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California judge rules Christian bakery

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California judge rules Christian bakery shouldn’t be forced to make gay wedding cake

by on Feb. 7, 2018 at 2:45 AM
Replies (411-414):
D-Town
by Platinum Member on Feb. 13, 2018 at 3:58 AM

If the baker doesn't view it as a marriage then there should be no problems in baking that wedding cake. What if I, as a straight person, wanted a wedding cake to serve at a homeless shelter? What if I wanted a wedding cake to feed to the ducks at the local pond? What if I want to pay 3x more for a cake just because I want a wedding cake? As a straight person, should I be denied a cake because it's not going to be used for a wedding? 


If they don't consider it a marriage, then what difference would it make to bake the wedding cake? 

Quoting Jaysgal426:

Thank you for actually trying to have a conversation without insulting me. I think you are trying to compare apples and oranges though. With the making of a cake, you are asking a very religous person to take their time and effort into supporting the creation of a union that they feel according to their religous texts is not a marriage. (And I know that people who disagree with me just label those people and their values as a basket of delporables whose opinions and values should just be ignored). The baker didn't stop a gay couple coming into their bakery from buying a box of pastries that are already there for one thing. Secondly, it what other businesses do you ask people about the bride and groom? There is no other business where that information would in any other situation affect the business. You don't ask that question when taking a person's grocery order or doing their dry cleaning or even ordering a livery service. Secondly, in those other business scenarios, you are not part of the process of the creation of the union. Once someone is already married doing their dry cleaning or filling their grocery order is going to have no bearing on the marriage.

So no I do not think religous people should be able to say no in every scenario to answer your first question. I don't think gay people should have to move where they are more accepted. Of course this is not the current situation. The gay people with the wedding cake have other choices they can make. You are taking the choice away from te religous person. The religous person is not going into the wedding and trying to stop the wedding officiant from carrying out the ceremony. On the other hand many people on the left are very happy to scare away all the other customers from the bakery business by threatning to slander their reputation of the customers who choose to stick with the business. You take away people's livehood, they can not continue to live their life the way that wanted to live it before.

Quoting msb64:

What about communities where there are no other choices.  I know that this post is about bakeries (our county has only one) but what about other businesses? If just a couple of businesses in our community decided that they would not serve the gay community, those who are gay would no longer be able to functionally live in our community.  Is that okay?  Should people be required to move from their current homes to areas where their sexual orientation is more accepted?

Quoting Jaysgal426:

What I wonder is why try to drive people who have a differing viewpoint from you from into going broke? It's easy for people who don't believe in a religion or stereotype all the people within that religion as hypocrites, to easily dismiss tenants of that religion. There are some people who just go to church on Easter and Christmas and really don't contemplate much what their faith really means to them. Then there are Christians who face extreme hardships and sacrifices to actually live feasibly within the realm of what the bible says it means to be Christians. They tithe 10% of their income. They follow what the bible says about how to conduct their marriage and raise their kids. They are at church every Sunday and Wednesday. They do community service through their church. They serve in missions through their church. I doubt anybody comes to the decision to do something that is an extreme threat to their livelihood without an extreme amount of soul searching. If you don't believe in their religion or the fact that they will go to hell if they don't follow their religion, then how can you judge their choices? What right do others who without owning it, have a right to tell other adults which tenants of their religion to follow and which tenants they should forget about?

Discrimination laws were put in place because their were certain white people that didn't like black people or thought that they were better then black people. White schools had better resources and better funding. Their was only one public bus going in one direction and the elderly black women had to stand when there were empty seats on the front of the bus. These discriminations laws were put into place because it was causing true hardships for black people.  For the small handful of fundamental Chrisitans who do not support gay marriage, it isn't because they feel they are better then gay people or they don't like gay people. What they are saying is my religous laws don't support your union. We don't know if this is something that falls in line with God laws that I live by and I'm not taking a chance on an eternity in hell.

