kmary: Eh now you’re playing with semantics. The Catholic Church won’t let me become a priest because I’m a woman. But I don’t think anyone would say the Church doesn’t “accept” me. This isn’t a procedure they’re changing, but they “accept” women. Same way they aren’t going to start marrying same sex couples or non Catholics. But they’re still “accepted.”

Quoting Debmomto2teens: Here .. maybe this will help.

ac·cept
əkˈsept/Submit
verb
gerund or present participle: accepting
1.
consent to receive (a thing offered).
"he accepted a pen as a present"
synonyms: receive, take, get, gain, obtain, acquire More
2.
believe or come to recognize (an opinion, explanation, etc.) as valid or correct.
"this tentative explanation came to be accepted by the group"
synonyms: believe, regard as true, give credence to, credit, trust; informalbuy, swallow
"he accepted Ellen's explanation"
recognized, acknowledged, established, traditional, orthodox, sanctioned;
usual, customary, habitual, common, current, normal, general, prevailing, accustomed, familiar, wonted, popular, well established, expected, routine, standard, stock
"newspaper ads from the 1700s show that, even in New England, the brokering of slaves was an accepted practice"


Quoting billsfan1104: The Catholic Church is accepting of everyone. Just because they don’t perform a ceremony that you want performed, doesn’t mean they are not accepting.
They won’t perform a santanic ritual on their alter either. Doesn’t mean they are not accepting.

Kmary
by Bronze Member on Jan. 3, 2018 at 2:32 PM

So you're jaded.  Got it.  It happens to lots and lots of people.  You let a few things you disagreed with sway you and you took your ball and went home.  I'm the total opposite.  I'd rather remain and help elicit change.  I'm only 37, but i personally feel the Catholic church is pretty different than when I was even a kid.  By the way, it's the same way I feel about education. I'm a teacher and there are things in public education I disagree with, but instead of giving up teaching or pulling my kids and putting them in private or whatever, I decided to stay and help BE the change.  That's just how I work.  But many, many people are like you decide to leave altogether and that's ok too.  (I'm not being sarcastic or patronizing.  I mean that.  it can be hard to tell in writing).

   Quoting Debmo.  mto2teens: I wanted to add a shtnt. I think belieacceptance is a broad term. IMO, the Catholic Church just pays lip service to that word. They don’t live the meaning of the word acceptance. It is conditional. It harms those who are homosexual by telling them they cannot be a true catholic unless they remain chaste.. We will accept you but not really. It’s fake and disingenuous. Again, this is my opinion. And one of the main reasons I left the church. I don’t need a middle man between me and God. There is so much hypocrisy in the church. I think the original teachings were bastardized by man. That is what I observed as a Catholic for 45 years. We will accept you but here is how you need to act. However, they were above their own teachings. They allowed pedophilia. In the beginning, I thought “ok. Now that they know they will do something about it” only to find out they were still covering it up. It became one big ball of hypocrisy and lies. So, I don’t accept the innocence of their version of acceptance.
Quoting Kmary:

Ok thats you how you feel.  But can you see how it's sort of a matter of philosophy?  Take this true story:

i've had the same best friend for close to 30 years.  She knows me better than anyone basically.  is like the sister I never had and i consider her an overall wonderful person.  But  when we were in our early twenties she briefly knowingly and unapologetically dated a married man.  I don't think infidelity is ok.  I did warn her that I thought it was wrong and risky, but then I just forgot about it.  I still accepted her.  I don't think I "accept" infidelity.  I think it's a terrible thing to be a part of.  But I love my friend and still accepted her.  Maybe other people would have cut her off and that's ther prerogative to do, but I didn't.  That's how I view the church's stance on not just homosexuality, but basically any and all sin.  And yes, I get it:  you don't think homosexuality is a sin to begin with (and truthfully I do not either).  But the church does.  And like EVERY other sin on the planet, they still accept those who commit that sin.  They are accepted.  

ou.Quoting Debmomto2teens: I don’t consider a church telling me that how I love someone is a sin and an abomination as acceptance.
Quoting Kmary: Eh now you’re playing with semantics. The Catholic Church won’t let me become a priest because I’m a woman. But I don’t think anyone would say the Church doesn’t “accept” me. This isn’t a procedure they’re changing, but they “accept” women. Same way they aren’t going to start marrying same sex couples or non Catholics. But they’re still “accepted.”
Quoting Debmomto2teens: Here .. maybe this will help. ac·cept əkˈsept/Submit verb gerund or present participle: accepting 1. consent to receive (a thing offered). "he accepted a pen as a present" synonyms: receive, take, get, gain, obtain, acquire More 2. believe or come to recognize (an opinion, explanation, etc.) as valid or correct. "this tentative explanation came to be accepted by the group" synonyms: believe, regard as true, give credence to, credit, trust; informalbuy, swallow "he accepted Ellen's explanation" recognized, acknowledged, established, traditional, orthodox, sanctioned; usual, customary, habitual, common, current, normal, general, prevailing, accustomed, familiar, wonted, popular, well established, expected, routine, standard, stock "newspaper ads from the 1700s show that, even in New England, the brokering of slaves was an accepted practice"
Quoting billsfan1104: The Catholic Church is accepting of everyone. Just because they don’t perform a ceremony that you want performed, doesn’t mean they are not accepting. They won’t perform a santanic ritual on their alter either. Doesn’t mean they are not accepting.



