The Trinity (Christianity)

  • August 22, 2008 at 7:19 PM by ma2calebzoeyeli
  • 2 Comment(s)
  • 30 Total Views

One of my friends posted a journal on the Trinity and whether it really existed or was just something to make the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit more understandable or palatable, which got me thinking also. Thanks lol.  I had always believed in the Trinity but didn't know why or how to support this belief, so I decided to do some research on my own and I asked my hubby to send me some starting points to work from in my own research (he is away on military duty).  Here is what he sent, in case anyone else is looking at this too.

Jesus does claim to be God.
All four accounts have Him doing so, but John is most ecplicit.  So, John 8:54-59.  Two things happen here:  1.  Jesus says, literally in Greek (verse 58b), "Before Abraham was, I AM."  He uses both the personal pronoun "ego" (I) and the verb "eimi" (I am).  The use of both pronoun and verb is redundant and seldom used because the verb  endings tell what pronoun goes with the verb.  Not a slam dunk, but consider that in all the Greek translations of the OT by Jewish rabbis, they always translate Exodus 3:14b from Hebrew as "ego eimi."  Jesus would have used the Hebrew though when the conversation actually took place, so He would have said "YHWH" (Yahweh).  His answer was, in Hebrew, "Before Abraham was, YHWH."  He claimed to be God.  2.  Why do I come to this conclusion, it seems a bit speculative.  John 8:59, "At this they (the religious leaders) picked up stones to stone Him..."  Jews didn't stone a man who claimed to be doing the will of God they stoned a man for claiming to be God!! 
 
Luke: 5:20-26.  Two thing happen here again.  1.  Jesus claims to be able to forgive a man's sins.  The religious leaders correctly dispute that any but God can forgive sin.  So, Jesus says to them (verse 24), "So that you know that the Son of Man has authority (power) to forgive sins on Earth, (turning to the paralytic He said), Get up and walk."  He didn't dispute that only God could forgive sin, He proved that He was God by physically healing, something that only God could do as well.  He claimed it, and He proved it.  2.  The crowd's reaction is telling.  They had seen remarkable things they said.  What had they seen?  He had healed a host of people in that house before this incident.  They were surprised that He healed the man, they were surprised that He claimed to be God, and PROVED IT!!!!  And there was no lightening strike, no attempt to stone Him (who could argue with His logic)?
 
Matthew 26:59-66.  Two things happen here.  1.  Two claim that Jesus said He could rebuild the temple in three days (wasn't He resurrected on the third day...He was claiming He was the temple...the dwelling place, the house of God)...anyway, and the council asked Him point blank are you the Messiah.  Look at His answer in verse 64.  He mentions He will come on clouds, a reference to Daniel 7:13-14 (more on that later) only notice that it says the one like a son a man approached God and was worshipped by everyone.  God does not share His right to worship with anyone!!!  How do I know it was a reference to Daniel 7, the Jews (to this day) understand the reference as to Messiah and the council convicted Jesus of blasphemy (because He claimed to be this one like a son of man who was considered worthy of worship by the Ancient of Days Himself).  You have to not only look at Jesus words, but how the religious leaders understood His words, as in John 10:33, We are not stoning you for your good works, but because you, being a mere man, CLAIM TO BE GOD!!!  He does not dispute this.  He acknowledges they have correctly understood Him, He claims to be God.   
Now, twice I have referenced passages where Jesus called Himself the Son of Man, which is undisputed reference to Daniel 7.  Why, because the Jews wanted to kill Him when He did so.  They knew He was claiming to be God, not to be merely doing God's will.  You don't kill a man (or want to) because He says He is doing God's will if you are Jew.  You kill Him for boldly claiming to be God.  Notice in Daniel 7 that the Ancient of Days allows the one like a son of man to be worshipped.  God explilcitly commands that none but Him be worshipped.  What gives?  The one like the son of man was God and Jesus said He was that Man. 
 
Now, the gospel accounts are not doctrinal theses, they are histrorical accounts of what happened.  Doctrine comes from the letters, especially Paul's letters.  Remember, Paul was a devout, zealous Jew who believed in the One True God, yet He worshipped Christ as God.  He placed Jesus on equal terms with the Father, repeatedly.  Every letter he wrote begins with something like, Grace and peace to you, from God our Father and from Jesus our Lord (it comes from BOTH)!!!  Only God can grant grace and peace (shalom) which was His very presence.  Paul also says that Jesus was the image, the exact representation of God.  As in Jesus statement in John, if you have seen Me, you have seen the Father.  It doesn't get more explicit than that.  More to come, I have to look up some specific references Paul uses that place Jesus in OT prohpecies.  This is far too complex to answer with a few paragraphs.  The case in compelling.
 
No I do not take dh's word as law.  He is wrong on many things lol and boy do I love it when he is wrong.  However, I do consider his knowledge of the Bible incredible and wanted to pick his brain on it.  Happy Reading!

Tags: trinity, christ, miracles, god, jesus

Comments:

Angie430

Thanks alot :) Now I'm thinking...hmmmm geez

Angie430 Aug. 22, 2008 at 10:54 PM

Aloha...

praying

AlohaWahine Oct. 30, 2008 at 12:14 AM

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