I don't understand why the left/democrats can't see the huge difference between what I'm describing. For gay people, there is an option of going to a different bakery and getting a cake made there. It is not the only bus in town going in the direction they need to be going. It's not an essential service. They are not being denied the right to a better education and better future by getting their caked baked. I don't understand why the left/democrats can't show the same respect to people to excercise their religous freedoms as they please as they show to gay people to allow them to marry who they want. Why do you think that one deserves more respect then the other?

I have gay friends and support gay marriage. However I don't understand why the left/democratscan't see that two very intelligent educated and moral groups of people can come to a very different decision on the same issue for very different but valid reasons? When did this all of the sudden become so frightening to people? Why can't people today live and let live?

This is not what was promised to the public either when gay marriage was being sold to people. It was being sold as live and let live. I believe the exact idea was that the majority of people should now not be able to tell the minority of adults how to live their live. However now very religous conservatives are the minority and this is exactly what is being done. 

Democrats/the left have become the new lynch mob of this time period. First the argument of the opponent is being censored, by trying to by slandering anybody's reputation who dosen't agree with exactly with every word you say as ignorant, racist and homeophobic.The left tries to claim they are trying to educate people, but it's quite the opposite you really are trying indoctrination. Why do I need to be educated if I don't think about something the way you do?   If that not dare scare then away then you go after their livelihoods. At the other bakery people not only went after the bakery, they went after other customers who patronized the bakery. They harassed the bakerys other customers legally. 

Quoting BluesPagan2.0: Where in there did I say I support discrimination? This is the issue in this group. One extreme and never a moderate point of view. If I lived there I wouldn’t support that store. I think it’s theirbright to be bigoted asshats. It is also my right to not support them or their business. Honestly, cases like this only furthers he divide. Is it any wonder conservatives think liberals want to tell them how to think and what they can and can’t do? Let them be bigots! Then let them wonder why no one supports them and they are going broke. But I guess that takes too much effort.
Quoting SommelierMom: So you support discrimination?
Quoting BluesPagan2.0: Honestly I have no issue with this ruling. No one should be forced to do anything especially in this time. A time when people can easily come together to boycott and protest. So don’t bake the cake. But don’t complain when people stop hiring you or giving you business of any kind. Don’t complain if your business goes under because you’re an intolerant bigot.





___________________________________________________

Anyway, no drug, not even alcohol, causes the fundamental ills of society. If we're looking for the source of our troubles, we shouldn't test people for drugs, we should test them for stupidity, ignorance, greed and love of power.

- P. J. O'Rourke
SommelierMom
by Bronze Member on Feb. 13, 2018 at 7:11 AM
There is no right to treat gay people differently than straight people. That's discrimination and it's against the law in CA. I didn't make that law.

I don't dislike all religious people, just the ones who hide behind their religion to promote their hatred.


Quoting Jaysgal426:

What you are advocating for is not equal rights. What you are advocating for is for people like you (who hate religous people) and gay people to have your right to choose honored while taking away the rights of others that you see as being beneath you. You disrespecting the Gospel that all Christians (and by the way Jews live by the first testament of the Gospel) live by by mocking it and calling it The Flying Spaghetti Monster so easily proves my point. So I guess we are both hateful people who need to be educated.

Quoting SommelierMom: I don't hide it. I'm very vocal about my disdain for those who don't feel others should have equal rights because that's what The Flying Spaghetti Monster might have told someone who wrote it down in a book eons ago.

Organized religion can be lovely, but not when it's used to treat some people better than others. Then it's about hate.

Oh, and it's not me telling people how to live, it's the law. Sexual preference is protected in CA.


Quoting Jaysgal426:

Well good for you that you think you should be able to tell other adults what they have the right to think and how they get to live their lives because only you are the only good enough person to have a valid moral opinion. 

And it's nice of you to show you hate and disdain for organized religion.How you so easily disrespect and invalidate others who have a belief system that you don't like. And you probably consider yourself a tolerant and multicultural person right? At least you own your hate and don't hide it.  