Debmomto2teens
by Ruby Member on Jan. 3, 2018 at 2:38 PM
I’m a teacher and nurse. I get being frustrated about a system. I’m very frustrated with the healthcare system and haven’t bailed.

It’s not being jaded. It’s coming to my realization that I do not believe in the Catholic Church or its teachings. I found one hypocrisy after another and the good no longer outweighed the bad. I couldn’t get behind a Church I no longer fundamentally believed in.

People change. Peoples belief and faith can change. I don’t belong to any formal religion and have much more peace than I have had in years.

So, no it’s not as simple or childish as taking my ball and going home.


Quoting Kmary:

So you're jaded.  Got it.  It happens to lots and lots of people.  You let a few things you disagreed with sway you and you took your ball and went home.  I'm the total opposite.  I'd rather remain and help elicit change.  I'm only 37, but i personally feel the Catholic church is pretty different than when I was even a kid.  By the way, it's the same way I feel about education. I'm a teacher and there are things in public education I disagree with, but instead of giving up teaching or pulling my kids and putting them in private or whatever, I decided to stay and help BE the change.  That's just how I work.  But many, many people are like you decide to leave altogether and that's ok too.  (I'm not being sarcastic or patronizing.  I mean that.  it can be hard to tell in writing).

   Quoting Debmo.  mto2teens: I wanted to add a shtnt. I think belieacceptance is a broad term. IMO, the Catholic Church just pays lip service to that word. They don’t live the meaning of the word acceptance. It is conditional. It harms those who are homosexual by telling them they cannot be a true catholic unless they remain chaste..

We will accept you but not really. It’s fake and disingenuous.

Again, this is my opinion. And one of the main reasons I left the church. I don’t need a middle man between me and God. There is so much hypocrisy in the church. I think the original teachings were bastardized by man.

That is what I observed as a Catholic for 45 years. We will accept you but here is how you need to act. However, they were above their own teachings. They allowed pedophilia. In the beginning, I thought “ok. Now that they know they will do something about it” only to find out they were still covering it up. It became one big ball of hypocrisy and lies.

So, I don’t accept the innocence of their version of acceptance.


Quoting Kmary:

Ok thats you how you feel.  But can you see how it's sort of a matter of philosophy?  Take this true story:

i've had the same best friend for close to 30 years.  She knows me better than anyone basically.  is like the sister I never had and i consider her an overall wonderful person.  But  when we were in our early twenties she briefly knowingly and unapologetically dated a married man.  I don't think infidelity is ok.  I did warn her that I thought it was wrong and risky, but then I just forgot about it.  I still accepted her.  I don't think I "accept" infidelity.  I think it's a terrible thing to be a part of.  But I love my friend and still accepted her.  Maybe other people would have cut her off and that's ther prerogative to do, but I didn't.  That's how I view the church's stance on not just homosexuality, but basically any and all sin.  And yes, I get it:  you don't think homosexuality is a sin to begin with (and truthfully I do not either).  But the church does.  And like EVERY other sin on the planet, they still accept those who commit that sin.  They are accepted.  

ou.Quoting Debmomto2teens: I don’t consider a church telling me that how I love someone is a sin and an abomination as acceptance.



Quoting Kmary: Eh now you’re playing with semantics. The Catholic Church won’t let me become a priest because I’m a woman. But I don’t think anyone would say the Church doesn’t “accept” me. This isn’t a procedure they’re changing, but they “accept” women. Same way they aren’t going to start marrying same sex couples or non Catholics. But they’re still “accepted.”

Quoting Debmomto2teens: Here .. maybe this will help.

ac·cept
əkˈsept/Submit
verb
gerund or present participle: accepting
1.
consent to receive (a thing offered).
"he accepted a pen as a present"
synonyms: receive, take, get, gain, obtain, acquire More
2.
believe or come to recognize (an opinion, explanation, etc.) as valid or correct.
"this tentative explanation came to be accepted by the group"
synonyms: believe, regard as true, give credence to, credit, trust; informalbuy, swallow
"he accepted Ellen's explanation"
recognized, acknowledged, established, traditional, orthodox, sanctioned;
usual, customary, habitual, common, current, normal, general, prevailing, accustomed, familiar, wonted, popular, well established, expected, routine, standard, stock
"newspaper ads from the 1700s show that, even in New England, the brokering of slaves was an accepted practice"


Quoting billsfan1104: The Catholic Church is accepting of everyone. Just because they don’t perform a ceremony that you want performed, doesn’t mean they are not accepting.
They won’t perform a santanic ritual on their alter either. Doesn’t mean they are not accepting.

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