Quoting SommelierMom: The religious person is entitled to his/her opinion, absolutely. He/she is not entitled the act upon said opinion if it discriminates.

Denying people equal treatment due to their sexuality IS hateful/bigoted/homophobic/etc. These zealots want to treat gay people differently because a really old book, that's been interpreted tenfold, that might have something to do with something that likely doesn't even exist, is the definition of hate. Religion is almost certainly a made up, man-made idea to explain the things that couldn't be explained pre science.

Of course you voted for Trump. He's got the backwards, cousin-fucker demographic wrapped around his finger.


Quoting Jaysgal426:

If you confuse hate with respecting people's right to follow their religion the way they see fit, just as I believe in respecting a consenting adult to marry what every other consenting adult that they want to, then you must be getting equality and hate confused. I believe in equality of opinons, the opinion of the religous person is just as important as the opinon as the opinon of gay people and their supporters. When the majority of the country voted down gay marriage, it was seen as wrong that a majority should be able to tell a minority of adults what to do. The fact that people can not apply this logic to the fact that dismissing people religous beliefs because you don't care for them or see them as valid, (especially since you admitted you were prejudice to conservative religous people) and forcing on them what they majority of people in the secular world see as the right thing is the exact same thing people labeled as wrong in the past. It goes to show to show the hypocrisy that people have in this country. And name calling  (calling someone bigoted, racist, hateful or homeophobic) when you disagree with someone opinion, which is what people in politics seem to do whenever someone else disagrees with their self righteous political opinions, is just the act of a unintelligent person who can't debate well. I don't do personal attacks because it shuts down the conversation. It's ok though and raises my spirits. It's behavior like this, that when people get into the voting booths and are tired of being talked down to, dismissed and denigrated lift their middle finger of freedom because you can't control peoples minds and vote for who ever dosen't insult the nation with this identity politics crap. This is what brought us Trump and will bring us more people like him.

Quoting SommelierMom: I'm definitely not a true republican, nor do I want to be, but I'm also not a democrat. I was pointing out the flaw in your argument.

Religious rights shouldn't excuse discrimination. If they don't define a gay wedding as an actual wedding, there should be no harm in making a cake for it.

"It can't be discrimination if it isn't actually defined as a wedding because a wedding as defined as a marriage is a union between two straight people."

Gay marriage is as much of a marriage as straight marriage since 2015. Unless you know something The Supreme Court doesn't.

You can keep using religion to spread hate. It's typical.


Quoting Jaysgal426:

You are not a true Republican if you are not concerned with protecting people's religous rights and can not see how these cases go against people's religous rights. The only thing you don't can't admit is the moral equivalent in making a cake for a person whose marriage dosen't exist under their religous laws vs. a person's right to marry who they want. One is not more important then the other and in a truly free society the gay person wouldn't force someone to make a cake for a wedding that in their religion dosen't exist because marriage is something that takes place in between a man and a women. Their religous text that they live their life by states that this is not a marriage. The gay person has choices. What you are doing to the religous person is invalidating their religous beliefs by taking away their choice. By making them make a cake for something they do not define as a wedding. It can't be discrimination if it isn't actually defined as a wedding because a wedding as defined as a marriage is a union between two straight people. The fact that you don't respect their religous definition of what marriage is, shouldn't factor into it. I tend to cap lock things on Cafemom because people seem to have an issue reading on this website ! 

And gay marriage was forced upon the public after it was voted down in Florida and California. Then after it was voted down, it was forced upon the people by the federal courts. What I think that the general public should take away from this situation was that they were lied to. They were told that peoples' right to marry who they want would not trump peoples' religous rights and now the goverment is not keeping it word.

Quoting SommelierMom: I've voted republican almost my entire life, so there goes your dumb theory.

If the baker makes wedding cakes for straight people but doesn't make wedding cakes for gay people, that's discrimination. Why should the gay person not have a cake at their wedding or be forced to go elsewhere? Because of a bigoted zealot baker?

Business owners aren't allowed to operate however they'd like. That's what you fail to understand.

Why are you yelling, crazypants?


Quoting Jaysgal426:

If that's what you get from all that I said, then it says something about you as a person not the writer. You didn't answer any of the questions. I guess the dems/libs are above having to explain themselves and their opinions. So you think that an individuals right to marry who they want is more important than an individuals right to excercise their religous freedoms. You don't see one right as equal to the other. You are not taking away the right of a gay person. The gay person can have a wedding without a cake. They can go get a cake somewhere else. What you are doing is taking the right away from the business owner to operate the business the way they want to. In any other situation no one would be able to go into a personal owned business and tell the business owner how to operate. So you are not treating the gay person as an equal person to the straight person. YOU ARE ACTUALLY THE PEOPLE WHO ARE DISCRIMINATING. YET I HAVE TO SAY NOTHING MORE THEN YOU MIGHT HAVE PUBLICLY BEATEN PEOPLE DOWN BUT WHEN PEOPLE WHEN IT THE BOOTH PEOPLE VOTED FOR TRUMP AND GAVE DEMOCRATS AND THEIR FAKE TOLERANCE THE MIDDLE FINGER. AND AFTER DEALING WITH ALL THE DEMOCRATS/LIBERALS AND THEIR HATEFULNESS/HYPOCRISY HERE ON CAFEMOM I WILL NEVER VOTE DEMOCRAT AGAIN !

Quoting SommelierMom: Thanks for the elaborate way of saying you don't believe gays should be treated as equals to straight people.

Quoting Jaysgal426:

What I wonder is why try to drive people who have a differing viewpoint from you from into going broke? It's easy for people who don't believe in a religion or stereotype all the people within that religion as hypocrites, to easily dismiss tenants of that religion. There are some people who just go to church on Easter and Christmas and really don't contemplate much what their faith really means to them. Then there are Christians who face extreme hardships and sacrifices to actually live feasibly within the realm of what the bible says it means to be Christians. They tithe 10% of their income. They follow what the bible says about how to conduct their marriage and raise their kids. They are at church every Sunday and Wednesday. They do community service through their church. They serve in missions through their church. I doubt anybody comes to the decision to do something that is an extreme threat to their livelihood without an extreme amount of soul searching. If you don't believe in their religion or the fact that they will go to hell if they don't follow their religion, then how can you judge their choices? What right do others who without owning it, have a right to tell other adults which tenants of their religion to follow and which tenants they should forget about?

Discrimination laws were put in place because their were certain white people that didn't like black people or thought that they were better then black people. White schools had better resources and better funding. Their was only one public bus going in one direction and the elderly black women had to stand when there were empty seats on the front of the bus. These discriminations laws were put into place because it was causing true hardships for black people.  For the small handful of fundamental Chrisitans who do not support gay marriage, it isn't because they feel they are better then gay people or they don't like gay people. What they are saying is my religous laws don't support your union. We don't know if this is something that falls in line with God laws that I live by and I'm not taking a chance on an eternity in hell.

I don't understand why the left/democrats can't see the huge difference between what I'm describing. For gay people, there is an option of going to a different bakery and getting a cake made there. It is not the only bus in town going in the direction they need to be going. It's not an essential service. They are not being denied the right to a better education and better future by getting their caked baked. I don't understand why the left/democrats can't show the same respect to people to excercise their religous freedoms as they please as they show to gay people to allow them to marry who they want. Why do you think that one deserves more respect then the other?

I have gay friends and support gay marriage. However I don't understand why the left/democratscan't see that two very intelligent educated and moral groups of people can come to a very different decision on the same issue for very different but valid reasons? When did this all of the sudden become so frightening to people? Why can't people today live and let live?

This is not what was promised to the public either when gay marriage was being sold to people. It was being sold as live and let live. I believe the exact idea was that the majority of people should now not be able to tell the minority of adults how to live their live. However now very religous conservatives are the minority and this is exactly what is being done. 

Democrats/the left have become the new lynch mob of this time period. First the argument of the opponent is being censored, by trying to by slandering anybody's reputation who dosen't agree with exactly with every word you say as ignorant, racist and homeophobic.The left tries to claim they are trying to educate people, but it's quite the opposite you really are trying indoctrination. Why do I need to be educated if I don't think about something the way you do?   If that not dare scare then away then you go after their livelihoods. At the other bakery people not only went after the bakery, they went after other customers who patronized the bakery. They harassed the bakerys other customers legally. 

Quoting BluesPagan2.0: Where in there did I say I support discrimination?



This is the issue in this group. One extreme and never a moderate point of view.


If I lived there I wouldn�t support that store. I think it�s theirbright to be bigoted asshats. It is also my right to not support them or their business.


Honestly, cases like this only furthers he divide. Is it any wonder conservatives think liberals want to tell them how to think and what they can and can�t do? Let them be bigots! Then let them wonder why no one supports them and they are going broke. But I guess that takes too much effort.


Quoting SommelierMom: So you support discrimination?

Quoting BluesPagan2.0: Honestly I have no issue with this ruling. No one should be forced to do anything especially in this time. A time when people can easily come together to boycott and protest.


So don�t bake the cake. But don�t complain when people stop hiring you or giving you business of any kind. Don�t complain if your business goes under because you�re an intolerant bigot.

SommelierMom
by Bronze Member on Feb. 13, 2018 at 7:12 AM
She chose not to acknowledge that question when I asked her the same thing.

Quoting D-Town:

If the baker doesn't view it as a marriage then there should be no problems in baking that wedding cake. What if I, as a straight person, wanted a wedding cake to serve at a homeless shelter? What if I wanted a wedding cake to feed to the ducks at the local pond? What if I want to pay 3x more for a cake just because I want a wedding cake? As a straight person, should I be denied a cake because it's not going to be used for a wedding? 

If they don't consider it a marriage, then what difference would it make to bake the wedding cake? 

Quoting Jaysgal426:

Thank you for actually trying to have a conversation without insulting me. I think you are trying to compare apples and oranges though. With the making of a cake, you are asking a very religous person to take their time and effort into supporting the creation of a union that they feel according to their religous texts is not a marriage. (And I know that people who disagree with me just label those people and their values as a basket of delporables whose opinions and values should just be ignored). The baker didn't stop a gay couple coming into their bakery from buying a box of pastries that are already there for one thing. Secondly, it what other businesses do you ask people about the bride and groom? There is no other business where that information would in any other situation affect the business. You don't ask that question when taking a person's grocery order or doing their dry cleaning or even ordering a livery service. Secondly, in those other business scenarios, you are not part of the process of the creation of the union. Once someone is already married doing their dry cleaning or filling their grocery order is going to have no bearing on the marriage.

So no I do not think religous people should be able to say no in every scenario to answer your first question. I don't think gay people should have to move where they are more accepted. Of course this is not the current situation. The gay people with the wedding cake have other choices they can make. You are taking the choice away from te religous person. The religous person is not going into the wedding and trying to stop the wedding officiant from carrying out the ceremony. On the other hand many people on the left are very happy to scare away all the other customers from the bakery business by threatning to slander their reputation of the customers who choose to stick with the business. You take away people's livehood, they can not continue to live their life the way that wanted to live it before.

Quoting msb64:

What about communities where there are no other choices.  I know that this post is about bakeries (our county has only one) but what about other businesses? If just a couple of businesses in our community decided that they would not serve the gay community, those who are gay would no longer be able to functionally live in our community.  Is that okay?  Should people be required to move from their current homes to areas where their sexual orientation is more accepted?

Quoting Jaysgal426:

What I wonder is why try to drive people who have a differing viewpoint from you from into going broke? It's easy for people who don't believe in a religion or stereotype all the people within that religion as hypocrites, to easily dismiss tenants of that religion. There are some people who just go to church on Easter and Christmas and really don't contemplate much what their faith really means to them. Then there are Christians who face extreme hardships and sacrifices to actually live feasibly within the realm of what the bible says it means to be Christians. They tithe 10% of their income. They follow what the bible says about how to conduct their marriage and raise their kids. They are at church every Sunday and Wednesday. They do community service through their church. They serve in missions through their church. I doubt anybody comes to the decision to do something that is an extreme threat to their livelihood without an extreme amount of soul searching. If you don't believe in their religion or the fact that they will go to hell if they don't follow their religion, then how can you judge their choices? What right do others who without owning it, have a right to tell other adults which tenants of their religion to follow and which tenants they should forget about?

Discrimination laws were put in place because their were certain white people that didn't like black people or thought that they were better then black people. White schools had better resources and better funding. Their was only one public bus going in one direction and the elderly black women had to stand when there were empty seats on the front of the bus. These discriminations laws were put into place because it was causing true hardships for black people.  For the small handful of fundamental Chrisitans who do not support gay marriage, it isn't because they feel they are better then gay people or they don't like gay people. What they are saying is my religous laws don't support your union. We don't know if this is something that falls in line with God laws that I live by and I'm not taking a chance on an eternity in hell.

I don't understand why the left/democrats can't see the huge difference between what I'm describing. For gay people, there is an option of going to a different bakery and getting a cake made there. It is not the only bus in town going in the direction they need to be going. It's not an essential service. They are not being denied the right to a better education and better future by getting their caked baked. I don't understand why the left/democrats can't show the same respect to people to excercise their religous freedoms as they please as they show to gay people to allow them to marry who they want. Why do you think that one deserves more respect then the other?

I have gay friends and support gay marriage. However I don't understand why the left/democratscan't see that two very intelligent educated and moral groups of people can come to a very different decision on the same issue for very different but valid reasons? When did this all of the sudden become so frightening to people? Why can't people today live and let live?

This is not what was promised to the public either when gay marriage was being sold to people. It was being sold as live and let live. I believe the exact idea was that the majority of people should now not be able to tell the minority of adults how to live their live. However now very religous conservatives are the minority and this is exactly what is being done. 

Democrats/the left have become the new lynch mob of this time period. First the argument of the opponent is being censored, by trying to by slandering anybody's reputation who dosen't agree with exactly with every word you say as ignorant, racist and homeophobic.The left tries to claim they are trying to educate people, but it's quite the opposite you really are trying indoctrination. Why do I need to be educated if I don't think about something the way you do?   If that not dare scare then away then you go after their livelihoods. At the other bakery people not only went after the bakery, they went after other customers who patronized the bakery. They harassed the bakerys other customers legally. 

Quoting BluesPagan2.0: Where in there did I say I support discrimination?



This is the issue in this group. One extreme and never a moderate point of view.


If I lived there I wouldn’t support that store. I think it’s theirbright to be bigoted asshats. It is also my right to not support them or their business.


Honestly, cases like this only furthers he divide. Is it any wonder conservatives think liberals want to tell them how to think and what they can and can’t do? Let them be bigots! Then let them wonder why no one supports them and they are going broke. But I guess that takes too much effort.


Quoting SommelierMom: So you support discrimination?

Quoting BluesPagan2.0: Honestly I have no issue with this ruling. No one should be forced to do anything especially in this time. A time when people can easily come together to boycott and protest.


So don’t bake the cake. But don’t complain when people stop hiring you or giving you business of any kind. Don’t complain if your business goes under because you’re an intolerant bigot.

MythrylHavoc
by Bronze Member on Feb. 13, 2018 at 8:06 AM
Your last sentence says it all.

Quoting D-Town:

Because, as has already been pointed out, those gays are going to other bakeries. They just aren't following your advice and doing so quietly. Just like every other HUMAN BEING, when they receive subpar service or have a bad experience with a business, they're telling people about it. People boycotting the business, fines being issued and even the lawsuits are CONSEQUENCES of the actions of the business owner. The business owners know, before making the decision to violate the law, what the possible consequences are. 

What you are really saying is that if you're Christian, you should be able to break whatever law you want and not have any consequences for it. 

Quoting Jaysgal426:

What I wonder is why try to drive people who have a differing viewpoint from you from into going broke? It's easy for people who don't believe in a religion or stereotype all the people within that religion as hypocrites, to easily dismiss tenants of that religion. There are some people who just go to church on Easter and Christmas and really don't contemplate much what their faith really means to them. Then there are Christians who face extreme hardships and sacrifices to actually live feasibly within the realm of what the bible says it means to be Christians. They tithe 10% of their income. They follow what the bible says about how to conduct their marriage and raise their kids. They are at church every Sunday and Wednesday. They do community service through their church. They serve in missions through their church. I doubt anybody comes to the decision to do something that is an extreme threat to their livelihood without an extreme amount of soul searching. If you don't believe in their religion or the fact that they will go to hell if they don't follow their religion, then how can you judge their choices? What right do others who without owning it, have a right to tell other adults which tenants of their religion to follow and which tenants they should forget about?

Discrimination laws were put in place because their were certain white people that didn't like black people or thought that they were better then black people. White schools had better resources and better funding. Their was only one public bus going in one direction and the elderly black women had to stand when there were empty seats on the front of the bus. These discriminations laws were put into place because it was causing true hardships for black people.  For the small handful of fundamental Chrisitans who do not support gay marriage, it isn't because they feel they are better then gay people or they don't like gay people. What they are saying is my religous laws don't support your union. We don't know if this is something that falls in line with God laws that I live by and I'm not taking a chance on an eternity in hell.

I don't understand why the left/democrats can't see the huge difference between what I'm describing. For gay people, there is an option of going to a different bakery and getting a cake made there. It is not the only bus in town going in the direction they need to be going. It's not an essential service. They are not being denied the right to a better education and better future by getting their caked baked. I don't understand why the left/democrats can't show the same respect to people to excercise their religous freedoms as they please as they show to gay people to allow them to marry who they want. Why do you think that one deserves more respect then the other?

I have gay friends and support gay marriage. However I don't understand why the left/democratscan't see that two very intelligent educated and moral groups of people can come to a very different decision on the same issue for very different but valid reasons? When did this all of the sudden become so frightening to people? Why can't people today live and let live?

This is not what was promised to the public either when gay marriage was being sold to people. It was being sold as live and let live. I believe the exact idea was that the majority of people should now not be able to tell the minority of adults how to live their live. However now very religous conservatives are the minority and this is exactly what is being done. 

Democrats/the left have become the new lynch mob of this time period. First the argument of the opponent is being censored, by trying to by slandering anybody's reputation who dosen't agree with exactly with every word you say as ignorant, racist and homeophobic.The left tries to claim they are trying to educate people, but it's quite the opposite you really are trying indoctrination. Why do I need to be educated if I don't think about something the way you do?   If that not dare scare then away then you go after their livelihoods. At the other bakery people not only went after the bakery, they went after other customers who patronized the bakery. They harassed the bakerys other customers legally. 

Quoting BluesPagan2.0: Where in there did I say I support discrimination?



This is the issue in this group. One extreme and never a moderate point of view.


If I lived there I wouldn’t support that store. I think it’s theirbright to be bigoted asshats. It is also my right to not support them or their business.


Honestly, cases like this only furthers he divide. Is it any wonder conservatives think liberals want to tell them how to think and what they can and can’t do? Let them be bigots! Then let them wonder why no one supports them and they are going broke. But I guess that takes too much effort.


Quoting SommelierMom: So you support discrimination?

Quoting BluesPagan2.0: Honestly I have no issue with this ruling. No one should be forced to do anything especially in this time. A time when people can easily come together to boycott and protest.


So don’t bake the cake. But don’t complain when people stop hiring you or giving you business of any kind. Don’t complain if your business goes under because you’re an intolerant bigot.

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